College Football 2011

[SerFelixCulpa]

College football? No. In general? Yes. I think that the culture of Alabama, Mississippi, Arkansas, Georgia, Florida, Virginia, Kentucky and the Carolinas is fairly similar, and more importantly it's similar to each other and similarly different to the rest of the country.

Yes, absolutely. Notre Dame would have a killer time fitting into the SEC. They'd recruit weirdly, they'd get into odd fights, they'd have a much weirder feeling when doing things like tailgating (can you imagine the world's largest outdoor cocktail party with Notre Dame anywhere on the premises?). It's that sort of thing. I don't think he meant that the South == evil because they owned slaves; it's a shorthand for 'the unique and varied culture that brings the Southern States of the US together in a united view.'

It was probably better to say that Missouri was part of the South in the Civil War. That's more of what the divide in culture and feel is, even today.

They may be "similar" but in the overall scheme of things they are far more similar to the midwest (or for that matter most of the rest of the country) now than different -- certainly much more so than was the case 100, 50, and even 25 years ago.

I dispute that Notre Dame would have a hard time fitting into the SEC. Certainly no more so than Vandy does. But let's use other (somewhat less storied) examples: Nebraska? Oklahoma? Ohio State? They'd all fit in well enough despite the geographical difference...probably better than LSU or Florida do. And if we were going to talk about the "unique and varied" culture of the South that might be one thing: going the "slave state" route in this context is a bit like trying to make generalizations about German and Austrian soccer teams in Europe with reference to their National Socialist past. Unless you have a very specific factual basis other than "culture" for making the linkage, it's probably just inflammatory. ;)

(I note that lockesnow admits he was trying to be controversial in saying that by the way.)

Finally, while Missouri was a slave state, it was not part of the South in the Civil War and didn't secede. (Yes there was a lot of infighting and internal conflict, but it stayed firmly in the Union sort of like Maryland and West Virginia. Not to quibble too much.) ;)

[SerFelixCulpa]

Every teacher thereafter I had, was always careful to couch the cause of the civil war as slavery, but that some people prefer to refer to the cause as states' rights (to have legal slavery). ;) and it was okay if we referred to either as the cause in class.

Except anyone being honest with themselves has to admit the Civil War was in fact about slavery. Anyone saying otherwise is trying to peddle an agenda that, weirdly, isn't very popular with anyone outside the geographic South or minorities that had a distinctly rough time both before and after thw war. ;)

[Rhom]

Football starts tonight for me!

First off is the 6:00 entry. In the only game I'll get to see all year, my alma mater Murray State is the sacrificial lamb for Charlie Strong's second year at UofL.

Later that night at 9:15, Kentucky plays Western Kentucky in Nashville.

I'm ready to get this thing started!

[Ferrum Aeternum]

Tonight I'll do something I almost never do - root for Memphis (only because they're playing Mississippi State). Not in person at the Liberty Bowl, cause I don't want to get shot, stabbed or maimed in the parking lot, but from the friendly confines of my living room. Utterly hopeless cause since Memphis may be the worst team in the FBS, but hey, who cares! FOOTBALL!!!

Oh, and attending Ole Miss/BYU in Oxford Saturday. I don't really expect us to win the game as BYU has loads of experience and a future star at QB, but hoping to at least see some real improvement in effort and intensity. Plus eager to see what some of these young guys can do..

[SerFelixCulpa]

Tonight I'll do something I almost never do - root for Memphis (only because they're playing Mississippi State).

Despite being a member of a very large family, I was one of the very first people in it to go to college and not attend the University of Memphis. (Or as it was called back in the relevant time period, Memphis State University). My uncle was president of their football booster club. Despite becoming a partisan of the University of Alabama, I still have a soft spot for U. Memphis. One of the few times I can root for a non-SEC team in a non-SEC game is when they are playing Memphis. So I'll join your somewhat qualified statement of support. ;)

Also, my Memphis-partisan family members refuse to call it "Mississippi State," instead using the term "Miss-take." ;)

[Kalbear]

\For a fun sidestory, note that Oregon QB Darron Thomas was really close to signing with LSU.

I love that story. Darron Thomas had his heart set on being a QB, and a lot of folks were looking at him as an 'athlete'. He was promised that LSU wouldn't do that, and that they'd let him be QB. He meets Les Miles, and the first thing he says is "Darron, you are one of the most impressive athletes I've ever seen."

Oops.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

Despite being a member of a very large family, I was one of the very first people in it to go to college and not attend the University of Memphis. (Or as it was called back in the relevant time period, Memphis State University). My uncle was president of their football booster club. Despite becoming a partisan of the University of Alabama, I still have a soft spot for U. Memphis. One of the few times I can root for a non-SEC team in a non-SEC game is when they are playing Memphis. So I'll join your somewhat qualified statement of support. ;)

Wait, Memphis has a football booster club? :P

Having lived in/near Memphis for about 4 years now, it intrigues me how the Tiger fanbase as a whole will allow itself to be somewhat excited about football for exactly six weeks of the season...right up until Midnight Madness in mid-October. I remember a few years back, Memphis played in like the 3rd bowl game in it's history on December 20th and sent about 700 fans to St. Petersburg to watch. Meanwhile, FedEx Forum was sold out that night as always to watch the Tigers play Syracuse. Not to toot my own school's horn, but Ole Miss dropping off their schedule is killing the Memphis football program even deader than it already was. They can't count on a sellout every other year anymore. I've heard ticket sales for the game tonight are pretty disappointing - MSU just isn't quite the same draw in this town.

Also, my Memphis-partisan family members refuse to call it "Mississippi State," instead using the term "Miss-take." ;)

Heh, my family has many names for MSU, most of which do not bear repeating on this forum!

[Spring Bass]

I'm watching the Utes beat up on Montana State. Offense is pretty meh, defense is doing okay. This doesn't bode well for our game against USC next week. My prediction is that our offense will be positively putrid (hopefully Wynn won't throw a bunch of picks), forcing our defense to play for almost the entire game while being slowly worn out.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

MSU looks pretty good so far, although they're giving up more yards than I'd have guessed to Memphis. Fortunately for them, Memphis defense remains epically atrocious. Bulldogs had 405 yards in the first half (yikes).

[kairparavel]

College Football! Fuck yeah! :cheers:

We almost had a scheduling snafu that would have interfered with our ability to see Oregon on Saturday.

A few clear and precise threats to third parties and we're back on track! Go Ducks!

[Eponine]

Having a hard time being excited about this season for Va Tech. I miss Tyrod already, I really liked him even if he wasn't the greatest player all the time. And our schedule is ridiculous, probably a good thing for a team adjusting to a new QB and new starting RBs (a position where we were fortunately deep), but the prospect of playing East Carolina, Arkansas State and Marshall isn't exactly thrilling. At least we shouldn't have a problem underestimating Appy State this weekend.

About the SEC - I have mixed feelings. I don't think we're going anywhere, I really don't. Part of me thinks we should crawl South on our hands and knees and beg them to let us in. More money, more big name football, exciting games every week... who wouldn't want that? Several aspects of the ACC have been a bit disappointing, perhaps because of our success rather than in spite of it. But most of me thinks that if we joined the SEC, we'd lose our identity and get increasingly disregarded and irrelevant. For one thing, I do believe in conference culture, and it's something I'm sorry is disappearing as conferences grab up teams. And despite being in Virginia, Va Tech is not a Southern school. Appalachian, yes. Mid-Atlantic, yes. Not Southern. We don't have SEC rivalries and we only care about SEC football because it's big and exciting. I think it would be hard for us to not be outsiders indefinitely - I just can't see us being mentioned together with Alabama, Auburn, LSU - not because of football talent, we've been competitive against them before, but we just aren't an SEC school.

Considering that not only do we have a boring schedule, but because of our boring schedule, a lot of our games aren't even on TV this season, considering becoming a one season PAC-12 follower. I don't expect to be back in Blacksburg at all this fall. I'd like to go see Oregon (who I like) and Ohio State (who I hate), and Boulder is only 90 minutes away :) ETA: I am going to the alumni association on Saturday though!

[lokisnow]

fwiw, on ESPNs podcast they were saying the SEC schools & commissioner have more or less taken all ACC teams off the table because they don't want to be raiders, and they don't want to hurt the ACC and they don't want the rivalries in conference, they don't want to wreck a lot of good relationships.

Missouri is the best, easiest fit for them, West Virginia is maybe the most appropriate fit to the football culture, and WV would add one team to each division, meaning no divisional reshuffling/squabbling.

[S John]

I have mixed feelings about the prospect of WVU to the SEC. First, Morgantown is way up by the Pennsylvania line, the nearest SEC schools would be Tennessee and Kentucky, with neither being particularly close. Second, a lot of WVU fans seem to think that SEC money and exposure will automatically equal SEC recruits. I think that will be true to an extent, but I'm skeptical that it will be enough to roll with the big dogs of the SEC. WVU does a lot of recruiting in SEC country as it is and has built a reputation on finding good players who were maybe overlooked by the teams in their own backyard. Pat White being a prime example - another guy LSU wanted as an athlete but went to WVU to play QB.

Anyway, my thought is that being in the SEC has not automatically elevated the programs at Kentucky or Vanderbilt. It has taken 15 years for South Carolina to start looking competitive. And you think teams like Tennessee aren't trying to win year in and year out? Sure, I think that if we stepped into the SEC east this year, I think we'd maybe have a shot at competing for the East. But most years that is going to be Florida, or Tennessee, or Georgia. I just don't see WVU taking the east regularly, which means we probably won't see too many BCS games.

The upside is that every single game would be of interest. And even also-ran bowls for SEC teams = a pretty damn good bowl. Obviously, in today's college football culture if the SEC came knocking a team like WVU would have to be nuts to not take them up on the offer. The SEC is about as stable of a home as you can hope for. But I do have reservations about it, should the SEC look to taking WVU. Which at this point, I do agree with lockesnow that the most likely candidates for #14 must be WVU and Missouri. They are the only two teams that fit in with SEC-type culture that also expand their footprint and don't interfere with the ACC. (unless maybe they can get Oklahoma)

As far as VT goes, I'd heard rumors that they were an option as well. And maybe they are, but I have a hard time believing that they would jump conferences again after the big stink they made to get into the ACC in the first place. And perhaps, more practically, they're running shit on the football side in the ACC. The ACC seems stable enough, I think they'd be crazy to trade in their easy path to the BCS in a scenario where their current conference is not on the verge of crumbing. Alternatively, West Virginia and Missouri are both a part of conferences that seem quite a bit more ripe for raiding and more likely to take the risk of perennial beatings in the SEC if only to ensure that they're in a competitive conference in the future.

[Rhom]

UK looked more horrible than usual.

Murray State has a gawd awful yellow M logo on a yellow helmet.

It really could not have been much worse for me last night.

[S John]

It really could not have been much worse for me last night.

Well, at least they won!

[adamsputnik]

Bloody oath, Kentucky were beyond shit last night. Barely 100 total yards against a (not very good) Sun Belt conference team. I think those Wildcat fans will be waiting for basketball season with bated breath.

Can't wait for tomorrow night and the Dawgs-Broncos, should be an interesting game.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

Well, at least they won!

This. It could certainly have been worse.

[lokisnow]

it's funny, if TCU hadn't aligned with the Big East last year I would say they are far and away the best choice to go to the SEC with A&M.

[Rhom]

it's funny, if TCU hadn't aligned with the Big East last year I would say they are far and away the best choice to go to the SEC with A&M.

Or help the Big 12 plug the holes in the dike.

[lokisnow]

nah, Texas is vetoing TCU entering the Big 12.

And Oklahoma doesn't want to go to the SEC at all, they want the Pac12 (which Texas isn't really keen on) or the Big10.