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Did Cersei murder Melara?


Jamie Lannister

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Ah, no I agree that referring to death as she doesn't necessarily mean it's Cersei. I mean I do believe that she's referring to Cersei here, but not because of the use of she. It's strange though, because I seem to remember The Stranger ("Death") is supposed to be male - but maybe that's just my own preconceptions playing in!

Theoretically, the Stranger is genderless, Neither "male nor female"-so the Seven come out as three male forms, three female and one genderless.

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Ah, no I agree that referring to death as she doesn't necessarily mean it's Cersei. I mean I do believe that she's referring to Cersei here, but not because of the use of she. It's strange though, because I seem to remember The Stranger ("Death") is supposed to be male - but maybe that's just my own preconceptions playing in!

Stranger isn't death, anymore than the Father is justice, or the Smith labor. The god and the concept are not the same thing. The most probable explanation of the use of the feminine for death when personified is part of the linguistic particularities he invents to add spice.

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Theoretically, the Stranger is genderless, Neither "male nor female"-so the Seven come out as three male forms, three female and one genderless.

But it doesn't have to be the Faith maggi worships.

Remember, "her husband had brought her back from the east with a load of spices"

She could be from Essos for all we know.

Thus what Maggi is using for "death" is a complete unknown.

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Stranger isn't death, anymore than the Father is justice, or the Smith labor. The god and the concept are not the same thing. The most probable explanation of the use of the feminine for death when personified is part of the linguistic particularities he invents to add spice.

Well the gods probably aren't real (GRRM is vague on the subject), and there's also the fact that the seven gods are really one god with seven aspects if you ask the Septons, but they're probably still not real, as in tangible, conscious beings. That's a discussion for another thread though.

It's a good point that Maggy is likely not referring to the Stranger, anyway, not being from Westeros.

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"Death" as a concept is very different from "your death". Death is everywhere. Trying to explain "your death is here tonight" in terms of death generally in this context sounds like someone's manufacturing excuses for Cersei.

Geez, Occam's Razor people. Cersei murdered Melara. End of the story.

Agreed on both counts.

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I don't get what the bolded really is.

Does that mean if there's nothing to really contradict it, its okay to assume its true?

It means that if you agree it's heavily implied that Cersei pushed Melara down the well, then she most likely did.

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  • 4 weeks later...

People should realize that GRRM will not say some stuff plain straight. This is one of them. Just like Dunk was not knighted as he claimed and Maynard Plumm was a glamour of Bloodraven, Cersei killed Melara. Oh and Varamyr skinchanged into a dog and killed his brother when he was 6.


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She did kill Melara. People cannot really believe she happened to coincidentally "fall" in the well right after telling Cersei the prophecy would be meaningless as long as they never spoke about it to anyone...and that coincidentally Maggie mentions death as a female being in the tent with her...and then even more coincidentally Cersei sees the dripping wet Melara on her walk of shame...how many dots are needed, LOL.


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why should it be frowned upon to post in an old thread?

It shouldn't be. This is the only place I visit regularly that allows it though. I think it's insane that people complain about resurrecting old threads. It makes sense in the computer industry where pulling up something from the initial release of a game may lead to misinformation or some such, but the simple act of resurrecting a thread 3 months old gets lambasted in some forums.

So, I wasn't being snarky, I genuinely appreciate that it is fully supported here.

See how I am answering you ten months later?

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