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[Book Spoilers] EP 209 Discussion


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Quoting myself:

"He could very well just pretend to be nice to her just like Cersei did. It's only normal to take a minimum amount of risks by trusting almost nobody when you're in the enemy's nest."

"You do that realise that ,kind or not, he's still her family's enemy ? Robb's enemy should the North's forces arrive at King's Landing gate. Is it surprising that she would wish for his death then? Tyrion' loyalty goes to the Lannisters, to Joffrey , even if he hates him."

"And she knows that". about Tyrion's reasons having to do with Jaime, go check yourself.

So no , I didn't say: "Sansa knew Tyrion was manipulating her and thus condemned him to death in battle, and you then said she couldn't know what he was thinking.". No self contradiction her, you just can't read correctly or don't bother trying.

you admit that BlueQueen's theory is an interesting possibility, again contradicting yourself.

Did I say I believed it? I said it was interesting. Maybe you need a dictionary too. I hadn't thought of it, and obviously neither had you, and I may watch the scene again and be more careful of the actors' attitude to see if it's so.

Ithink you are both overlooking the fact that Sansa believes the songs are reality. Her perfect knight would be Ser Loras and Tyrion in her mind is a monster.
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is it weird that I'm currently watching this epsiode for the 4th time? My girlfriend just walked into the living room, looked at the tv, and gave me a look like shes worried about me. Also she heard me humming "rains of castamere" in grocery store today and rolled her eyes... I'm not a fan boy, but i guess now.. i kind of am?

I've been humming Rains of Castamere the whole day..

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I loved this episode!

In the Books, I found the battle of the Blackwater to be somewhat anticlimatic, so I wasn't really expecting much from this episode, but in the end I liked it more then in the books, even with the budget restrictions and all that.

The tension, the acting, all was great...

And the amount of foreshadowing was too damn high!

I am a purist and I don't usually apreciate changes or aditions, but I expecially liked the scene between Bronn and Sandor in this episode. And it was written by GRRM himself, so it's "cannonical" in a way. :)

One change that I didn't understand howewer: Why didn't Varys tell Tyrion about how he was cut? He did it in the books.

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One change that I didn't understand howewer: Why didn't Varys tell Tyrion about how he was cut? He did it in the books.

To give us a nice little talk between them in the season to come :D Also, Pod was in the room with him.

He was tearing up as well, just remembering about it. And here I was thinking that him being a eunuch was all just a big lie... :/ Oh well! Maybe it was an act and I can still hope :D

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It's not television, it's HBO!

No, let me paraphrase: "It's not a TV show, it's Game of Thrones!"

Where should I start... that was an amazing episode.

All the tension that has been piling up, showing... no, letting us feel the fear and the misery.

And then... THE explosion. That belongs in the cinema, on the big screen.

Every freakin' scene was awesome - Tyrion, Sansa, Cersei, Bronn, The Hound, Davos, Varys, Joffrey and Stannis... oh, Stannis. His face, his determination, him swinging his sword. I was like: He's awesome!!! And at the end:"Stand and fight! Stand and fight damn you!", I felt like I was going to cry.

I loved the contrast between the two kings. The one is still a boy, escaping the battle while his men still need him and the other is an experienced military leader, whose men escape, when he needs them.

The little hints of Varys were also great:

- the story about how he has been cut - I see that could be of importance.

- his line about the bells and the wedding - nice foreshadowing there.

I loved how Sansa tried to trick Joffrey into fighting in the front lines.

But the nicest touch for me was how the explosion showed everyone's true face. While Joffrey and the pyromancer were facinated and Bronn didn't show much emotions, Tyrion and the Hound had those "What have we done"-looks and it was just great.

And just when I thought the final scene couldn't be more perfect, I hear the "Rains of Castamere" and that has blown my mind!

And the writing ... what can I say. Not just that it was GRRM himself, but that episode had amazing dialogs. The great lines were so many. I can't help it and will post the highlights that come on the top of my head:

“-Poor nose.

-Don’t feel sorry for him. He will be half way up your ass before the night is through.”

“You’re just like me, only smaller”

“-I’m not escaping. As strange as it sounds I’m the captain of the ship and if the ship goes down I go down with it.

-That is good to hear. Though I’m sure many captains say the same while their ship is a float."

“-Do you know how to use that?

-Chopped wood once… No, I watched my brother chopping wood.

-I saw you kill a man with a shield. You’ll be unstoppable with an axe.”

“-I will pray for your safe return, milord.

-Will you?

-Just as I pray for the king’s.”

“-If I tell the Hound to cut you in half, he’ll do it without a second thought.

-That would make me the Quarterman. Just doesn’t have the same ring to it.”

“-We are too far from the gates. Their fire, their archers… hundreds will die.


“-Your father doesn’t believe in the Gods?

-He believes in them. He just doesn’t like them very much.”

“If any man dies with a clean sword, I’ll rape his fucking corpse.”

“Those are brave men, knocking on our door. Let’s go kill them!”

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Hey guys, first time poster here.

I just was so blown away by the last episode. Unreal television.

I really don't even know where to begin.

I haven't read the books yet, I sort of got into game of Thrones late and I watched the entire first season about a month ago in a few days and now I am watching them episode to episode.

However there is no way I am going to wait around for episodes after the season 2 finale so I will be reading the books after episode 10.

Where a bouts does it leave off? I read that season 3 will start somewhere in the middle of the 3rd book.

Welcome, Hellas! You picked a great topic for your first post. Hope you keep posting. :)

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Showing Stannis on the front lines adds to the contrast between Joff that had already been set up by Sansa, when she asks Joff if he will lead the van, like her brother does. It's a stab at Joff. Then we see Stannis on the front lines and Joff running off to hide. It may not be in the exact character of Stannis, but it really highlights Joff's character.

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Overall, awesome, but there are nitpicks. Even If GRRM did write it. I would think time constraints reduced the SanSan scene. But so many SanSan scenes have been reduced that I wonder if he has had a change of heart over what he originally wrote.

Time constraints? I could have used less Cersei monologue. I thought she would never shut up. They'll probably submit that episode for her Emmy. blecch.

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Can someone tell me what the hell the Bronn/The Hound scene amounted to? Pretty dull and pointless if you ask me. Yeah, they're both interesting characters, but their meeting just fell flat.

The whole opening sequence was how different people prepare for battle. The theme of the episode was what Bronn has been telling Tyrion for weeks. Plans and tactics and gimmicks are nice, but battles are won by men who are willing to fight and die. Period.So what was Bronn doing? Raising morale.

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Everyone's noting the possible foreshadowing by GRRM with Cersei's repeated mention of Sansa being the future queen. Also note that she always said it as "IF you will be queen". Of course, the realization is not as exciting if you've read the books already.

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@aquariumdrinker and @starkward above:

Excellent! As big a fan as I am of the SanSan motif, I never once noticed the cloak thing. I was so disappointed that the heart of their scene was just cut out.

@ marjie eilie myatt:

I'm with you, basically as I said above. I canNOT believe they let Cercei have all that (did I use pointless in reference to the time? I meant to!) time and stole the SanSan moment away!

Grumble, grumble, grumble . . . Then, moving on from that, the rest of the episode, and I mean all the rest, was indescribably and earthshakingly a m a z i n g.

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Can't get the "quote" function to work on my daughter's iPad, either, but @ Bastard of Bolton above, I was thinking the same thing. And the one truly great Cercei scene in the episode (maybe even the series) is sitting beside Tommen on the Iron Throne telling him the story of the little lion cub. Just saying.

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I think this episode pissed me off more than any other so far. If HBO weren't the cheap a$$es that they are, EVERY episode could be as good as this one. It......was.....PERFECT!

I really hope that going forward, they add more of the action. It is SO much more enjoyable than them trying to distract me with topless woman.

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Best show of the season. Bronn in battle (first saving the Hound, then killing dudes) was badass. Joffrey is a bitch, so all is well. I liked Cersei and Tommen in the throne room, and Tywin's entrance. Stannnis didn't get very far did he? He took that one section of the rampart and pretty much stayed there. Anyone think Shae may not betray Tyrion?

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Cersei with Tommen on the Iron Throne was really heartbreaking. It was the best scene of the episode and probably the season. Lena Headey has always been by favorite actor on the show. It was almost as sad as when she confronted Tyrion about the death of their mother. She truly deserves some sort of recognition, an Emmy nomination at least, for her work this season. I can't wait to find a transcript for the scene. The episode isn't up on HBO On Demand yet.

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In my opinion, this was the best episode of the season - even without Theon, whose arc has been outstanding this year.

I loved the battle scenes and the moments before and in between. The bit between Tyrion, Lancel, the (silent) Hound and Joffrey where the conversation was going round and round without getting anywhere. The old pyromancer (yay, Roy Dotrice!)'s glee at finally being able to use the Wildfire again. Tyrion's simultaneous awe and horror at the results of that Wildfire usage. The gorgeous shot of Bronn setting it off with bow and arrow. Sansa's sweet but catty 'prayers' for Joffrey and Tyrion; especially her reminding Joffrey (who is trying but failing to humiliate her again) how her 'pretender' brother always leads from the front. Ilyn Payne's stare - forget the Hound, this guy is scary! Cersei getting more and more drunk; and her touching and horrifying scene at the end with Tommen on the Iron Throne about to kill her child before the expected enemies can crash through and put him to the sword. And Berserker Stannis - I don't remember if it was true to the book, but his insistence in leading from the front reminded me how single-minded Stannis can be; I loved it when his men had to drag him kicking and screaming from the battle when it was lost. And the arrival of Tywin and the Lannister/Tyrell cavalry. No one, I am now convinced, rides a white horse like Charles Dance as Tywin. Amazing! Tyrion emulating an angry hobbit and striking his foe in the lower leg, not to mention Tyrion the whole darned time. I'm a book purist, but I don't mind at all if they have him keep his nose; Peter Dinklage is too good-looking to mutilate onscreen.

I'll save my nitpicks for the appropriate thread; but I was very pleased with the episode, it was tense, action-packed and yet held some great character moments. And thank the Seven there were no interruptions by Daenerys whining about her dragons. (I do hope we see all three of them next week, though)

Edited by Raksha the Demon
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