[TV/Book Spoilers] TWOP Unsullied Thread Part 3

[iheartseverus]

Ha, do these folks ever forget anything?

Varys definitely knows about the dragons. He told Tyrion about the dragons when they were talking on the parapets before the battle of Blackwater. Varys said, Once she arrives with dragons, nothing will stop her. (I think this was a reference to Tyrion's wildfire defense. A wildfire defense wouldn't stop dragons, fire cannot kill a dragon, and improper use of wildfire would lay low most of the city that was trying to use it as a weapon.) And Tyrion said, One war at a time, or We must fight the war we're in, or something like that. Varys and Tyrion both know the dragons are coming, but Tyrion doesn't care for the moment b/c there's a lot of other s**t going on with the Game right in front of him. Varys is much more about the long-term and he's already pretty worried about Dany's dragons on the horizon.

[PatrickStormborn]

Well the last bit is arguably true. I kind of think that myself, only what Varys thinks is best for the realm is a targaryen (or possibly a Blackfyre) on the throne.

I don't think it's arguable at all. If Varys cared for the realm, he would have helped prevent war and conflict no matter who was on the throne. Instead, he allows the realm to bleed so that Aegon will find it easier to take the throne.

[ebevan91]

Ha, do these folks ever forget anything?

One of them mentioned some of the hill tribes' names and I was like how the what the FUCK?

[protar]

I don't think it's arguable at all. If Varys cared for the realm, he would have helped prevent war and conflict no matter who was on the throne. Instead, he allows the realm to bleed so that Aegon will find it easier to take the throne.

Well it is. Imo Varys wants what's best for the realm rather than what's best for him, it's just that what is actually good for the realm isn't always what Varys thinks. That's still better than most players of the Game.

[iheartseverus]

HAHA, this is actually pretty hilarious!!

Tywin is dealing with what looks like extremely mundane food/supplies/resource allocation duties, maybe that's what Tyrion's job will end up being? Maester of ....whatever the Seven Kingdoms would call resource management or operations.

Oh no. I'm afraid the term is, Quartermaster. And...here comes the next joke made at Tyrion's expense by his family and their flunkies.

[1234567]

The ramifications of more Tyrion whitewashing:

Tyrion actually tried to argue that the message should be taken seriously, but his sister poo-pooed the ideas and accused him of belief in grumpkins and snarks.

As opposed to the books where Tyrion refuses to take it seriously.

[The Anti-Targ]

That implied she was more important to him than just some tavern wench, and even after they loved each other deeply, he would STILL never tell her... so I am thinking this is probably the source of much of her continued angst. Although, admittedly, she doesn't ever say that specifically. But I could see that eating away at her... bothered that he NEVER trusts her with that information for who knows what reason.

I really want Cat to tell of the one time Ned got really angry at her, by asking about Asharya Dayne as the rumoured mother to Jon. That will put the cat among those pigeons. But to get some context they will need Jojen to relate the story of the ToJ and how Ned killed one of the greatest ever Kingsguard, ser Arthur Dayne, and met his sister, Asharya when he returned dawn to the family. And then tell of Asharya's suicide.

But somehow I think the show is going to cut out that entire bit of history, because it seems the show is intent on eliminating almost all history not directly related to the Targs.

[The Anti-Targ]

The ramifications of more Tyrion whitewashing:

As opposed to the books where Tyrion refuses to take it seriously.

Yes, Tyrion handles it much more shrewdly in the book. But then, he only got to do that because Thorne actually turned up in KL when Tyrion was HotK and was giving audience to the people.

[Arkash]

Wow, never thought of Varys being a warg... I really doubt it, but it's not that far-fetched !

[iheartseverus]

I really want Cat to tell of the one time Ned got really angry at her, by asking about Asharya Dayne as the rumoured mother to Jon. That will put the cat among those pigeons. But to get some context they will need Jojen to relate the story of the ToJ and how Ned killed one of the greatest ever Kingsguard, ser Arthur Dayne, and met his sister, Asharya when he returned dawn to the family. And then tell of Asharya's suicide.

But somehow I think the show is going to cut out that entire bit of history, because it seems the show is intent on eliminating almost all history not directly related to the Targs.

Yes, the inclusion of Ashara's story would bring the Unsullied up to speed with all the rest of us in the 'Who Is Jon Snow's Mother' sweepstakes. It occurs to me that if, in fact, Ashara WAS Jon Snow's mother, the show is going to have to deal with the whole ToJ, Ashara suicide. We shall see !!

ETA: The more I think about it, the more important it seems to me that the show either deal with, or skip entirely, the ToJ-Arthur Dayne's death-Ashara suicide issue. If it IS included in the show, it still doesn't definitively give us the answer as to Jon Snow's mother. But, if its not dealt with in the show at all, well, I think that rules out Ashara as Jon's mother, altogether.

[The Anti-Targ]

Yes, the inclusion of Ashara's story would bring the Unsullied up to speed with all the rest of us in the 'Who Is Jon Snow's Mother' sweepstakes. It occurs to me that if, in fact, Ashara WAS Jon Snow's mother, the show is going to have to deal with the whole ToJ, Ashara suicide. We shall see !!

ETA: The more I think about it, the more important it seems to me that the show either deal with, or skip entirely, the ToJ-Arthur Dayne's death-Ashara suicide issue. If it IS included in the show, it still doesn't definitively give us the answer as to Jon Snow's mother. But, if its not dealt with in the show at all, well, I think that rules out Ashara as Jon's mother, altogether.

Almost without a doubt. I can't recall whether GRRM said Jon's parentage is significant, or just that we it would be confirmed one day. If Jon's parentage is not significant to the outcome of the story as a whole, or Jon's personal story, then it's possible that N+A=J and the decision is that the show will never confirm who the mother is, leaving people to assume that Ned is the father and who cares who the mother is, his bastardy was merely essential to create tension between Cat and Ned, and to get Jon to the Wall with an angsty-emo chip on his shoulder.

If GRRM has said that Jon's parentage is important, either on a grand scale or the personal scale, then yes, if Ashara is left out then it for sure eliminates her as the possble mother of Jon, which leaves N+W=J, and R+L=J and N+?=J. So that's quite a significant thing in terms of us readers. I imagine if he's A's son then he could, theoretically, be in line to be the wielder of Dawn. Which of course for the show is not at all significant if the whole Dayne family story is left out. Of course with Jojen possibly telling Bran the story of ToJ and Ned's journey south with Dawn they can do it all in words, which is much cheaper, and quicker than showing it as a dream sequence/flashback for Ned.

There is no way (I hope) that Jojen saying that he "saw it" in reference to [most of] the rebellion was a simple throw away line. More must come of this surely as Jojen and Bran travel together.

[iheartseverus]

Anti-Targ: I read in some interview that when GRRM first met with D&D to discuss whether he'd agree to let them do the show, he asked them 'Do you know who Jon Snow's mother is?' And when they answered, he said, in effect--'You do get it, then. Lets' move forward.' Now, was that an apochrophal Hollywood tidbit? Quien sabe, who knows...

Also, back in the day, when the show was just being hinted at, not yet a for-sure thing, Parris (Mrs. GRRM) used to post on this board. Some newbie asked her if R+L=J, and she said (I remember this quite clearly), 'Would George be so obvious?'

All of which leads us... nowhere. Surely, if I can come up with this formula (no ToJ, Arthur, Ashara = no N+A=J) BUT, we must watch, listen for hints, focus, like the Unsullied we all are re this issue. :uhoh:

FUN!

[BLU-RAY]

Anti-Targ: I read in some interview that when GRRM first met with D&D to discuss whether he'd agree to let them do the show, he asked them 'Do you know who Jon Snow's mother is?' And when they answered, he said, in effect--'You do get it, then. Lets' move forward.' Now, was that an apochrophal Hollywood tidbit? Quien sabe, who knows...

They gave that story a few weeks ago when they did an audio interview with Andy Greenwald, so unless they're just making it up entirely...

[AzureOwl]

I am eagerly awaiting to see how long it takes them to realize that we were finally told on screen what valar morgulis means.

[Nezzer]

I almost jumped from my sit when I heard Varys saying ROOSE Bolton. Now the Unsullied will not call him Lord Bolton anymore and it will become more personal. I wonder if they are going to link "Roose" to "ruse" and distrust him even more :lol:

[iheartseverus]

Still waiting for the Unsullied to check in after tonight's episode. Someone commented here awhile back that it always takes them some time after the episode to check in--I'm guessing its because many of them probably immediately watch it a second time via HBOGO, the second time taking notes and focusing in.

Anyway, wonder how long it will take them to realize that most probably Tyrion paid the prostitutes on the side to 'service' Pod and then refuse the official purse. Pod, the Sex God, yep. Not. :P

[ebevan91]

They're already predicting that Sansa will end up with Littlefinger and Lysa at the Eyrie. It was kinda surprising in the book but it's like they're writing it in plain English and slapping it on our foreheads on the show.

[wandering]

They're already predicting that Sansa will end up with Littlefinger and Lysa at the Eyrie. It was kinda surprising in the book but it's like they're writing it in plain English and slapping it on our foreheads on the show.

But the QoT hasn't suggested Loras and Sansa as a match yet, they'll fall in love with that idea I reckon.

[iheartseverus]

But the QoT hasn't suggested Loras and Sansa as a match yet, they'll fall in love with that idea I reckon.

Yes, and then, I expect, immediately predict that this good, nice thing will never happen. Its the 'Oh, wait, this is GoT' factor. Looks like something good is coming down the pipe for one of our good characters? Hold your breath a moment, this is about to go very bad.

I think they've got that lesson down pat. :P

[wandering]

Yes but it's another angle for them to consider all the same.