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Jamie Lannister

You little Bastard (book spoilers)

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I liked that he killed his own men. That line was perfect because I don't think non book readers have any clue at this point. (Though I myself would be suspicious of him, I'd think)

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does he kill his own men in the book? It's hard to stay loyal to that kind of person don't you think. Or even play along with him.

He essentially killed Reek the First. He lets him (or, as he says to Theon, made him) ride off to his death knowing full well that Rodrik would probably kill him.

That's the thing though, isn't it? Who's going to argue with your lord's son the psycho torture expert?

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My non-readers, with a little bit of prodding from me, guessed that the boy is the bastard of Bolton. I ofcourse did not confirm or deny.

ETA:

It was a good scene, and a very subtle reveal.

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Possible development: I remember in one of the trailers we saw a scene of Yara walking... somewhere, which means she shows up in at least one scene in the season. They may even want to give the actress something to do. What if Ramsay is actually trying to get Theon's trust so that Yara lets him into Deepwood Motte, and he then betrays them and opens the gates for his own men to take the castle? Big departure from the books I know, but they can't really have a season's worth of Theon getting tortured, and they have to beef up his story somehow. They can somehow re-introduce parts of his Clash of Kings storyline, but in a diferent castle rather than Winterfell.

BTW, in the Unsullied thread pretty much everybody is now convinced that this is the bastard of Bolton.

I saw someone mention on another thread the theory that Ramsay could be using Theon's trust to infiltrate Moat Cailin/Deepwood Motte/wherever Yara is in the near future. I could see it but hope it's not the case - I think we need the full transformation to Reek before the Deepwood Motte infiltration move.

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I'm quite happy with the way this storyline is going. They missed out on Reek last year, so they needed a way for Ramsy to earn Theon's trust and be in Theon's service, so that we can get the full impact of the reversal later on.

It'd be nice if Ramsy had been a bit more reek-like and a bit less of a pretty boy, but I like Iwan Rheon as an actor so I guess the trade off is worth it.

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Yeah i could tell my brother was really starting to like Ramsay after the "winter is coming" line, Boy oh boy how wrong he is.

The "winter is coming" line was perfect, I smiled. I also loved "you little bastard", of course.

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I loved that moment. The line is great foreshadowing, and the expression on Ramsay's face combined with the brutal finality of the man's point-blank execution is enough to give you pause but you can't really bring yourself to care, considering he was a torturor and attempted rapist. They're throwing off just enough hints that something is off for perceptive watchers to pick up on it, even though you really want to believe that Theon's finally found himself a benefactor.

It'd be nice if Ramsy had been a bit more reek-like and a bit less of a pretty boy, but I like Iwan Rheon as an actor so I guess the trade off is worth it.

It's hilariously hypocritical, but something tells me Ramsay would have less immediate fans if in-show he looked less like Iwan Rheon and more like the book's description. :drunk:

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/File:Eeba-ism_RSnow_II.jpg

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I loved hearing the line because it seemed like a nod to book fans to confirm that this is Ramsay. The moment this young guy was randomly sweeping a prisoner's cell in the dungeon of the Dreadfort, I knew he was Ramsay. Would the Bolton's really let some random guy sweep the dungeon? Of course not.

I like that even as a book reader, I have no idea where they are going with this storyline. It gives us something really exciting to look forward to.

Perhaps Ramsay gets Theon far enough to see Yara in a castle and think he is truly saved before he reveals himself and drags Theon back to the Dreadfort. Ramsay likes his victims to think they are free before he destroys every bit of hope they have. Also, giving Ramsay and Theon time together before Theon knows Ramsay's true identity is important because a lot of the things Ramsay used to torture Theon were based on things he learned about Theon's personality while he was Reek. Ramsay hated his pride, among other things, and those are the parts of Theon he worked so hard to obliterate to make Theon into Reek. He has to know what to destroy in Theon to truly break him.

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I think what strikes me so far in the Theon storyline is that uneasy feeling that we're leaving through somebody's nightmare. Does anybody else get that kind of unsettling vibe? Theon's in a strange castle, tortured by complete strangers for reasonshe can't understand,hunted through the woods right when he's expecting rescue, and saved by a slightly creepy pretty boy with no background. It feels slightly surreal and demented.

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I think what strikes me so far in the Theon storyline is that uneasy feeling that we're leaving through somebody's nightmare. Does anybody else get that kind of unsettling vibe? Theon's in a strange castle, tortured by complete strangers for reasonshe can't understand,hunted through the woods right when he's expecting rescue, and saved by a slightly creepy pretty boy with no background. It feels slightly surreal and demented.

It definitely as a surreal feeling to it.

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Possible development: I remember in one of the trailers we saw a scene of Yara walking... somewhere, which means she shows up in at least one scene in the season. They may even want to give the actress something to do. What if Ramsay is actually trying to get Theon's trust so that Yara lets him into Deepwood Motte, and he then betrays them and opens the gates for his own men to take the castle? Big departure from the books I know, but they can't really have a season's worth of Theon getting tortured, and they have to beef up his story somehow. They can somehow re-introduce parts of his Clash of Kings storyline, but in a diferent castle rather than Winterfell.
I think you might be right on the money there. It didn't occur to me, but now that I read it, it seems like the obvious route for them to take.

ETA:

Having said that, I doubt Yara will meet Theon and Ramsay this season. I think if they do take whatever fort/castle her forces are occupying, she will have left to go back to the Iron Isles by then - perhaps upon receiving news of Balon's death.

I just watched the preview for the next ep, you may very well be right about Yara.

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This wasn't something we really got to see in the books, so its great to flesh this out. In addition to Ramsey, we have John Locke, a Bolton Bannerman cutting off Jaime's han because he was irked.

The Boltons are right being established as players for what is to come, and when the turns come from Ramsey and Roose, boy they are going to be hated more than the Lannisters.

The Boltons themselves are far from always being Stark Loyalists historically, but that is not what the TV viewers are thinking right now, heh heh.

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I think what strikes me so far in the Theon storyline is that uneasy feeling that we're leaving through somebody's nightmare. Does anybody else get that kind of unsettling vibe? Theon's in a strange castle, tortured by complete strangers for reasonshe can't understand,hunted through the woods right when he's expecting rescue, and saved by a slightly creepy pretty boy with no background. It feels slightly surreal and demented.

competly agree.Its so eerie this entire story.Poor non book readers are so confused with this story but the pay off will be amazing.

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Oh, I LOVE how they are doing it. You can see Ramsay&undefinedÁs mask cracking a bit. He has much more swagger when he is saving Theon than when he released him. I think this is a hint of future Ramsay. Personally, I have no problems with a physically hot Ramsay. It is a great contrast between him being easy on the eyes and so utterly despicable I mean, I think we are hardwired to see ugly sinister people as evil, so it is not as much of a shock. When they are beautiful but still look psychotic, it is awesome dissonance.

I am getting a little irritated at some of the people on Tumblr crying "EW, SICKOS!" to anyone who finds Ramsay a cool character. Plenty of people love the Joker. There is nothing wrong with liking a fictional character who cannot be redeemed.

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Oh, I LOVE how they are doing it. You can see Ramsay&undefinedÁs mask cracking a bit. He has much more swagger when he is saving Theon than when he released him. I think this is a hint of future Ramsay. Personally, I have no problems with a physically hot Ramsay. It is a great contrast between him being easy on the eyes and so utterly despicable I mean, I think we are hardwired to see ugly sinister people as evil, so it is not as much of a shock. When they are beautiful but still look psychotic, it is awesome dissonance.

I am getting a little irritated at some of the people on Tumblr crying "EW, SICKOS!" to anyone who finds Ramsay a cool character. Plenty of people love the Joker. There is nothing wrong with liking a fictional character who cannot be redeemed.

That swagger gif is doing all the wrong things to me, tbh.

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I would like to say that what they're doing with this character is absolutely brilliant. I know full well from having read the books what Ramsay is like, but the producers/writers are brilliant in that from watching this episode one gets the sense that Ramsay might just have "another side" or might actually be "helping Theon" (or so some people would think). However, I think this stays true to the Ramsay from the books because, just like Theon in the books, viewers will have themselves vexingly questioning Ramsay's place in Theon's story, whether he will again help Theon, even as he fatally tortures him and plays cat and mouse in repulsive ways, similar in aspect to the thought process Theon likely went through time after time in the books.

Writers are showing us early on that Theon does not know what to think of Ramsay, and a few words from this sick individual are enough to console him to the point that Reek becomes fatally attached to this character for survival, because Ramsay disgustingly has him believe he needs him for survival.

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