Crackpot Was Rhaegar mad?

[Florina Laufeyson]

Rhae-man is batty for digging on a girl.

Put him in the cray cray house!

:rolleyes:

[Nictarion]

Did Rhaegar inherit the Targ madness and was just able hide it well better then others in the past. He was obbessed with Three Head Dragon thing and the PTWP. He started a war for a woman to get her pregnant. Viserys has it Dany is some showing traits, but Rhaegar was it possible. Crackpot theory but you never know.

No she's not. And neither was Rhaegar. Arthur Dayne wouldn't have been best friends with a madman. And we hear nothing but good things about Rhaegar from Jon Con, and Barristan.

[ARYa_Nym]

Well you can be mentally ill and do great things. People with bipolar disorder can function in every day society.

You have famous authors/poets who had Depression or were bipolar like Anne Sexton, Sylvia Plath, and Virignia Woolf.

With Rhaegar it's more that he acted within extreme emotions and some of his other actions give me bipolar vibes.

I think he may have had a manic episode when he took Lyanna/crowned her.

Manic Episode

SYMPTOMS A manic episode is characterized by period of time where an elevated, expansive or notably irritable mood is present, lasting for at least one week. These feelings must be sufficiently severe to cause difficulty or impairment in occupational, social, educational or other important functioning and can not be better explained by a mixed episode. Symptoms also can not be the result of substance use or abuse (e.g., alcohol, drugs, medications) or caused by a general medical condition. Three or more of the following symptoms must be present:

• Inflated self-esteem or grandiosity
  
• Decreased need for sleep (e.g., one feels rested after only 3 hours of sleep)
  
• More talkative than usual or pressure to keep talking
  
• Flight of ideas or subjective experience that thoughts are racing
  
• Attention is easily drawn to unimportant or irrelevant items
  
• Increase in goal-directed activity (either socially, at work or school, or sexually) or psychomotor agitation
  
• Excessive involvement in pleasurable activities that have a high potential for painful consequences (e.g., engaging in unrestrained buying sprees, sexual indiscretions, or foolish business investments)
  

http://psychcentral.com/disorders/sx9.htm

Some of these aren't applicable because we don't know everything about his behavior.

[The Black Hawk]

I was thinking about him having a mental problem because I had known someone that was somewhat like Rhaegar very sad guy

[UVA]

A supremely hot teen aged girl who may, or may not, have a magical womb, and you have messianic/übermensch ideologies, wherein lies the madness unless you want to construe Rhaegar as a kind of David Koresh figure.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Some of these aren't applicable because we don't know everything about his behavior.

Having some of the symptoms doesn't mean anything. Anybody can have any or more symptoms in a lifetime and they aren't clinically diagnosed with anything, except of course people who like to tag themselves as "bipolar" or such.

[ARYa_Nym]

Having some of the symptoms doesn't mean anything. Anybody can have any or more symptoms in a lifetime and they aren't clinically diagnosed with anything, except of course people who like to tag themselves as "bipolar" or such.

His actions are more indicative of it I think then running down a checklist of symptoms but we can't know if he completely applies since there is still so little known about him.

[Batman]

He was not very smart, at face value anyway. But mad is a bit of a stretch.

[Twenty of House Goodmen]

Mad in that he was obsessed with a prophecy? Maybe. Mad in that he was obsessed with watching things burn? Nah. There's a chance that he could've developed the so called "Targaryen madness" later on in his life, but we'll never know.

[Barristan the G.O.A.T]

Well you can be mentally ill and do great things. People with bipolar disorder can function in every day society.

You have famous authors/poets who had Depression or were bipolar like Anne Sexton, Sylvia Plath, and Virignia Woolf.

With Rhaegar it's more that he acted within extreme emotions and some of his other actions give me bipolar vibes.

I think he may have had a manic episode when he took Lyanna/crowned her.

http://psychcentral....sorders/sx9.htm

Some of these aren't applicable because we don't know everything about his behavior.

In all actuality, you could essentially diagnose every human in existence with a psychological disorder if you are really looking into it.

[Lion of Judah]

Jamie and Barristan had reasonably close relationships with Rhaegar and while they do admit he was a kindred spirit, they never imply or say he was crazy.

[Ygrain]

Rhaegar DIDN'T start a war. We never hear about Rickard calling banners after Lyanna's abduction, not even after Brandon's imprisonment - instead, he acts as a loyal subject and goes to answer to his liege. Only when Aerys murders Brandon and Rickard and demands that Jon Arryn hands him over the heads of Ned and Robert does the Rebellion break out. Yes, Rhaegar set off the chain of events, but if not for Brandon's rash action and Aerys' mad response, it needn't have come to a war.

- Consider the RL parallel, which probably inspired the story:

John Lackland, King of England, had to set aside his wife for barenness. He abducted Isabela of Angouleme, a famed beauty of a powerful family, betrothed to another (and also aged something like 9-12). NO fighting started - her family went to the king of France (at that time, John's hypothetical sovereign) to get them justice done. Only when John refused an order to return Isabela did the fighting start - but not over Isabela, who became John's wife and mother of his heir, but because the two kings had to settle the issues of sovereignty. John lost but it still didn't change much.

So, no, Rhaegar wasn't mad. He knew that he would cause a shitstorm and probably went into hiding to avoid the situation that broke John's neck (i.e., to avoid disobeying an order of higher authority, because if he cannot be found, Aerys cannot order him anything) as well as repercussions from the Starks and Baratheons, such as being attacked or challenged (because it probably never occured to him that someone might be so idiotic as to try and challenge him if he's not at home). He simply couldn't predict everything. Whether he did what he did for love or prophecy or both, remains yet to be seen.

[Barristan the G.O.A.T]

Rhaegar DIDN'T start a war. We never hear about Rickard calling banners after Lyanna's abduction, not even after Brandon's imprisonment - instead, he acts as a loyal subject and goes to answer to his liege. Only when Aerys murders Brandon and Rickard and demands that Jon Arryn hands him over the heads of Ned and Robert does the Rebellion break out. Yes, Rhaegar set off the chain of events, but if not for Brandon's rash action and Aerys' mad response, it needn't have come to a war.

- Consider the RL parallel, which probably inspired the story:

John Lackland, King of England, had to set aside his wife for barenness. He abducted Isabela of Angouleme, a famed beauty of a powerful family, betrothed to another (and also aged something like 9-12). NO fighting started - her family went to the king of France (at that time, John's hypothetical sovereign) to get them justice done. Only when John refused an order to return Isabela did the fighting start - but not over Isabela, who became John's wife and mother of his heir, but because the two kings had to settle the issues of sovereignty. John lost but it still didn't change much.

So, no, Rhaegar wasn't mad. He knew that he would cause a shitstorm and probably went into hiding to avoid the situation that broke John's neck (i.e., to avoid disobeying an order of higher authority, because if he cannot be found, Aerys cannot order him anything) as well as repercussions from the Starks and Baratheons, such as being attacked or challenged (because it probably never occured to him that someone might be so idiotic as to try and challenge him if he's not at home). He simply couldn't predict everything. Whether he did what he did for love or prophecy or both, remains yet to be seen.

:agree:

[Morienthar]

Apart from having an inflated sense of self,Which also went down a bit after Aegon's birth No,Rheagar wasn't mad.

Viserys was driven mad by circumstances(The Boy saw and survived too much).

Dany may well be on the path insanity,She would have gone insane if Jhogo hadn't found her,Now what will happen is hard to tell.

[Barty]

Rhaegar DIDN'T start a war. We never hear about Rickard calling banners after Lyanna's abduction, not even after Brandon's imprisonment - instead, he acts as a loyal subject and goes to answer to his liege. Only when Aerys murders Brandon and Rickard and demands that Jon Arryn hands him over the heads of Ned and Robert does the Rebellion break out. Yes, Rhaegar set off the chain of events, but if not for Brandon's rash action and Aerys' mad response, it needn't have come to a war.

- Consider the RL parallel, which probably inspired the story:

John Lackland, King of England, had to set aside his wife for barenness. He abducted Isabela of Angouleme, a famed beauty of a powerful family, betrothed to another (and also aged something like 9-12). NO fighting started - her family went to the king of France (at that time, John's hypothetical sovereign) to get them justice done. Only when John refused an order to return Isabela did the fighting start - but not over Isabela, who became John's wife and mother of his heir, but because the two kings had to settle the issues of sovereignty. John lost but it still didn't change much.

So, no, Rhaegar wasn't mad. He knew that he would cause a shitstorm and probably went into hiding to avoid the situation that broke John's neck (i.e., to avoid disobeying an order of higher authority, because if he cannot be found, Aerys cannot order him anything) as well as repercussions from the Starks and Baratheons, such as being attacked or challenged (because it probably never occured to him that someone might be so idiotic as to try and challenge him if he's not at home). He simply couldn't predict everything. Whether he did what he did for love or prophecy or both, remains yet to be seen.

Rhaegar was not directly responsible for the rebellion but he did start of the chain of events. Yes Brandon was rash, but he had every right to be rash when he thinks his sister is being raped. Rhaegar's actions were incredibly stupid and irresponsible and the fact will remain that if not for them the rebellion would never have taken place. While Aerys shares the majority of the blame for the rebellion it cannot be denied that Rhaegar played a huge part as well.As for whether he is mad - I think so. Targ madness takes different forms - the most common being cruelty and obsession with fire but it has been known to take the form of obsession with gods and religion(Baelor the Blessed) as well. Obsession with prophecy and a god complex isn't all that far away from obsession with religion and gods.

[Nictarion]

Dany may well be on the path insanity

Nah, a POV from a insane person would never work. Could you imagine a POV from Ramsay? It would be hard to stomach. Despite what some might say, even Cersei is not technically insane. She is just not a good person. There Is a slight chance Dany could end up being a sympathetic antagonist to some of the other characters (although I don't think this will happen) but she is not going to turn into Aerys ll 2.0, "Dany the mad queen".

[Ser Creighton]

Ephebophile I think. Like Elvis or Roman Polanski.

I think there are a lot of ephebophiles in Westeros. Do you think it was cultural or an actual pure sexual preference? I support this belief by the way. Sansa who was only 13 was being hit on by men at the Vale, wasn't sure if some of it was just creeps creeping or men giving a teenage girl a hard time, probably both. One of course was basically trying to rape her, the others I was not so sure about. It does creep me out when they start getting all worked up over a 13 year old though.

Martin never seems to put it in a good light, but so many feel in Rhaegars case it is ok and make excuses for him. I just don't get it. People get very defensive of the character, over this topic. "Lyanna was mature for her age (she ran away from home and Ned related her to Arya losing her temper, Arya who was like 10)"

Rhaegar is suppose to be mister wonderful, in so many peoples minds. Which I really don't get given his actions. Creeping on an adolescent, running away with a kid, not dealing with his father, not seeming to consider the cause and effect of his actions, letting his mother be abused, letting Aerys run wild. And what sign of remorse does he show for Rickard and Brandon? He goes to war with Ned and Robert at his fathers biding, no reguards for Elia or his children, obsession with a prophecy about the prince and the return of Dragons (not unlike some other Targs). The tower of Joy? Really your in an abandon tower in the middle on nowhere and that's the name you give it? Which reminds me way to send help back to your pregnant whatever she was to him. Honestly I read the guy as a total screwball most of the time.

[Cato.the.Elder]

Nah, a POV from a insane person would never work. Could you imagine a POV from Ramsay? It would be hard to stomach. Despite what some might say, even Cersei is not technically insane. She is just not a good person. There Is a slight chance Dany could end up being a sympathetic antagonist to some of the other characters (although I don't think this will happen) but she is not going to turn into Aerys ll 2.0, "Dany the mad queen".

We have Theon's POV, and he is crearly crazy and damaged beyond repair (but I agree: I don't think Dany is becoming insane)

[Morienthar]

Nah, a POV from a insane person would never work. Could you imagine a POV from Ramsay? It would be hard to stomach. Despite what some might say, even Cersei is not technically insane. She is just not a good person. There Is a slight chance Dany could end up being a sympathetic antagonist to some of the other characters (although I don't think this will happen) but she is not going to turn into Aerys ll 2.0, "Dany the mad queen".

I was thinking more along the lines of Cersei 2.0 not insane but not particularly of sound mind either and with a Dragon to boot.

[Ser Creighton]

Rhaegar DIDN'T start a war. We never hear about Rickard calling banners after Lyanna's abduction, not even after Brandon's imprisonment - instead, he acts as a loyal subject and goes to answer to his liege. Only when Aerys murders Brandon and Rickard and demands that Jon Arryn hands him over the heads of Ned and Robert does the Rebellion break out. Yes, Rhaegar set off the chain of events, but if not for Brandon's rash action and Aerys' mad response, it needn't have come to a war.

- Consider the RL parallel, which probably inspired the story:

John Lackland, King of England, had to set aside his wife for barenness. He abducted Isabela of Angouleme, a famed beauty of a powerful family, betrothed to another (and also aged something like 9-12). NO fighting started - her family went to the king of France (at that time, John's hypothetical sovereign) to get them justice done. Only when John refused an order to return Isabela did the fighting start - but not over Isabela, who became John's wife and mother of his heir, but because the two kings had to settle the issues of sovereignty. John lost but it still didn't change much.

So, no, Rhaegar wasn't mad. He knew that he would cause a shitstorm and probably went into hiding to avoid the situation that broke John's neck (i.e., to avoid disobeying an order of higher authority, because if he cannot be found, Aerys cannot order him anything) as well as repercussions from the Starks and Baratheons, such as being attacked or challenged (because it probably never occured to him that someone might be so idiotic as to try and challenge him if he's not at home). He simply couldn't predict everything. Whether he did what he did for love or prophecy or both, remains yet to be seen.

Always blaming Brandon and his rash actions. What about Rhaegar and his rash actions? He is the catalyst if he does not run off with Lyanna, none of this happens. His sister was abducted, at the very least that is what he was told. If Rhaegar had not run off like a 6 year old, maybe this whole thing gets avoided. Running away from home is not the action of an adult or a sign of maturity. Creeping on 14 year old adolescents when you are a married man is more than a little messed up. The reality is this is on Rhaegar. Aerys was his father not Brandons and we know for a fact he thought his dad was messed up and wanted to depose him, but he didn't did he? No instead he ran away and then when daddy needed him he came running back to do his biding leaving his pregnant teenager in an abandoned watch tower with three guards, and no sign of any medical aid. Nor is it mentioned that he sent any help back to her.

The excuse making for this guy.