Which historical KG would ve beaten Sansa?

[Señor de la Tormenta]

Imagine their king dies, and little psyco joff is next in line. What do you think this men would ve done when this little monster orders them to beat his fiance?

Darry?

Dayne?

Hightower?

Selmy?

Jaime Lannister?

Loras Tyrell?

Balon Swann?

Duncan the tall?

Osmund Kettleblack?

Brienne? (she was sort of in the RWG)

[Sansa_Stark]

Pretty much all of them save Dunk the Hunk imo.

Most of them would object though and try to soften it.

None of them are going to go Boros Blount on her except maybe Osmund.

[Ahura Mazda]

I believe most of them would have refused to beat her for no reason at all.

They are meant to defend the king, but a girl of 11-13 is no harm for a King.
Most of the old guard took pretty seriously their vows, and they have also taken the vow of defending the innocents and weak.
Unless Sansa was going to harm the King, why should they beat her?

Let me quote KoH:

A King may move a man, a father may claim a son, but remember that even when those who move you be Kings, or men of power, your soul is in your keeping alone. When you stand before God, you cannot say, "But I was told by others to do thus." Or that, "Virtue was not convenient at the time." This will not suffice. Remember that.

Some of those in the KG have been true knights, and they would have been true to their vows no matter what.

No, those kind of things could only be done by corrupted and bought men who cared for nothing and lost their heart long ago, for lust of power, money or grief.

[Mladen]

Call me stupid, but I doubt many would do it... I actually think that Martin by Sansa beatings wanted to show us how deprived of any honor those 5 men were, and how low KG sank... Remember that Aerys didn't use his KG against Starks, or any other man as for that matter. And even though they stood silent while Aerys was burning people and raping his wife, I actually believe there was some mutual agreement where Aerys didn't ask of them to do anything dishonorable and they were silent while he used others...

So, perhaps none, or perhaps all. But I am certain Brienne would have never done it...

[Señor de la Tormenta]

I believe most of them would have refused to beat her for no reason at all.

They are meant to defend the king, but a girl of 11-13 is no harm for a King.

Most of the old guard took pretty seriously their vows, and they have also taken the vow of defending the innocents and weak. Unless Sansa was going to harm the King, why should they beat her?

No, those kind of things could only be done by corrupted and bought men who cared for nothing and lost their heart long ago, for lust of power, money or grief.

what harm was doing his wife to Arys? Even so Darry instructed jaime not to do nothing.

[Garlan Marius]

Not Aemon, nor Dunk, nor Jaime, in my opinion.

[Señor de la Tormenta]

Call me stupid, but I doubt many would do it... I actually think that Martin by Sansa beatings wanted to show us how deprived of any honor those 5 men were, and how low KG sank... Remember that Aerys didn't use his KG against Starks, or any other man as for that matter. And even though they stood silent while Aerys was burning people and raping his wife, I actually believe there was some mutual agreement where Aerys didn't ask of them to do anything dishonorable and they were silent while he used others...

So, perhaps none, or perhaps all. But I am certain Brienne would have never done it...

we will never call you stupid mladen!!! I dont think all those five were such scumbags....I mean, we got an Arys Oakhart pov and we know how he felt. And that he is a good guy. Is there such a big difference between him and lets say Darry, Swann or Ser Loras?

[Michael Stark Thenextwolf]

Well we do know that Hightower did pull Jaime aside after the mad king raped his wife and told him that its not his place to judge the king, so I think most of them would have done it.

[Mladen]

we will never call you stupid mladen!!! I dont think all those five were such scumbags....I mean, we got an Arys Oakhart pov and we know how he felt. And that he is a good guy. Is there such a big difference between him and lets say Darry, Swann or Ser Loras?

Thanks, my friend. Oakheart's POV, just like Barristan's should have done, show us how no matter what your position is, you simply have no choice. When Tyrion was answering on Varys' riddle, he got one answer correct. One of the greatest power is power of choice. And we have seen how Arys Oakheart apparently had no choice... But, unlike Joffrey's five who actively participated in his wrongdoings, Aerys' seven was rather left behind. It's not an excuse, and I know how many things there are wrong about that, but Joffrey's KG crossed the line... The difference is maybe small, but in that small difference there is entire gap between how everyone see Aerys' KG and how they see Joffrey's.

Well we do know that Hightower did pull Jaime aside after the mad king raped his wife and told him that its not his place to judge the king, so I think most of them would have done it.

Sorry for nitpicking. That was Jonothor Darry. Hightower pulled him during Stark trials.

[Nyrhex]

Remember that Aerys didn't use his KG against Starks, or any other man as for that matter.

Remember that they all stood there and listend when he raped his wife, or watched while he murdered men without trial and burned those who demanded trail by combat.

The Kingsguard was never knights in shining armor. All men have in them the capacity for evil. Standing still while your king rapes and murders, and reasoning that your vows hold you from doing what is right, can be just the same as following an order from your king to beat up a 12 year old girl.

I would'nt trust a man who is claimed to be honorable and good, not to follow Joffrey's order. I'd trust someone who simply does'nt give a fuck, and does his own thing, like Sandor.

[C0bR]

Most of them would do it. People put too much stock in KG's moral values and intelligence capabilities when most of those guys are just glorified, obedient sellswords with military brains.

Some of them would try to soften the blow.

[Annara Snow]

Remember that they all stood there and listend when he raped his wife, or watched while he murdered men without trial and burned those who demanded trail by combat.

The Kingsguard was never knights in shining armor. All men have in them the capacity for evil. Standing still while your king rapes and murders, and reasoning that your vows hold you from doing what is right, can be just the same as following an order from your king to beat up a 12 year old girl.

Yes. It's not like standing and letting a woman get brutally raped, or letting innocent men be murdered in a gruesome way, is any nobler than beating up a teenage girl.

They were scared of the king and what he could do to them, and they tried to rationalize their inaction. Power resides where people think it resides. The Kingsguard wasn't all that noble, and Jaime got disillusioned with it because of these incidents.

[Ahura Mazda]

what harm was doing his wife to Arys? Even so Darry instructed jaime not to do nothing.

Good counter-argument.

Though I must say that I see a big difference in "doing nothing to defend when your superior harms someone" and "do the deed for him". It's easier to step back in the shadows and say "things go like that, there's nothing I can do about it, I should not interfere, I am not supposed to, if I do something what will happen next to me?", than actively harm someone. We do it each and every day in respect to thousands of problems that affect society.

[Mladen]

Remember that they all stood there and listend when he raped his wife, or watched while he murdered men without trial and burned those who demanded trail by combat.

The Kingsguard was never knights in shining armor. All men have in them the capacity for evil. Standing still while your king rapes and murders, and reasoning that your vows hold you from doing what is right, can be just the same as following an order from your king to beat up a 12 year old girl.

I do remember all of that, and I do not exonerate them of just standing there while Aerys raped Rhaella. I just say that there is a small, and perhaps, in some eyes, no difference what the two sets of KG did. And while I acknowledge that their behavior is not in any way honorable. I just say, that Joffrey's KG actively participated in his crimes, and that is something we can't accuse Aerys' KG.

[Roose The Weddingcrasher]

Let me quote KoH:

Excuse me, what do you mean by KoH? Haven't found in "Abbreviations..."

[Bearson]

They are meant to defend the king, but a girl of 11-13 is no harm for a King.

Most of the old guard took pretty seriously their vows, and they have also taken the vow of defending the innocents and weak.

You sure about that? I don't believe their oaths include defending anyone but the royal household. As for the OP question, I don't believe any of them would disobey their king's orders.

[Danelle]

Imagine their king dies, and little psyco joff is next in line. What do you think this men would ve done when this little monster orders them to beat his fiance?

Darry?

Dayne?

Hightower?

Selmy?

Jaime Lannister?

Loras Tyrell?

Balon Swann?

Duncan the tall?

Osmund Kettleblack?

Brienne? (she was sort of in the RWG)

Difficult to answer with certainty for all of them...

• Darry-I guess that you are referring to Jonothor Darry. We don't know a lot about him. He was one of Aerys' seven and apparently a fine knight. Jaime recalls the following incident

  The day he burned his mace-and-dagger Hand, Jaime and Jon Darry had stood at guard outside her bedchamber whilst the king took his pleasure. "You're hurting me," they had heard Rhaella cry through the oaken door. "You're hurting me." In some queer way, that had been worse than Lord Chelsted's screaming. "We are sworn to protect her as well," Jaime had finally been driven to say. "We are," Darry allowed, "but not from him."

  He seemed to tolerate Rhaella's abuse. Now whether he would have an active in role in the abuse of his Queen to be, that is really hard to say. He is also the one who told Jaime that

  “When you donned that cloak, you promised to obey.”

• Dayne. Well, according to Barristan, Ser Arthur
• Hightower, another fine knight. Follwing the sadistic torture of the Starks, Jaime was obviously shocked. Hightower told him that

  After, Gerold Hightower himself took me aside and said to me, ‘You swore a vow to guard the king, not to judge him.' That was the White Bull, loyal to the end and a better man than me, all agree."

• Selmy. An honest man, who obeyed his King but apparently had certain objections. In his POV he still remembers the deaths of Elia and her children and he wonders whether Robert smiled at the sight of their corpses. Apparently, he wasn't entirely comfortable with the idea of serving Robert. Also he doesn't seem to be a man who enjoys plotting.

  Plots, ploys, whispers, lies, secrets within secrets, and somehow I have become part of them. Perhaps by now he should have grown used to such things. The Red Keep had its secrets too. Even Rhaegar. The Prince of Dragonstone had never trusted him as he had trusted Arthur Dayne.

• Jaime Lannister. It would be ironic for Jaime to kill Aerys for all the terrible things he had done only to have Aerys II on the throne. But I strongly doubt that he would beat Sansa. Most likely he would find a way to disobey Joffrey without offending him.
• Loras Tyrell. It depends. Loras is too young. I believe that he would object.
• Balon Swann. He appears to be more honourable than the rest, I think that he would definately object.
• Duncan the tall. No.
• Osmund Kettleblack. Yes but most likely he would try to complain at first.
• Brienne. Never.

It is really difficult to guess what Aerys' 7 would do in that scenario. They did tolerate Aerys' cruelty but I think that they did it for Rhaegar and I think that it is likely that Rhaegar wanted their support in order to dethrone his father.

[Nictarion]

There's no way Dunk or Brienne would do it. It would be hard for Brienne to refuse an order from Renly though. I'd like to think Barristan wouldn't do it either.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Imagine their king dies, and little psyco joff is next in line. What do you think this men would ve done when this little monster orders them to beat his fiance?

Darry? Hit, but softened

Dayne? Hit, but softened

Hightower? Hit, but softened

Selmy? Hit, but softened

Jaime Lannister? Depends on his age

Loras Tyrell? Probably not

Balon Swann? Hit, but softened

Duncan the tall? Hit Joffrey the little shit

Osmund Kettleblack? Hit, with full force

Brienne? (she was sort of in the RWG) Hit Joffrey the little shit

The old KG were enablers, proven with Rhaella, Lord Rickard, Brandon and countless more. Jaime Lannister of all people was the most moral among them and Loras resembles him.

Duncan already hit a shitty royal for something similar once, and Brienne resembles him.

You sure about that? I don't believe their oaths include defending anyone but the royal household. As for the OP question, I don't believe any of them would disobey their king's orders.

It's in the knightly vows - but the Mountain spoke those as well.

[Señor de la Tormenta]

You sure about that? I don't believe their oaths include defending anyone but the royal household. As for the OP question, I don't believe any of them would disobey their king's orders.

As jaime mocked, they are knights with previous vowes. Even Sandor as Joff sworn sword.