Moments of Foreshadowing v.11

[Lost Melnibonean]

1 hour ago, Isobel Harper said:

Well, the text says "flying fish."  Connecting the imagery to a seahorse, then to a horse is stretching it too thin.

Although I feel far less certain about it, I was also considering the possibility of the "flying fish" representing a Tully.  Perhaps Edmure?  Or Sweetrobin?  The latter has an Arryn (flying falcon) father and a Tully (fish) mother.  Let's say, some sort of Visenya/Ronnel Arynn 2.0 occurs, but SR somehow accidentally getting killed instead riding?

What I meant was I would have been looking for an association between Aurane and Aegon/Illyrio/The Golden Company, rather than using the flying fish as foreshadowing. 

[The Fattest Leech]

Ok, Ok. I'm gonna do it. Don't laugh but this is one I think is yet to come.

I don't think this idea is super new or anything, but I havn't seen it talked about too much myself. I really, really think that Mel will sacrifice herself as the Nissa Nissa portion of the Azor Ahai prophecy. I don't believe that all parts needs to be literal interpretations to the first set of events. Of course, my girl Val (possibly with Morna's assistance) will be there to help Jon in whatever woods witchy way they can... seeing as how they are woods witches and all. Mel is just fanatical enough to sacrifice herself to see her Lord of Light proven. I don't know that Jon will have been Ned-dead, but gone somewhere just far enough that he needs a rebirth.

>The last sacrifice we had for Jon was Qhorin and we get this: "Even when Ghost's teeth closed savagely around the ranger's calf, somehow Qhorin kept his feet. But in that instant, as he twisted, the opening was there. Jon planted and pivoted. The ranger was leaning away, and for an instant it seemed that Jon's slash had not touched him. Then a string of red tears appeared across the big man's throat, bright as a ruby necklace, and the blood gushed out of him, and Qhorin Halfhand fell."

Who wears rubies, especially ruby neckalces??? Melisansbra, er, Melisandre.

And we have this from Mel's Dance POV. Not quite the same, but enough for a possible link: "She was weeping, and her tears were flame. And still she drank it in."

>Now, in Dance, Jon says this about Selyse and what she thinks Mel would have her do. I will admit, this could be foreshadowing for Selyse... but that would actually be telling it straight and not really foreshadowing: "She [Selyse] hates the cold but loves the flames. He had only to look at her to see that. A word from Melisandre, and she would walk into the fire willingly, embrace it like a lover."

But then later in Mel's Dance chapter we have this: "The red priestess shuddered. Blood trickled down her thigh, black and *smoking. The fire was inside her, an agony, an ecstasy, filling her, searing her, transforming her. Shimmers of heat traced patterns on her skin, insistent as a lover's hand."

>At this moment in time... or about an hour from then... who else has the smoking blood thing going on... Jon Snoo: "In the cold night air the wound was *smoking."

[Lost Melnibonean]

1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Ok, Ok. I'm gonna do it. Don't laugh but this is one I think is yet to come.

I don't think this idea is super new or anything, but I havn't seen it talked about too much myself. I really, really think that Mel will sacrifice herself as the Nissa Nissa portion of the Azor Ahai prophecy. I don't believe that all parts needs to be literal interpretations to the first set of events. Of course, my girl Val (possibly with Morna's assistance) will be there to help Jon in whatever woods witchy way they can... seeing as how they are woods witches and all. Mel is just fanatical enough to sacrifice herself to see her Lord of Light proven. I don't know that Jon will have been Ned-dead, but gone somewhere just far enough that he needs a rebirth.

>The last sacrifice we had for Jon was Qhorin and we get this: "Even when Ghost's teeth closed savagely around the ranger's calf, somehow Qhorin kept his feet. But in that instant, as he twisted, the opening was there. Jon planted and pivoted. The ranger was leaning away, and for an instant it seemed that Jon's slash had not touched him. Then a string of red tears appeared across the big man's throat, bright as a ruby necklace, and the blood gushed out of him, and Qhorin Halfhand fell."

Who wears rubies, especially ruby neckalces??? Melisansbra, er, Melisandre.

And we have this from Mel's Dance POV. Not quite the same, but enough for a possible link: "She was weeping, and her tears were flame. And still she drank it in."

>Now, in Dance, Jon says this about Selyse and what she thinks Mel would have her do. I will admit, this could be foreshadowing for Selyse... but that would actually be telling it straight and not really foreshadowing: "She [Selyse] hates the cold but loves the flames. He had only to look at her to see that. A word from Melisandre, and she would walk into the fire willingly, embrace it like a lover."

But then later in Mel's Dance chapter we have this: "The red priestess shuddered. Blood trickled down her thigh, black and *smoking. The fire was inside her, an agony, an ecstasy, filling her, searing her, transforming her. Shimmers of heat traced patterns on her skin, insistent as a lover's hand."

>At this moment in time... or about an hour from then... who else has the smoking blood thing going on... Jon Snoo: "In the cold night air the wound was *smoking."

So you're saying that Melisandre wants Jon to bloody his burning hot sword in her, eh? 

[The Fattest Leech]

2 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

So you're saying that Melisandre wants Jon to bloody his burning hot sword in her, eh? 

Or, she wants Jon to temper his light bringer in her smoking gash.   

 

Banana, banana. 

[chrisdaw]

Spoiler

Quote

 

And Bobono’s cock was indeed flopping out. It was made to flop out, for the rape. What a hideous thing, Mercy thought as she knelt before the dwarf to fix him. The cock was a foot long and as thick as her arm, big enough to be seen from the highest balcony. The dyer had done a poor job with the leather, though; the thing was a mottled pink and white, with a bulbous head the color of a plum. Mercy pushed it back into Bobono’s breeches and laced him back up. “Mercy,” he sang as she tied him tight, “Mercy, Mercy, come to my room tonight and make a man of me.”

......

That was one of Izembaro’s “wisdoms,” as he liked to call them. You have to please the pit. “I bet it would please the pit if I ripped off the dwarf’s cock and beat him about the head with it,” Mercy replied. “That’s something they won’t have seen before.” Always give them something they haven’t seen before was another of Izembaro’s “wisdoms,” and one that Bobono had no easy answer for. “There, you’re done,” Mercy announced. “Now see if you can keep in your breeches till it’s needed.”

 

Mercy = Arya, Bobono = Tyrion, his fake cock = Viserion.

Bad dye job on the leather, mottled pink and white. Leather for dragon wings. Mottled pink I'm sure is scar tissue. Viserion is going to be very scarred, likely injured when Tyrion is forced to bring him out at the God's Eye.

It was made to flop out for the rape. Aemond devastated the Riverlands. The Andals destroyed the weirwoods. Tyrion is associated with the Andals, Hugor Hill was the Andal, he'll also play the part of the Winged Knight, another Andal hero. So, I think Tyrion is going attempt to destroy and partly succeed in destroying the weirwoods on the Isle of Faces, probably realising by now the Old Gods are truly powerful and against him.

Give them something they haven't seen before. However Arya manages to take Viserion out, it'll be something Tyrion hasn't seen before.

"There, you're done," Mercy announced. "Now see if you can keep it in your breeches till it's needed." You lose Tyrion. Now put Viserion away, you and him heal up, for when you're both really needed, the war for the dawn.

 

[Lyhra]

On 13/3/2016 at 5:00 PM, The Fattest Leech said:

Adding: I Know not everyone thinks of the wiki as official or canon, but the picture of the house sigil is a horse body with a fin tail and webbed hooves??? http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/File:House_Velaryon.PNG

Also adding: if you scroll down on that page a little, you will see the sigil change slightly over editing time, but only once was it an actual seahorse in terms of what is normally thought of.

When talking about a sea-horse in heraldry, usually it's referred to an hippocampus (a half horse half fish hybrid) instead of an actual seahorse. Which makes for a more beautiful and epic sigil, furthermore.

[norwaywolf123]

On 13.3.2016 at 1:23 PM, chrisdaw said:

I'll try and piece together the broad strokes with foreshadowing of Jon, Tyrion, Dany and Bran without straying into Jaime, Sansa, Arya, Theon and the like, concentrating on Jon coming South and why.

Aegon takes KL and is loved by the people and Faith.

Dany arrives and slays Aegon the cloth dragon lie in the second dance.

As per Wouter's find, Dany on Drogon the black dragon defeats Aegon on Rhaegal the green in the Dance. Dany takes the throne.

Dany is hated for many reasons including destroying the beloved Aegon.

She is betrayed and forced out of KL by way of riot like the first unpopular dragon queen Rhaenyra.

Tyrion becomes king, Sansa queen, beating out Cersei for the throne. This is paralleled and foreshadowed to hell and back but I'm trying to keep it brief and anyway people aren't ready to get behind this, maybe after TWOW.

Cersei and Dany, Tysha and Sansa, the dragons (if they all still live at this stage) will all be in the pit, Dany will have to flee without Drogon.

Dany will go North, don't know why she does particularly but the foreshadowing says she has to slay the Stannis is AA lie if he is still there.

And meet Jon.

By now, in the North Jon is coming into his strength and the Others will be bearing down. Bran will have a plan to save Westeros, that's his role, Jon's is to carry it out.

He needs everyone working together, realm wide, but particularly he needs

He will need Dragonstone mined and the obsidian turned to weapons and given to him.

He will need all the Valyrian blades in the land.

And

Mostly he needs the dragons from Tyrion for Bran's plan.

Dany is with him at this stage and on board, he has a dragon rider, but no dragon, Drogon is South in the pit. Most like Bran's plan requires someone going North to the heart of winter, and a dragon is the only way.

So Dany is in the position whereby

South to get Drogon, so she can go North to fight the Others or into the heart of winter.

This is all the things Jon will need, what the NW will need, so he'll demand it of the South. Only Tyrion will not listen, the demands seem ridiculous, and Tyrion ignored the NW before when he was in KL, too concerned with playing power games.

But Tyrion will have a very specific reason for rejecting Jon other than the demands seem stupid. Dany will be with Jon. Tyrion will have been given the crown in large part because he's a dragon rider and so is best positioned to protect the realm and faith from the return of Dany. Like Jaehaerys (Tyrion parallel), he will have promised to protect the Faith. Giving Dany back her dragon is not something he's going to consider.

So South Jon goes, like his brother the Young Wolf and hero the Young Dragon, Jon is both a young wolf and young dragon. He marches in force ready to take from Tyrion what he needs to save the realm after Tyrion rejects his terms.

Moving South in itself will be an act of war. Moving south with Dany will especially be an act of war. But South he must go, and straight down the middle to get three dragons, where eventually he must cross the Ruby Ford where his father was defeated.

The Ruby Ford flanked first by the Harroway ferry.

And the Quiet Isle where they wait for Rhaegar's seventh Ruby. Eventually fighting his way to the God's Eye.

And finally Tyrion will fly North to meet Jon in battle, again as foreshadowed by Jaehaerys.

Jon's army will be wildlings, giants and wargs, and many others, but it won't be the Wall Tyrion flies to but the Gods Eye as per the previous posts in this thread.

Jon wins, as the Young Wolf and Young Dragon never lost a battle. Tyrion is knocked off Viserion and dragged to the Isle of Faces, there at Jon's mercy he will be forced to listen to the what Jon wants and why, and they'll make common cause.

The new pact, Ice and Fire, North and South, Old gods and new is formed like the old.

Hostages will be taken and marriages made and promised as before. Unfortunately for Arya.

Drogon returns to Dany, as prophesised.

And Tyrion will help Bran to ride, again.

There's more to it, the hour of the wolf and the prophesised return of Drogon to Dany will be more complicated and epic, but those are sideways from here.

ASOIAF ENDGAME

- I dont think sansa or tyrion will be king or queen of the iron throne.

- Jon will die, being betrayed at a peace parley, like the young dragon, Rickon to like the first Rickon during the conquest of Dorne.

- I belive a individual representing Rhanyra and Daeron the good will sit on the iron throne, with tommen representing Daeron the good and Daenerys representg Rhaneyrea. Daenerys is speculated to die in childbirth and be returned with Drogo, i think she will have a daughter that will marry Tommen. Winners of the Dance, and the blackfyre rebbelion tied in marriage. Im deadset on a Lannister /Lannisterbaratheon king in the End. I dont think Varys will let Tommen die, he wants Lannister support for Aegon and giving Tommen "Lannister" Baratheon storms end is a generous offer, and will make lannisters like Jaime happy, Jaime or JonCon will be Faegons Criston Cole or even ser Barristan.

- Sansa will marry either Harrion "Harry" Karstark or Benjen Stark, she will rule the north withc stars at the neck and ends at the wall.

- Dorne will go independant

- Vale will go independant, under Robert Arryn and the Lords Declarent

- Tyrion will give up on Casterly Rock more intrested in power than succesion and his cousins Maryn and Tyrek will be very pliable to him i think. But not Lancel. I think Tyrion repects the Lannisters enough not to ruin the House, but will force them to recognise and follow him.

- The Ironborn will moce to Cape Kraken under the leadership of Theon "Reek" Greyjoy, The Iron Isles will be part of the realm of Casterly ROck.

- The Faithmillitant will not be disbanded again.

[Melisandre's White Pubes]

In AGoT, Hodor is taking Bran back to his room after a feast.  They come upon a couple copulating in one of the hallways, and Hodor stops to stare with a grin on his face.  Bran tells him to leave them alone, and after being dropped off in his room, warns Hodor not to go bother those two later.  This is to show that Hodor has sexual feelings and has behaved in inappropriate ways in regards to sexual situations in the past, as Bran knows he has to remind him not to "bother" them.  It is theorized that this foreshadows that Hodor will become involved in a sexual situation at a later point in the story, and among those theories is that Hodor may behave inappropriately with Meera while skinchanged by Bran, who feels the emotions and physical drives of both direwolf and Hodor when in their minds.

[norwaywolf123]

2 hours ago, Byrnard Sandors said:

In AGoT, Hodor is taking Bran back to his room after a feast.  They come upon a couple copulating in one of the hallways, and Hodor stops to stare with a grin on his face.  Bran tells him to leave them alone, and after being dropped off in his room, warns Hodor not to go bother those two later.  This is to show that Hodor has sexual feelings and has behaved in inappropriate ways in regards to sexual situations in the past, as Bran knows he has to remind him not to "bother" them.  It is theorized that this foreshadows that Hodor will become involved in a sexual situation at a later point in the story, and among those theories is that Hodor may behave inappropriately with Meera while skinchanged by Bran, who feels the emotions and physical drives of both direwolf and Hodor when in their minds.

Bran will skinchange into Hodor and rape Meera Reed?

[Melisandre's White Pubes]

8 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Bran will skinchange into Hodor and rape Meera Reed?

I don't think it would go that far.  I think Bran will come across Meera while she is upset, probably over Jojen dying, while secretly skinchanged as Hodor.  He has thought about how he wanted to comfort her while he is in Hodor's body.  He'll probably do something innocuous like put an arm around her, and because Meera is sad and sees Hodor as a good-natured person, she returns the embrace.  Now Bran is going to start feeling a strong combination of his childlike crush on Meera and the physical response Hodor has from holding close an attractive female, and do something in appropriate, like try to kiss her or put his hands somewhere they are not welcome.  At this point Meera would probably become upset and try to push him away.  Now, anyone who has felt rejection when they are trying to kiss or otherwise be romantic with a person knows how sharply that can hurt, and Bran is completely unaccustomed to that feeling, so his response could make things worse.  I could see him trying to hold her against her will, maybe try to explain that it's really Bran, and something bad happens - my guess, because the caves are described as so treacherous, is that Meera runs away from him in a panic and falls in a hole.  Another option is that Bran hurts her because he misjudges Hodor's strength.  There is also the possibility that Meera seriously injures or kills Hodor in self-defense, or Bran lets her know he's skinchanging Hodor, which outrages Meera and scares him into trying to make her be quiet and he semi-accidentally kills her.

[evita mgfs]

11 minutes ago, Byrnard Sandors said:

I don't think it would go that far.  I think Bran will come across Meera while she is upset, probably over Jojen dying, while secretly skinchanged as Hodor.  He has thought about how he wanted to comfort her while he is in Hodor's body.  He'll probably do something innocuous like put an arm around her, and because Meera is sad and sees Hodor as a good-natured person, she returns the embrace.  Now Bran is going to start feeling a strong combination of his childlike crush on Meera and the physical response Hodor has from holding close an attractive female, and do something in appropriate, like try to kiss her or put his hands somewhere they are not welcome.  At this point Meera would probably become upset and try to push him away.  Now, anyone who has felt rejection when they are trying to kiss or otherwise be romantic with a person knows how sharply that can hurt, and Bran is completely unaccustomed to that feeling, so his response could make things worse.  I could see him trying to hold her against her will, maybe try to explain that it's really Bran, and something bad happens - my guess, because the caves are described as so treacherous, is that Meera runs away from him in a panic and falls in a hole.  Another option is that Bran hurts her because he misjudges Hodor's strength.  There is also the possibility that Meera seriously injures or kills Hodor in self-defense, or Bran lets her know he's skinchanging Hodor, which outrages Meera and scares him into trying to dake her be quiet and he semi-accidentally kills her.

Sort of like what happens with Edward Cullen and Bella Swan on their wedding night?  

Hodor might be too fearful, and Bran too respectful.  After all, his fall was the result, in a small way, of seeing the Queen and the Kingslayer fornicating in his beloved broken tower.

BTW/ Bella loved her night of rough sex with Edward, even though he chewed up the headboard and sent feathers into the air after biting open the pillows.  So romantic.  

[Clegane'sPup]

3 hours ago, Byrnard Sandors said:

In AGoT, Hodor is taking Bran back to his room after a feast.  They come upon a couple copulating in one of the hallways, and Hodor stops to stare with a grin on his face.

What you are speaking of happened in CoK - Bran III. There is no mention of a grin.

They went out the rear rather than walk the length of the hall, Bran ducking his head as they passed through the lord's door. In the dim-lit gallery outside the Great Hall, they came upon Joseth the master of horse engaged in a different sort of riding. He had some woman Bran did not know shoved up against the wall, her skirts around her waist. She was giggling until Hodor stopped to watch. Then she screamed. "Leave them be, Hodor," Bran had to tell him. "Take me to my bedchamber."

Hodor carried him up the winding steps to his tower and knelt beside one of the iron bars that Mikken had driven into the wall. Bran used the bars to move himself to the bed, and Hodor pulled off his boots and breeches. "You can go back to the feast now, but don't go bothering Joseth and that woman," Bran said.

 

4 hours ago, Byrnard Sandors said:

This is to show that Hodor has sexual feelings and has behaved in inappropriate ways in regards to sexual situations in the past, as Bran knows he has to remind him not to "bother" them.

Most likely it shows that Hodor had not seen that type of activity before.

 

4 hours ago, Byrnard Sandors said:

 It is theorized that this foreshadows that Hodor will become involved in a sexual situation at a later point in the story, and among those theories is that Hodor may behave inappropriately with Meera while skinchanged by Bran, who feels the emotions and physical drives of both direwolf and Hodor when in their minds.

The story has a seven foot man with the mind of an innocent child carrying an 8/9 year old boy child around in basket on his back. The Reed kids, approximately between the ages of 14-16 are same size as the 8/9 year old Bran.

I swear by the old and the new gods, I do not understand why people think that Bran is going to warg Hodor and try to do the wild thing with Meera. I just don't get. The only thing my rational mind can come up with is that people's views are skewed by the images they see on the show.

<throws hands up in the air & shakes head>

[Melisandre's White Pubes]

You KNOW he was grinning, though.

Sorry I got the book wrong - after I posted it, I realized it was probably in ACoK because that's where we are introduced to Bran/Hodor's future victim, but I was too lazy to go back and change it.

 

[evita mgfs]

On 3/15/2016 at 10:43 PM, The Fattest Leech said:

Or, she wants Jon to temper his light bringer in her smoking gash.   

 

Banana, banana. 

This is your mother!  I thought I taught you better!  I suppose you got all hot and bothered when Jon Snow gifted Arya Needle, definite foreshadowing of a future tryst, although it does not speak well of Jon Snow's manhood.  Of course, Arya must come of age before such shenanigans. 

[The Fattest Leech]

1 hour ago, evita mgfs said:

This is your mother!  I thought I taught you better!  I suppose you got all hot and bothered when Jon Snow gifted Arya Needle, definite foreshadowing of a future tryst, although it does not speak well of Jon Snow's manhood.  Of course, Arya must come of age before such shenanigans. 

Ah-hahahaa I love that you said that!

Yeah. George can write some gag inducing scenes (I'm looking at you pink mast and Myrish swamp), but he can also write some amazing little snippet scenes that last and linger. Breathes mingling in the air mushed between gouging, stabbing and shredding. I can't wait for the next book.

[chrisdaw]

Aemond Targaryen.

Quote

I lost an eye and gained a dragon that day, and counted it a fair exchange.

I'm not totally sold on it, but there's a good chance I think Tyrion will lose an eye (the green). And if he does lose it it will be on the day Faegon dies or loses the decisive battle to Dany, or when Tyrion gains/rides Viserion, or when he ascends the throne.

[dornishdame]

1 hour ago, chrisdaw said:

Aemond Targaryen.

I'm not totally sold on it, but there's a good I think Tyrion will lose an eye (the green). And if (the green) he does he'll lose it on the day Faegon dies or loses the decisive battle to Dany, or when he Tyrion gains/rides Viserion, or when he ascends the throne.

Interesting theory - particularly given that Tyrion's eyes are green and black, the two colors that represented the opposing factions during the Dance. 

[norwaywolf123]

10 hours ago, dornishdame said:

Interesting theory - particularly given that Tyrion's eyes are green and black, the two colors that represented the opposing factions during the Dance. 

I think that Tyrion will support Dany(Black) and then betray her for Jaime who is on fAegon(Green)

[Lost Melnibonean]

I agree that Tyrion will betray Daenerys, but not for Jaime (blood? love?). Tyrion will betray Daenerys for all the gold of Casterly Rock...

One day he might rue these signatures.

Eventually, Daenerys is going to realize that Illyrio has been betraying her for blood (Blackfyre). My best guess is that Aegon will betray her for love (Arianne). 

[DarkSister1001]

Quote

Crossing a river on a crude raft, wearing armor, with an enemy waiting on the other side - if that was gallantry, he would take cowardice every time.  He wondered if Lord Brax had felt especially gallant as the weight of his steel pulled him under the black water. - Tyrion, AGoT, Chapter 69