Blueroses

Jon legitimacy foreshadowing ?

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Jon Snow explained to Missandei : "I am a bastartd... my mother and father weren't married"

=> GoT translator => Jon is a trueborn, he's mother and father were married.

Did we really need an explanation what "a bastard" means or am I looking too much into this ?

What to you think ?

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I think it was an interesting way of showing the differences in culture between them. But you might have a point the problem is there is no way to prove it

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Totally agree.

The scene was needed for two reasons... because it's very important for Jon & Dany to know Jon's true identity. They won't find out until after they finally hook up. But it will give Dany a great scene of magnanimously, and gratefully, bending the knee herself. 

I do want the rest of humanity to know as well, for a bazillion reasons like vindicating Ned's lie.

And because Missandei is correct in the long run, bastard as a concept is ridiculous. 

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Posted (edited)

12 minutes ago, snow is the man said:

I think it was an interesting way of showing the differences in culture between them. But you might have a point the problem is there is no way to prove it

There are tons of ways, the biggest being Bran. Bran knows. He probably looked through time and saw their wedding in front of a heart tree, something resembling Robb's, especially after seeing the Kingsguard at the ToJ fight to the death over - yeah only one reason, because they have only one job: Protect the true king, which baby Jon is at that moment. If Jon were a bastard, they'd all have gone to Starfall, and looked after her there, the Kingsguard likely leaving ages ago. No one would care about Rhaegar's bastard, even if word got out. (We know Robert would be a bit nutty, but he probably wouldn't ever learn of it. And the characters have no idea.) And even if they were still at the tower, they'd have taken Ned straight to see his sister, and helped them pack her and the baby back to Winterfell. 

There's also Sam at the Citadel cleaning all those old books and scrolls.... 

There's also Meera's dad who she's going home to at the moment.

 

Edited by ShadowKitteh

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12 minutes ago, ShadowKitteh said:

Totally agree.

The scene was needed for two reasons... because it's very important for Jon & Dany to know Jon's true identity. They won't find out until after they finally hook up. But it will give Dany a great scene of magnanimously, and gratefully, bending the knee herself. 

I do want the rest of humanity to know as well, for a bazillion reasons like vindicating Ned's lie.

And because Missandei is correct in the long run, bastard as a concept is ridiculous. 

Yes to all this. 

Might be the reason the whole ' bend the knee ' keeps coming up over and over.

6 minutes ago, ShadowKitteh said:

There are tons of ways, the biggest being Bran. Bran knows. He probably looked through time and saw their wedding in front of a heart tree, something resembling Robb's, especially after seeing the Kingsguard at the ToJ fight to the death over - yeah only one reason, because they have only one job: Protect the true king, which baby Jon is at that moment. If Jon were a bastard, they'd all have gone to Starfall, and looked after her there, the Kingsguard likely leaving ages ago. No one would care about Rhaegar's bastard, even if word got out. (We know Robert would be a bit nutty, but he probably wouldn't ever learn of it. And the characters have no idea.) And even if they were still at the tower, they'd have taken Ned straight to see his sister, and helped them pack her and the baby back to Winterfell. 

There's also Sam at the Citadel cleaning all those old books and scrolls.... 

There's also Meera's dad who she's going home to at the moment.

 

Again agree with you. Re the bolded, I said this in a thread somewhere recently not sure if it was here or on another forum ha but I was laughed at.

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4 minutes ago, ShadowKitteh said:

There are tons of ways, the biggest being Bran. Bran knows. He probably looked through time and saw their wedding in front of a heart tree, something resembling Robb's, especially after seeing the Kingsguard at the ToJ fight to the death over - yeah only one reason, because they have only one job: Protect the true king, which baby Jon is at that moment. If Jon were a bastard, they'd all have gone to Starfall, and looked after her there, the Kingsguard likely leaving ages ago. No one would care about Rhaegar's bastard, even if word got out. (We know Robert would be a bit nutty, but he probably wouldn't ever learn of it. And the characters have no idea.) And even if they were still at the tower, they'd have taken Ned straight to see his sister, and helped them pack her and the baby back to Winterfell. 

There's also Sam at the Citadel cleaning all those old books and scrolls.... 

There's also Meera's dad who she's going home to at the moment.

 

Meera's dad might work but for everyone else you are essentially taking the word of a weird kid who has every reason to lie in their minds. Also when people heard the reason is "He saw it because he is the three eyed raven" they would laugh or at the very least doubt the tale. And as for sam reading the scrolls what proof would they have that there was a kid. They could say that they (rheagar and lyanna) were married but there is no kid. However meera going home might have something to do with that and I didn't think about that nice catch.

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28 minutes ago, snow is the man said:

Meera's dad might work but for everyone else you are essentially taking the word of a weird kid who has every reason to lie in their minds. Also when people heard the reason is "He saw it because he is the three eyed raven" they would laugh or at the very least doubt the tale. And as for sam reading the scrolls what proof would they have that there was a kid. They could say that they (rheagar and lyanna) were married but there is no kid. However meera going home might have something to do with that and I didn't think about that nice catch.

i agree...i dont think sam would find anything written there otherwise lyanna wouldnt ask ned to keep jon's identity secret cos she knew robert and anything sam can find written robert's or lannisters' spies could have found as well and jon would be dead...remember how he was paranoid over viserys and dany? jon was even closer to him and an easy target..even catelyn could have helped killing him lol

howland reed however was with ned and whatever written he might have it or he might have heard about all the promise thing

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Bran has to be in a position to talk to both of them (together), if that becomes possible all he has to do is mention events from their lives known only to them to become a believable witness.

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The scene was needed for two reasons... because it's very important for Jon & Dany to know Jon's true identity. They won't find out until after they finally hook up. But it will give Dany a great scene of magnanimously, and gratefully, bending the knee herself.

Hah, that'll be the day. What's more likely is a second Dance of Dragons, as Daenerys has spent YEARS of her life believing that the Iron Throne was hers by right of blood. If the entire basis for her claim to the throne were to fall to pieces right before she's about to claim it, there's no way she'd be in any way gracious about it. That'd be enough to drive her over the edge into full-on Mad Targaryen mode.

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9 hours ago, Blueroses said:

Jon Snow explained to Missandei : "I am a bastartd... my mother and father weren't married"

=> GoT translator => Jon is a trueborn, he's mother and father were married.

Did we really need an explanation what "a bastard" means or am I looking too much into this ?

What to you think ?

This was exactly how I read the scene and it reminded me of when Maester Aemon said something about being the lone Targaryen is a lonely place, and Jon walks into the room.  How this show is directing Jon is so strange.  It is like they are bending over backward to NOT give Jon the shine Dany has, yet they think they are so clever they have to send out mini 'aren't we clever moments'. Like explaining what a bastard is, because wink-wink Jon is not a bastard.

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Rhaegar has his first marriage annulled, and we'll get a flashback to him and Lyanna getting married just before the end of Season 7. This is what the show posted on their blog anyway! But good catch in the foreshadowing!!

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From the coming attractions for the next ep: Dany riding a dragon approached Jon. The dragon roars. But, Jon seems a lot less terrified than I would be. Could this be the long awaited and anticipated scene where Jon displays some affinity for dragons? I can see it now, instead of toasting him, the dragon nuzzles him with his snout, causing Dany to surrender to Jon's obvious superior ability with dragons. :rolleyes:

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9 hours ago, Blueroses said:

Jon Snow explained to Missandei : "I am a bastartd... my mother and father weren't married"

=> GoT translator => Jon is a trueborn, he's mother and father were married.

Did we really need an explanation what "a bastard" means or am I looking too much into this ?

What to you think ?

He's still a bastard.  Rhaegar was already married to Elia.

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1 hour ago, StannisBurnsShireen said:

Rhaegar has his first marriage annulled, and we'll get a flashback to him and Lyanna getting married just before the end of Season 7. This is what the show posted on their blog anyway! But good catch in the foreshadowing!!

I don't think he had his first marriage annulled, just opted to have multiple wives.  One married by the light of the seven and one married under the eyes of a weirwood tree.  

He probably figured that he'd be king and damn anyone who tried to say he couldn't have multiple wives. 

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28 minutes ago, Quoth said:

From the coming attractions for the next ep: Dany riding a dragon approached Jon. The dragon roars. But, Jon seems a lot less terrified than I would be. 

No doubt. I would be pooping my pants and crying if that was roaring in my face. 

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25 minutes ago, Lurid Jester said:

No doubt. I would be pooping my pants and crying if that was roaring in my face. 

I wouldn't. I'd remain brave. 

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10 hours ago, Blueroses said:

Jon Snow explained to Missandei : "I am a bastartd... my mother and father weren't married"

=> GoT translator => Jon is a trueborn, he's mother and father were married.

Did we really need an explanation what "a bastard" means or am I looking too much into this ?

What to you think ?

honestly I think you overthought on this. Misandei has no idea what is bastard. So Jon explained to her by giving the definition for bastard. he might be or not be a bastard, but this does not seem to be a foreshadow. He also said he is not a stark. Then what is the GOT translation? he is a Stark? 

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Jon's legitimacy came in the previews of next week's episode.  Drogon will recognize blood of the dragon when he sees it and will show respect and it will baffle the people on that island.  

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7 hours ago, snow is the man said:

Meera's dad might work but for everyone else you are essentially taking the word of a weird kid who has every reason to lie in their minds. Also when people heard the reason is "He saw it because he is the three eyed raven" they would laugh or at the very least doubt the tale. And as for sam reading the scrolls what proof would they have that there was a kid. They could say that they (rheagar and lyanna) were married but there is no kid. However meera going home might have something to do with that and I didn't think about that nice catch.

If only he weren't saying things that were private and he wouldn't be expected to know, like Sansa's rape, Littlefinger's commentary on chaos....

He isn't babbling.  He's pointedly saying things that give others confidence that he is what he says he is.

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1 minute ago, SerJeremiahLouistark said:

Jon's legitimacy came in the previews of next week's episode.  Drogon will recognize blood of the dragon when he sees it and will show respect and it will baffle the people on that island.  

bonding to a dragon or being a dragon rider will  not prove you are a legit Targ. It can only prove you have drop of dragon blood. Numerous people rode dragons before but they are not Targs. Many of them did not even have a Targ parent. 

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