“For the watch”

[the trees have eyes]

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

7 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Mance and his bitches

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

[Varysblackfyre321]

51 minutes ago, LynnS said:

That does work well in Canada.  I pay my taxes, I get health care.

Citation?

Curiously, many men still think this is the case.

No?  Sure didn't sound like it.

Well good for you;westeros isn't Canada it's a society based upon medieval Europe which had none of our modern sensibilities

You do realize how hard women have fought for the right to be recognized as a separate entity  to their husband in our own world yes?

How, marital rape relatively recently been recognized as thing?

 Woman in Britain couldn't earn anything without it being her husband's, 

Thats why no one gasps when a female is told by her patriarch they will marry x man.

Thats why even Ramsey forcing a woman with a knife to her throat to say the vows is greeted with some sort of amugity of whether the marriage still holds up

 

These things weren't so in medieval Europe.

If you're husband beat you'd be in the wrong to try to leave. That's why family's pay a dowry. They're basicly selling a daughter in exchange for something 

 

[Varysblackfyre321]

39 minutes ago, the trees have eyes said:

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

 

39 minutes ago, the trees have eyes said:

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

Oh wow I called some women bitches. And I also called mace Rayder Jon's dog and the wildlinngs savages and murderers and rapsits.

From the average person in the story my description of each is more than adequate.

To show how bad Jon's decision can be painted upon him and how quite frankly nefarious his actions could look from anyone whose not privy to Asoiaf

Yes, yes, they know anyone who expresses an opinion you dislike on the Internet is a troll never mind explaining what exactly anything is wrong or trollish. 

Dont explain why my points make no sense, just say troll and invalidates everything I've said thus far.

 

 

[LynnS]

39 minutes ago, the trees have eyes said:

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

I'm done.

 

[Varysblackfyre321]

34 minutes ago, LynnS said:

I'm done.

 

 

34 minutes ago, LynnS said:

I'm done.

 

You really can't be this dense can you? Me saying this society based upon medieval Europe considers wives to be property does not mean I myself think that's ok. I've stated such a thing is repugnant and barbaric, multiple times but merely pointing out the sexism that has shown to permunate this society where wives have been shown to be beaten, raped,and no one really finds it odd somehow how makes me sexist. Ramsey literally forced a woman to marry at knife point and the marriage was still debated on whether or not it was valid.

Wsteroes besides Dorn is a very misgonistic place. 

Me saying women expected to tolerate their husbands' bullshit isn't an endorsement of the view.

But no, hyper fixate on me using the word "bitches" to describe the spear wives when trying to show how bad picture this looks for Melisandre's and Jon's scheme to be found out.

Apparenly saying I don't approve of the notion of wives being subservient to their husbands doesn't matter because I say this society does.

I hope you actually look up what exactly how women's rights regarding marriage as evolved dramatically over the years because it seem you think it was just the same  even back in medieval Europe.

I'm done.

[Lyanna<3Rhaegar]

1 hour ago, the trees have eyes said:

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

Agreed. I'm done with it. He has proved himself an unworthy adversary. 

[the trees have eyes]

1 hour ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

You really can't be this dense can you?

I'm done.

Bye!  Don't let the door hit you on the way out....

[The Fattest Leech]

3 hours ago, the trees have eyes said:

You all went and fed it, didn't you?

3 hours ago, the trees have eyes said:

Why is anyone even bothering to respond to this fine specimen of humanity?

I still vote sock puppet.

It was interesting for a while, something to give the ol'grey matter a work out, but he is not a worthy adversary by any means. The responses are so basic and don't take the story as a whole in to consideration. Too much time spent actually explaining the books, the flat black and white ideas, and reading past "bitches" and "pillow biters" make for boring conversation.

[kissdbyfire]

Can someone gimme a quote where we have northerners calling wildling women bitches?

 

 

[Lyanna<3Rhaegar]

1 minute ago, kissdbyfire said:

Can someone gimme a quote where we have northerners calling wildling women bitches?

 

 

[Clegane'sPup]

3 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I still vote sock puppet.

You are constantly teaching me new stuff. I thought a sock puppet was a sweet innocent puppet with cute button eyes and a red felt tongue.

2 hours ago, kissdbyfire said:

Can someone gimme a quote where we have northerners calling wildling women bitches?

I was bored so I looked into it. I don’t know if Kedge is a northerner or not. Doesn't really matter.

A Storm of Swords - Prologue     While he was telling the Old Bear what his scouts had seen, his man Kedge Whiteye told the rest of them. "They're still well up the foothills, but they're coming," Kedge said, warming his hands over the fire. "Harma the Dogshead has the van, the poxy bitch.

The rest of the time it is mostly Tyrion, Jaime, the Hound and Cersei using the word to describe females.    I guess Asha naming her ship the Sea Bitch is supposed to be empowering.

 

The rest of the post is just me yammering.

When I read or hear a man say word it rankles me so much I just wanna reach out and touch someone and say, “Well you are the son of one aren’t you?.”

I find it comical that a male dog is a stud & sire while a female dog is a bitch.

Martin used the word to describe both dogs and women. I didn’t much like it, but hey it is what it is.

I guess it is the negative connotation the word holds with me. Oddly enough I find females who refer to themselves or other females with the use of the word sad.

Needless to say the last person who addressed me to my face as a female dog received an earful of unsolicited feedback.

Yeah, I know it has nothing to do with --- for the watch ----

[divica]

Honestly lets move on to more interesting things!

I am quite curious to know who people think would be in charge of winterfell and the north if jon and the wildlings conquered winterfell and killed the boltons.

Assuming that jon is LC (as he was before being stabed) and that stannis was either defeated (and has basically no army) or is dead. We can also assume people at least know he is alive but at the same is a kid and the north is at war with the IT and the watch says the ww are coming.

[The Fattest Leech]

1 hour ago, divica said:

Honestly lets move on to more interesting things!

I am quite curious to know who people think would be in charge of winterfell and the north if jon and the wildlings conquered winterfell and killed the boltons.

Assuming that jon is LC (as he was before being stabed) and that stannis was either defeated (and has basically no army) or is dead. We can also assume people at least know he is alive but at the same is a kid and the north is at war with the IT and the watch says the ww are coming.

I am still a fan of the Night Lamp theory. No matter how the small details may work out in the published TWOW, I think this theory is going to be fairly spot on. I encourage people to at least read it, even if you see things differently. And, IT HAS PICTURES

I don't think we should disregard Rickon and his siblings too quickly, either. Jon may get to Winterfell, I think he may end up heading to Dreadfort for other reasons, but no where do we ever get the idea that Jon craves power or feels something is "rightfully" his. Stannis may hold Winterfell for a while, and then may possibly go on to Dreadfort to secure that castle- or maybe reverse- point is, Dreadfort also has to be addressed because at this point it is the only rogue castle in the north. I don't think Jon or Stannis will attempt to keep Winterfell as their own, especially when other Stark pups start showing back up. Stannis may move south towards King's Landing, depending on how long he lives. If Jon stays at Winterfell, it will be temporary or as intermediary for Rickon (?), but I do not think that will be Jon's final seat. But, I could be wrong

How about you @divica? What are your thoughts on the Night Lamp theory?

Link to theory:

https://cantuse.wordpress.com/2014/08/28/the-night-lamp-revisited-the-wrath-of-the-old-and-the-new/

Teasers from the theory:

1. Foreword. Acknowledging influential authors and essays. Warnings about spoilers.
2. Lay of the Land. A brief look at the terrain around the crofter’s village.
3. The Stannis Coalition. An assessment of Stannis and his forces.
4. The Frey and Manderly Armies. An assessment of the Frey and Manderly forces.
5. Hosteen’s Strategy. The two likely strategies Hosteen would employ.
6. The Eye of a Storm. How the extreme weather necessarily affects strategy.
7. A Trick from the Pirate Kings. Stannis takes inspiration from his time as the Master of Ships.
8. Baiting the Trap. How Stannis forces Hosteen to prematurely attack.
9. Fire up the Band. The actual arrangement and orders of Stannis’s men.
10. The Night Lamp. The battle at the crofter’s village, step by step. The blinding signal used by Stannis.
11. Fuel for the Fire. Just how is the false beacon implemented? How does Stannis empower his chosen signalling device?
12. The Fat Man Cometh Not. Where is Wyman Manderly in all this? When does he arrive at the village?
13. Sister Cities. The extreme parallels between the crofter’s village and a wildling village, the relevance to the battle.
14. Potent Passages. Excerpts from the book that take on eerie meaning in light of this essay.
15. Implications. Big questions raised by this essay, and attempted answers.
16. The Five-Minute Version. The quick rundown of this theory.

THE FIVE-MINUTE VERSION

---

The Night Lamp theory in a nutshell:

Stannis used to be the Master of Ships. This means he dealt with maritime law, crime, etc. He was called upon at least once to deal with people who repeatedly used a trick to purposefully wreck ships. They would extinguish the fire from a ‘known good’ beacon and erect a false beacon somewhere else. This would cause ships to crash because they were lured into rocks or something like that.

Stannis is going to use this trick against the Freys. Stannis is currently stuck at a village in the woods between two lakes. His men have been carefully digging holes around an island in one of the lakes.

He knows that the Freys will approach a certain way, expecting to use a narrow land bridge to access the village between the lakes.

However, Stannis will eliminate the watchtower beacon fire and raise a false beacon atop the island in the lake.

Confused and in a blizzard the Freys will unwittingly traverse the lake and into the ice-fishing holes.

At that moment Stannis will draw his sword Lightbringer and blind the approaching army, maximizing the trap effectiveness and signalling the rest of his men. Catapults lob stones into the lakes shattering the ice and drowning many. Survivors are killed along the shores by men in waiting. And northmen move quickly to secure the Frey baggage train.

[divica]

1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I am still a fan of the Night Lamp theory. No matter how the small details may work out in the published TWOW, I think this theory is going to be fairly spot on. I encourage people to at least read it, even if you see things differently. And, IT HAS PICTURES

I don't think we should disregard Rickon and his siblings too quickly, either. Jon may get to Winterfell, I think he may end up heading to Dreadfort for other reasons, but no where do we ever get the idea that Jon craves power or feels something is "rightfully" his. Stannis may hold Winterfell for a while, and then may possibly go on to Dreadfort to secure that castle- or maybe reverse- point is, Dreadfort also has to be addressed because at this point it is the only rogue castle in the north. I don't think Jon or Stannis will attempt to keep Winterfell as their own, especially when other Stark pups start showing back up. Stannis may move south towards King's Landing, depending on how long he lives. If Jon stays at Winterfell, it will be temporary or as intermediary for Rickon (?), but I do not think that will be Jon's final seat. But, I could be wrong

How about you @divica? What are your thoughts on the Night Lamp theory?

Link to theory:

https://cantuse.wordpress.com/2014/08/28/the-night-lamp-revisited-the-wrath-of-the-old-and-the-new/

Teasers from the theory:

1. Foreword. Acknowledging influential authors and essays. Warnings about spoilers.
2. Lay of the Land. A brief look at the terrain around the crofter’s village.
3. The Stannis Coalition. An assessment of Stannis and his forces.
4. The Frey and Manderly Armies. An assessment of the Frey and Manderly forces.
5. Hosteen’s Strategy. The two likely strategies Hosteen would employ.
6. The Eye of a Storm. How the extreme weather necessarily affects strategy.
7. A Trick from the Pirate Kings. Stannis takes inspiration from his time as the Master of Ships.
8. Baiting the Trap. How Stannis forces Hosteen to prematurely attack.
9. Fire up the Band. The actual arrangement and orders of Stannis’s men.
10. The Night Lamp. The battle at the crofter’s village, step by step. The blinding signal used by Stannis.
11. Fuel for the Fire. Just how is the false beacon implemented? How does Stannis empower his chosen signalling device?
12. The Fat Man Cometh Not. Where is Wyman Manderly in all this? When does he arrive at the village?
13. Sister Cities. The extreme parallels between the crofter’s village and a wildling village, the relevance to the battle.
14. Potent Passages. Excerpts from the book that take on eerie meaning in light of this essay.
15. Implications. Big questions raised by this essay, and attempted answers.
16. The Five-Minute Version. The quick rundown of this theory.

THE FIVE-MINUTE VERSION

---

The Night Lamp theory in a nutshell:

Stannis used to be the Master of Ships. This means he dealt with maritime law, crime, etc. He was called upon at least once to deal with people who repeatedly used a trick to purposefully wreck ships. They would extinguish the fire from a ‘known good’ beacon and erect a false beacon somewhere else. This would cause ships to crash because they were lured into rocks or something like that.

Stannis is going to use this trick against the Freys. Stannis is currently stuck at a village in the woods between two lakes. His men have been carefully digging holes around an island in one of the lakes.

He knows that the Freys will approach a certain way, expecting to use a narrow land bridge to access the village between the lakes.

However, Stannis will eliminate the watchtower beacon fire and raise a false beacon atop the island in the lake.

Confused and in a blizzard the Freys will unwittingly traverse the lake and into the ice-fishing holes.

At that moment Stannis will draw his sword Lightbringer and blind the approaching army, maximizing the trap effectiveness and signalling the rest of his men. Catapults lob stones into the lakes shattering the ice and drowning many. Survivors are killed along the shores by men in waiting. And northmen move quickly to secure the Frey baggage train.

I think this theory works very well for GoT. In the books I don t think so. There are a lot of details that probably make it impossible... Like, do armies fight under a very strong blizzard or wait for better time?(I think they have to wait for visibility and because people die from cold in blizzards and other smarter reasons) SCOUTS! Not even freys would attack some place without using scouts and verifying there is an army there. This would diffuse the ruse or make stannis strand a considerable part of his army in the Island (for the scouts to see) and risk losing it. In addition scouts would notice catapults and the trees cut down to build them! In the decoded Asha chapter from twow I think she is describing the frey army and how they are showing themselves to stannis.

 

What I think will happen is: Stannis his Southern men and some northerners will be in the Island(s) in the lake with (hidden) holes dug up around them. Stannis will provoke the freys to attack him. When they are commited the rest of the northerners with their garrons will ride behind the freys and push them against the holes and stannis men that will constantly fire voleys of arrows. It isn t as elaborate as the night lamp theory but I think it should work and seems pretty effective. In addition stannis doesn t want to drown the enemies horses because he needs food. This strategy is better in that regards than the night lamp.

 

Yeah I meant to say that people at least know rickon is alive but that he is a child. With the NW appearing and saying the WW are coming, the IT a constant threat, robbs will and a pretty much broken north on its last remaing forces are they going to chose a child raised by a wildling to lead them in this crises? Will they pledge to stannis that might not believe in the ww or think it is better to sacrífice the north in order to get to the IT in time of saving the other kingdoms? Would jon give winterfell to someone he isn t sure is going to protect the north from the ww or that is completly loyal to the remaining starks?

My personal opinion is that they would kick stannis south, elect rickon as their king and jon as protector of the realm. However, can jon have this position and be the LC? even taking into acount he will be using it to defend the north (and other kingdoms) against the ww?

[Clegane'sPup]

19 minutes ago, divica said:

I think this theory works very well for GoT. In the books I don t think so.

Okay I am scratching my head. I have to ask. The theory works well for the GoT but not ASOIAF?

3 hours ago, divica said:

I am quite curious to know who people think would be in charge of winterfell and the north if jon and the wildlings conquered winterfell and killed the boltons.

How can a reasonably sane person answer this question?  At the end of DwD Bolton is in charge of WF.

At the end of DwD it is unknown if LC Snow is alive. At the end of DwD Stannis is alive as witnessed by the Theon chapter that was moved from DwD to WoW.

3 hours ago, divica said:

Assuming that jon is LC (as he was before being stabed) and that stannis was either defeated (and has basically no army) or is dead. We can also assume people at least know he is alive but at the same is a kid and the north is at war with the IT and the watch says the ww are coming.

By the old and the new gods let us (you & me) say LC Snow has been wounded. If he has any loyal followers at CB they will have taken the people who tried to kill him into custody.

Speculating ---  LC Snow heals up. If I were LC Snow upon my recovery from my wounds I would first wreak some havoc on those who tried to kill me.

In Martin’s book DwD there is so much shyte going on it is difficult to say where the story is going.

But if this is what you are trying to get at ---- I doubt very seriously there is going to be a battle of the bastards and no, Sansa is not going to save the day with the Vale lords coming to the rescue.

If I am assuming too much ignore me.

[divica]

2 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Okay I am scratching my head. I have to ask. The theory works well for the GoT but not ASOIAF?

I explained next why I thought it didn t work (previous post). It is related to GoT not caring about logic...

4 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

How can a reasonably sane person answer this question?  At the end of DwD Bolton is in charge of WF.

At the end of DwD it is unknown if LC Snow is alive. At the end of DwD Stannis is alive as witnessed by the Theon chapter that was moved from DwD to WoW.

By the old and the new gods let us (you & me) say LC Snow has been wounded. If he has any loyal followers at CB they will have taken the people who tried to kill him into custody.

Speculating ---  LC Snow heals up. If I were LC Snow upon my recovery from my wounds I would first wreak some havoc on those who tried to kill me.

In Martin’s book DwD there is so much shyte going on it is difficult to say where the story is going.

But if this is what you are trying to get at ---- I doubt very seriously there is going to be a battle of the bastards and no, Sansa is not going to save the day with the Vale lords coming to the rescue.

If I am assuming too much ignore me.

I was thinking more along the lines that instead of being stabed to death jon marched to winterfel and defeated the boltons (which can still happen). In the scenarion Stannis was either dead or had been defeated and is hidden somewhere (giving some truth to the PL) and rickon is assumed to be alive (don t know if found or not)

[Clegane'sPup]

5 minutes ago, divica said:

I explained next why I thought it didn t work (previous post). It is related to GoT not caring about logic...

I was thinking more along the lines that instead of being stabed to death jon marched to winterfel and defeated the boltons (which can still happen). In the scenarion Stannis was either dead or had been defeated and is hidden somewhere (giving some truth to the PL) and rickon is assumed to be alive (don t know if found or not)

Thank you.

[The Fattest Leech]

14 minutes ago, divica said:

I explained next why I thought it didn t work (previous post). It is related to GoT not caring about logic...

I was thinking more along the lines that instead of being stabed to death jon marched to winterfel and defeated the boltons (which can still happen). In the scenarion Stannis was either dead or had been defeated and is hidden somewhere (giving some truth to the PL) and rickon is assumed to be alive (don t know if found or not)

Hmmm. I see I wasn’t super clear in my previous post. I also do not think there will be a bastard battle. I think by the time Jon heads out, it will be in pursuit of someone, and not Ramsay. Stannis will deal with Ramsay if Roose hasn’t taken care of that by trickery (or something) by now.

Gotta think on it a bit as I try to not burn dinner. 

[Clegane'sPup]

12 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Hmmm. I see I wasn’t super clear in my previous post. I also do not think there will be a bastard battle. I think by the time Jon heads out, it will be in pursuit of someone, and not Ramsay. Stannis will deal with Ramsay if Roose hasn’t taken care of that by trickery (or something) by now.

Gotta think on it a bit as I try to not burn dinner. 

Dunna burn the dinner. Please do come back and splain more about it.

14 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I think by the time Jon heads out, it will be in pursuit of someone, and not Ramsay.

This inquiring mind wants to know.

[The Fattest Leech]

1 minute ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Dunna burn the dinner.

My bane and curse is having to cook 

1 minute ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Please do come back and splain more about it.

This inquiring mind wants to know.

Same ol, same ol with me on this topic.