Jaime L

NBA 2018 - Soup's on!

268 posts in this topic

The Houston Rockets "collapse" is gonna be epic.

I can't wait to finally see this Cleveland disaster end and see LeBron leave this dumpster fire.

Welp, David West retiring with a second championship is cool, I guess.

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Eh, I like Adams' game, but Jokic is the better player. Denver wouldn't have sniffed the playoffs if they swapped teams (IDK if the Thunder would be any better though because Adams fills a lot of their needs in ways that Jokic never could). 

 

1 hour ago, Jaime L said:

He's an awesome rebounder for a 6'3" guy but he gets a few rebounds each game because Steven Adams doesn't care about stats at all and blocks out his guy to the third row letting Westbrook swoop in and get it.

 

I think Adams would be an improvement at center for most teams.  He's incredibly underrated, and Jaime L is exactly right about his box-out skills.  

This UTAH vs. OKC series has two of the best defensive centers in the game.  I'm a huge fan of the Stifle Tower, it should be fun to watch how one incredibly strong center goes up against one if not the best rim protectors in the league.  

P.S. Rudy Gobert was drafted by the Nuggets too!  Damn, the Jazz double downed when they fleeced the Nuggets with the Mitchell trade on draft day this year.

Edited by Sour Billy Tipton

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3 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

KAT was statistically better in pretty much every way. Points, rebounds, blocks, shooting across the board, advanced metrics. It's difficult to find anything that Jokic did better than KAT.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/townska01.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jokicni01.html

KAT is great.  I don't want to make this an anti-KAT rant because if I was to pick the third best center I would listen to arguments for KAT and Jokic and be willing to entertain them.  But with these stats you ignore two things; assists and the fact that Jokic is the teams damn point guard.  The offense goes through him every play and the team tanks when he leaves the floor; he is the Nuggets right now and that is impossible to quantify.

2 hours ago, Sour Billy Tipton said:

Steven Adams is more valuable than Jokic.  I don't care for one-way players.  That's why Gary Harris is the MVP on the Nuggets.  Jokic is at too great of a physical disadvantage.  He's too slow, too weak, and has too much body fat.  Not only is he easy to back down but he's got those tight hips that are always exposed. Athletic bigs can always make a quick pivot, gain a step, then finishes above him with no threat of Jokic recovering with a block from behind.

Give me Steven Adams, who is quite possibly the most physically imposing of all the centers in the NBA.  And not only is he a presence down-low, but he also plays great perimeter defense.  It's amazing how well he moves around the perimeter on offense as well.  One of the best at setting screens.

ESPN should have highlights more like this:

 

 

2 hours ago, Sour Billy Tipton said:

That too.  Jokic only averages a little more than 4.5 PPG over Adams.  Adams does more than enough on the defensive end to make up for that, and then some.

Lou Williams is only scoring 2 points less a game than Steph Curry this year.  You take that trade since he is a better defender?  This is a silly argument and completely ignores Jokic's game. Jokic IS the Nugget's offense, it doesn't exist without him.  Adams gets more slop points than I do at the rec; his average goes down on any other team and tanks without a superstar next to him.  He is valuable on the specific team he plays for but he isn't even close to the reason for their success. 

You don't have to like one way players (though I think this is a bit of a stretch since Jokic often has the other teams center in foul trouble early, making up for some of his own deficiencies) but there have been some highly successful teams with them over the years (Kyrie, Harding, and Curry are all arguably the worst defenders on their respective teams).  And while Jokic may not be able to guard other teams bigs thus far other teams bigs have not found a way to guard him either; I watched at least 60 Nuggets games and only saw Jokic outplayed by the other team's center a couple of times; he outplayed KAT so bad on the offensive end that they switched off on defense in the forth quarter.

The fact is people don't know how to judge a center that doesn't play like a center; we over look defensive deficiencies in guards and small forwards all the time and people just expect the five to play big. 

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Posted (edited)

27 minutes ago, SkynJay said:

Lou Williams is only scoring 2 points less a game than Steph Curry this year.  

They don't play the same position so that's a poor example.  And it's a comparison of players who are in different situations.  GS is the 2 seed, LAC finished 10th.  Besides, we all know what Steph can do offensively without Durant.  

And I don't overlook defensive deficiencies for any player.  Especially when they're "superstars".  That's why Carmello was the most overrated player in the NBA for years.  It's part of the reason why Harden has underperformed in the playoffs.  

Hell, after 2015 I was telling everyone the Sixers should trade Okafor to Denver for Gary Harris.  At the time Okafor was coming off of a rookie year where he averaged 17.5 PPG and Harris had a nice sophomore season averaging 12.3.  Obviously we're all aware of Okafor's defense at the time.  But Okafor was also horrible match for the fast tempo the Sixers had always been trying to run on offense.  Damn, Gary Harris on the Sixers.  That could be amazing.

Edited by Sour Billy Tipton

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I think that Portland probably got the best scenario they could with hanging onto the 3 and drawing New Orleans...at least in terms of the 1st round matchup.  But it draws them Golden State rather than Houston in the 2nd round.  

I am still betting on Golden State over Houston, and I can't really see why anyone would do otherwise unless they had doubts about Curry's status.  Houston had a tremendous regular season, but now that it's playoff time it seems it will be back to Golden State as favorite until shown otherwise.

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Raptors in 6

Cavs in 5

Sixers in 6

Celtics in 5

Rockets in 4

Thunder in 6

Blazers in 5

Warriors in 5

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Kind of a boring first round.  I could see Utah giving the Thunder a run for its money but not enough to really scare them.  I agree with your list almost to the game, though I think both the Caves and Rockets sweep.

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21 hours ago, SkynJay said:

KAT is great.  I don't want to make this an anti-KAT rant because if I was to pick the third best center I would listen to arguments for KAT and Jokic and be willing to entertain them.  But with these stats you ignore two things; assists and the fact that Jokic is the teams damn point guard.  The offense goes through him every play and the team tanks when he leaves the floor; he is the Nuggets right now and that is impossible to quantify.

KAT is a good passer, he's just not asked to do much of it because he's so skilled that when they get him the ball is for him to score. I'm sure he could do similar things as Jokic passing wise if he was asked to. If you factor that in, Towns is better everywhere else. He almost made the 50/40/90 club this year. That's insane for a 7 footer. He's also got all the leadership intangibles one could ask for. Don't forget, he was the leader of the Kentucky team that went 38-1, and they might have gone 40-0 if they unleashed him more. There are really only two knocks on KAT at this point, and they're largely fixable. He needs to defend better in the paint. He's a great shot blocker, and feasts on guards and wings, but he still struggles against other elite bigs. Not always, but sometimes. The other knock is that he picks up way too many cheap fouls. There's a reason why, when looking at his splits, he's usually better in the second half, and that's because he picked up 2-3 early fouls. Also, I guess he looks really funny when he's jogging up the court (mind you not when he's actually running). He moves like a fat kid. All in all, KAT is the superior talent, both now and going forward. That doesn't mean Jokic isn't worth consideration for top 5 at the position, but his ceiling probably isn't much higher than what you're already getting (his PPG can probably get close to 25 at some point),  while KAT's ceiling is best player in the league. He can be Shaq who shoots 40% from three and 85% at the line. That's scary.  

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EAST

Toronto in 5

Milwaukee in 5 or 6

Heat in 7 (if Embiid misses more than one game, otherwise Philly in 6)

Cleveland in 5

WEST

Houston in 6 (don't forget, the Wolves were the 5th best team in the NBA before Butler went down) though I'm really hoping we get playoff  Harden, and if Wiggins can stop sucking, we might actually have a chance at upsetting them

Warriors in 5

Portland in 6 (probably the funnest match up after Houston-Minny)

OKC in 7 

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2 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Don't forget, he was the leader of the Kentucky team that went 38-1, and they might have gone 40-0 if they unleashed him more.

:crying: 

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Toronto in 5

Milwaukee in 6

Cleveland in 5

Philadelphia in 4

Houston in 5

Golden State in 6

Portland in 6

OKC in 5

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Also, why is Kawhi just literally quitting on his team not one of the bigger stories in recent NBA memory? Just went from one of the most likable players in the league to bottom of the barrel worst.

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41 minutes ago, sperry said:

Also, why is Kawhi just literally quitting on his team not one of the bigger stories in recent NBA memory? Just went from one of the most likable players in the league to bottom of the barrel worst.

And so very un-Spurs-like.

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14 minutes ago, Triskele said:

And so very un-Spurs-like.

 

Pretty sad to see the Pop era end like this. They pretty much have to blow it up this offseason, since they're going to have to trade Kawhi.

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1 hour ago, sperry said:

Also, why is Kawhi just literally quitting on his team not one of the bigger stories in recent NBA memory? Just went from one of the most likable players in the league to bottom of the barrel worst.

Because ESPN and other ridiculous sports media tried shoving the irrelevant LaVar Ball storylines down our throats most of the year.  

Edited by Sour Billy Tipton

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On 13-4-2018 at 7:13 AM, KingintheNorth4 said:

Raptors in 6

Cavs in 5

Sixers in 6

Celtics in 5

Rockets in 4

Thunder in 6

Blazers in 5

Warriors in 5

Raptors are massive betting favorites to beat the Wizards, I think they will struggle more than expected and like you could see 6 games.

However I think Milwaukee has to be beating this Boston team. Boston won't make it.

I think the Sixers will win but it will be tighter than what I see expected on ESPN experts panel.

I think the Rockets will lose at least 1 game to the T-Wolves.

Thunder vs Jazz will be really close, the Jazz have become very good. I'd still say OKC because you can't believe they would let that happen.

I'm also not super sold on Portland beating NO, it could be close. Still, it shouldn't be that close without Cousins, and yet NO has been on a great run.

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33 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

I think the Sixers will win but it will be tighter than what I see expected on ESPN experts panel.

"ESPN experts" that sounds like an oxymoron. 

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1 hour ago, Sour Billy Tipton said:

"ESPN experts" that sounds like an oxymoron. 

Because it is.

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Washington v Raptors is playoff intense from the get go!

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