[TV/Book Spoilers] PTV Unsullied Thread Part 8

[The Onion Sleight]

To come to a much nicer topic than PTV... Some of these NeoGAF Unsullied really made my day ^_^!

I don't know what happend to them or if that are all book walkers :dunno: , but I've never seen so much Stannis love (or at least "like") and understanding and sympathy for him before, I think.

These posts are all from absolutely different users (only two are from the same guy, but the others are written by diverse other posters! Posted yesterday or today.)

Stannis and house Baratheon are interesting but only because they have a direct conflict to the Lannister occupied capital. Davos is one of--if not--the best characters on the entire program. The opening showed that in spades. I want to see more about their future plans to take claim to the throne and less from everyone else.

Nobody cannot love Davos! :wub: And the people are now finally more interested about his and Stannis' future, good thing!

what else. dragon bit was cute, theon's bit was okay. Oh, Ser Davos at the beginning was a nice bit. I liked it. He came across so sincere, believing in Stannis so fervently as the one rightful King and that he somehow would be good at it??? (lol), and trying to salvage something by juggling too many balls in the air. In any case, his earnestness is endearing.

Okay, okay, not yet really love for Stannis, but for Davos (I love his earnestness being called endearing ^__^) and I'll continue...

The VanDerWerff review is great, it compares the characters and their use of power, justice and mercy. Stannis is now the most honorable person in Westeros. Only he can make a man like Davos Seaworth vouch for him, even after he cuts off his fingers.

Review:

Get the blend of power and justice just right, and you might even win something more valuable than the three things outlined above. You just might win someones loyalty.

Thats why maybe the most important scene in this episode is its very first one. Davos and Stannis show up in Braavos to beg for the Iron Bank to back their claim to the throne. The bankers (one of whom is played by Mark Gatiss!) say no, thats not something theyre going to do, but Davos wont hear of it. He immediately begins extolling the virtues of his king, of the man who spared his life and made him a knight but still took his fingers. Game Of Thrones rarely tips its hand as to where it believes these various claimants to the throne to be in relation to each otheroutside of its general love for all things Danybut heres a pretty big moment in relation to this episode. Stannis may not have much, but he has the ability to get men to make huge speeches proclaiming his greatness to rooms full of powerful men. And, ultimately, that might be even more worthwhile than gold.

I'm so fucking happy that there are Unsullied who read something like that! :-)

I totally get not liking the character or being uninterested in his story, but meaningless? What he did this episode was one of the most important things to happen all season, maybe even in the entire series depending on how things play out. With the Iron Bank's support he can gather the resources needed to take another crack at conquering the throne, and/or march north to deal with the looming White Walker threat. It's also essentially a death sentence to the Lannisters.

To me it seems like he simply didn't factor much into the story the past season and a half, but will in a major way down the line, so HBO wanted to keep him in the viewers' consciousness.

Lastly, the character is supposed to be dull and boring and uncharismatic. That's who he is and Stephen Delaney's portrayal is fuckin aces. I love his general aloofness, and how noticeably uncomfortable he becomes when he's out of his element. Still, there this brooding intensity to the guy that no one else has. You may not love him, but learn to like him.....he will be our King.

I'm feeling so happy for this person when he/she will watch 4x09 and see that he/she was so fucking right! (And yes, "...but learn to like him.." is something that will hopefully happen)

Some consider him dull, but Stannis' gloominess and badass theme works for me.

Also nice.

He didn't hit the strip club, he payed the pirate for his services. The pirate happened to be at the strip club/bath house telling off color jokes to hookers.

He also did something no one's ever done and got money from the Iron Bank. Tywin said appealing to the bank like he did was a useless endeavor and yet he did it and succeeded.

All the other surviving rules in the world wish they had people as loyal as Davos is. Stannis has got guys that will do anything for him, by comparison Dany is dealing with mass discontent.

Everyone wants to have a Davos! Another person then disagreed with this user about Dany and discontent (Because, hey, she gets so much love from her freed slaves!), and this user answered to that person:

She's still got to rule over them. There was no reason for her to crucify all those people except her own sense of justice. She didn't bother listening to her advisers telling her it may cause more problems than it solves. So far she's been a revolutionary, not a leader of men. Hopefully she can grow into the role.

EDIT: Also love isn't loyalty. When she can cut a dude's fingers off and they'll still walk through fire for her then that's loyalty.

It's like the Stannis fact (from this super funny facts thread) "He cuts off a men's finger joints and this man falls in love with him / becomes his greatest supporter" (Who else can do this?!)

The iron bank will totally expect Stannis to settle the crown's debts if he actually lands in power for any length of time. Stannis, being an honorable but uptight dude, would probably feel it his duty to at the very least assume the portion accrued in Robert's name but would probably dispute anything racked up under Joff/Tommen/ other intervening "illegitimate" kings.

"Stannis being an honorable, but uptight dude... feel it his duty to at..." Me liking this :)

I actually like Stannis and I think the actor does a great job with the character. He is someone that has never smiled in his life supposedly.

:agree: (Though, Stannis actually smiles few times, in the books and on the show, ...but okay veeeery few times XD)

Ned Stark could have gone straight to Robert with his knowledge of Cersei and Jamie's relationship and the truth of his kids, but he didn't because the kids did nothing wrong. Looking back it was the wrong move as it led to his death, but he had no desire to punish those who had no hand in the wrong doing. Stannis comes off as the same, otherwise Davos wouldn't follow him like he does.

A person before this^ said what Dany did to the 163 slavers was something that also probably Ned and Stannis would have done. This person disagrees absolutely and not only corrects this person about Ned, he/she also compared Ned and Stannis and says none of them both would have done this and both would be similar about this.

Can't wait to see Stannis back in action, that's the only dude that can offer some serious resistance apart from Danny.

Many people now know think so. Nice to see that some Unsullied's interest has grown about Stannis & Co.

I always liked Stannis' cold character. Confident but not arrogant. The whole religion/burning people etc. is the only shitty aspect and I hope he just does it to gain the favors of that god/red witch and not because he's actually a follower (like his crazy wife).

He's also the kind of leader that actually fights (skillfully) on the very front and has to be dragged away from the battle.

So it was great to see that he will be a major player soon again with the Iron Bank backing him. Especially if you care about the people of Westeros as Stannis seems to be the only leader of anything that takes the White Walkers /Wildling threat seriously.

However, I did not like how he was acting spoiled&offended during that meeting, the Onion Knight basically did all of it

Here also someone who brings up the aspect of him doing the religious stuff for gaining favor of Mel/R'hllor and not being a fanactical believer (and the fact that he takes the WW seriously).

This person agrees:

he doesn't seem like a true believer. He's much more pragmatic about it, like this shit works so he might as well use it and become king. And you sometimes get the impression that he has second thoughts about whatever new atrocity the red witch comes up with next.

This is great: (also someone who mentions Mel's intentions (or rather her powers) versus the ulimate villains)

I like stannis because he wants to be a good king and he deserves the crown by right. The only thing that scares me is Melissandre but I'm a little convinced that the Lord of light is real, and her fire skills will be very good vs white walkers which I find to be the true villains of the show. Danny too with her dragons but I find she's too arrogant and naive. She doesn't listen to her advisors who know more than her whereas stannis isn't too proud to listen to others and let them help

I love Stannis but only because he is infuckingsane, the man is as hard as iron they say and will break before he bends. That scene in the Iron Bank perfectly shows off Stannis' character, he just sits there and when the Iron Bank tells him no he just gets up to leave. He doesn't try to negotiate or haggle, in his mind that is too much like pleading and he is not a beggar. When Davos finally speaks up for him he just stands there like a stone he doesn't say one word in his defense because again in his mind that is beneath him. And yet, in the end he gets what he wants. Obviously, Stannis is one of the last fucking person you want sitting on the Iron Throne but as a combat leader you can see why he is so feared.

Haha, okay, maybe "(he) is one of the last fucking person you want sitting on the Iron Throne..." might change somehow yet in the future, but otherwise I love this post!

Stannis is just a guy trying to do the right thing. He doesn't even want to but he has to since it's the right thing to do. He talks about how he's done that in the past constantly. A character motivated by duty rather than personal gain is refreshing.

:bowdown: Amen!

This. Stannis is a soldier and lives by a strict soldier's worldview. Within those confines he's supremely confident and fearless, outside of them his discomfort is palpable. There's just little to no finesse there; every problem is ran through a rote logical filter, 'a + b = c'. Doesn't matter how he feels about you, break the rules, for example, you will be punished accordingly.

Folllow them and you will be rewarded. These qualities make him a natural survivor and effective battle commander, but coupled with his lack of charisma and personality it causes him to come across as starkly robotic and mechanical--someone who doesn't naturally inspire love or loyalty. It's the entire reason his brother, who had these things in spades, tried to usurp his claim.

In a show full of characters who are eccentric, cunning, charismatic, intellectual, master orators etc.. I find the whole meat & potatoes heir about Stannis to be quite appealing and unique. I fully admit he'd make a shitty king outside matters of security, but I'm rooting for him to take the crown all the same.

This user always liked him and understands him very well. I guess, once Stannis saves the Wall, talks to Jon and then does his awesome ADWD stuff he/she will root even more for him (and then maybe even thinking that he would make a great king, 'cause actually this person really understands how Stannis works :)

So... many, many postive posts about Stannis by different guys (They can't be all secret book walkers, can they?), all posted yesterday or today - What happend to the Unsullied? Some even defended him against haters, I think I saw today more positive posts about him than negative... Normally these guys often depress me or make me grind my teeth, but these Unsullied posts made me soooo happy :D!

PTV doesn't interest me any longer, but the NeoGAF crew is actually great! Not only because of all these things^, they also have good thoughts about Dany and her development and they see her ruling problems, and I'm glad to see people who are able to THINK about the whole stuff and are not only: Stannis = boring, useless, evil, fanatic & Dany = awesome Khalessi, badass, white saviour, flawless.

Now I'm even more interested in these Unsullied's opinions about the future episodes :). I think last episode and especially Davos' speech and the fact that he's now again a more powerful and dangerous player, back in the game of thrones, really help Show!Stannis; even there's still much Stannis hate, it gets probably better and as I said before, the people who are now more interested in his next steps will get rewarded with some (hopefully) very awesome scenes & storyline in the future and I have now even more hope for Show!Stannis' portrayal the next episodes and seasons ^_^!

Edit: typos

[Señor de la Tormenta]

Im starting to have hopes they are giving us finally a better Stannis.

Two episodes ago two seasoned commanders as Jorah and Selmy said 11k men were enough to take KL. Stannis already has 4k and the gold to hire many more (he asks for 20k sellswords in the books).

Stannis never had this numbers in the books when he went to the wall. Taking KL with his 1500 men was never an option. Now in the show it might be, and if they paint it that way, with the mannis avoiding the temptation, ill will almost forget D&D for their harm in the past.

I keep my fingers crossed.

[Mr Fixit]

I said earlier that many TWoP/PTV Unsullied hadn't truly come to terms with the bleakness of the show, believing GoT is in the job of killing/otherwise destroying/humiliating likable characters. In that vein:

watching nearly every great moment that Tyrion had, turned against him was disheartening, rather than enraging for me.

The only danger is that we start to feel harangued (...) So if Tyrion is going to be hamstrung on the defendant's stand while all this abuse is coming down, at least allow us a little irony on his behalf.

Is there anything these guys like anymore? Their hearts just don't seem to be in it anymore.

[King Zee]

yeah the PTV crew has lost the plot.

My personal view is that the four or five main posters would be much happier reviewing something by Dickens or Jane Austen. They have fantastic analytical skills but GOT is proving to be something much more complicated and strange and they dont like it anymore.

Note their fixation on the Kings Landing soap opera specifically as related to Cersei and Shae. I dont think its a coincidence they've gravitated to these twenty something-thirty something female characters.

They're bashing Tyrion's speech as forced ? They're "over" Theon and just want him to disappear ?. I tihnk they've also completely missed the significance of Hizdahrs speech. They're also over complicating the necklace plot tyring to bring Pycelle and Tywin in.

Too many characters too many plots. maybe too many " teenage boy" oriented plots ?

Ironically a dumber viewer would be happier with GOT because they'd stop analyzing and just go for the ride. The popular opinion is that the past 3 epsodes have just been fantastic

[Brewmaster]

yeah the PTV crew has lost the plot.

My personal view is that the four or five main posters would be much happier reviewing something by Dickens or Jane Austen. They have fantastic analytical skills but GOT is proving to be something much more complicated and strange and they dont like it anymore.

Honestly I find them fairly insufferable when it comes to other shows too. I never went to TWOP or PTV before GOT, but since then I've peeked in to see what their thoughts are on other shows that I watch. And for the most part, they are a dour, bitter group of curmudgeons that aren't much fun to read. There are some occasional gems in there, from very well thought out, and written posts, but for the most part...I'm over it.

[Darryk]

I said earlier that many TWoP/PTV Unsullied hadn't truly come to terms with the bleakness of the show, believing GoT is in the job of killing/otherwise destroying/humiliating likable characters. In that vein:

watching nearly every great moment that Tyrion had, turned against him was disheartening, rather than enraging for me.

The only danger is that we start to feel harangued (...) So if Tyrion is going to be hamstrung on the defendant's stand while all this abuse is coming down, at least allow us a little irony on his behalf.

Is there anything these guys like anymore? Their hearts just don't seem to be in it anymore.

In that case, their reaction to Oberyn vs the Mountain is going to be pretty funny.

[Widows_Blood]

Honestly I find them fairly insufferable when it comes to other shows too. I never went to TWOP or PTV before GOT, but since then I've peeked in to see what their thoughts are on other shows that I watch. And for the most part, they are a dour, bitter group of curmudgeons that aren't much fun to read. There are some occasional gems in there, from very well thought out, and written posts, but for the most part...I'm over it.

Sounds like they would fit well here.

[gvewolf243]

In that case, their reaction to Oberyn vs the Mountain is going to be pretty funny.

Expect a lot of reaction videos.)

[Independent George]

Sounds like they would fit well here.

You stole my line! I'm definitely a cynical curmudgeon.

Anyway, I think another issue is the way their discussions have been split into multiple threads - the conversations are noticeably less free-flowing, and they're making fewer random connections.

[Haldebrandt]

Honestly I find them fairly insufferable when it comes to other shows too. I never went to TWOP or PTV before GOT, but since then I've peeked in to see what their thoughts are on other shows that I watch. And for the most part, they are a dour, bitter group of curmudgeons that aren't much fun to read. There are some occasional gems in there, from very well thought out, and written posts, but for the most part...I'm over it.

Dunno what you read but the Unsullied are a tiny subset of TWOP, a site that probably boasted thousands of users.

Anyway, I'm glad to see someone else agree that PD's performance in that speech really was over the top, and that he was much better during Shae's testimony. A minority opinion among all the Emmy talk, for sure. Like the Unsullied, I was far more impressed by Jaime and Theon. I really hope PD tones that tuff down going forward.

You stole my line! I'm definitely a cynical curmudgeon.

Anyway, I think another issue is the way their discussions have been split into multiple threads - the conversations are noticeably less free-flowing, and they're making fewer random connections.

At first I didn't like the multiple threads either. But in recent weeks there have been some really great discussions in the character threads.

[ambi76]

If they really want to troll the Unsullied, they can play up the confusion after Oberyn's death and make it look like Tyrion is about to be beheaded on the spot. :devil:

[ebevan91]

If they really want to troll the Unsullied, they can play up the confusion after Oberyn's death and make it look like Tyrion is about to be beheaded on the spot. :devil:

Tywin: "Oh wait, we'll schedule the execution for tomorrow morning."

[Independent George]

Anyway, I'm glad to see someone else agree that PD's performance in that speech really was over the top, and that he was much better during Shae's testimony. A minority opinion among all the Emmy talk, for sure. Like the Unsullied, I was far more impressed by Jaime and Theon. I really hope PD tones that tuff down going forward.

I agree with them, but I'm also one of those people who thinks that Olivier was "way too showy". I've long accepted that my opinions of acting tends to be in the minority.

If they really want to troll the Unsullied, they can play up the confusion after Oberyn's death and make it look like Tyrion is about to be beheaded on the spot. :devil:

I've long thought that's exactly what they should do. Everybody knows shit goes down in E9. With E8 devoted to the duel, it's the perfect setup for a good misdirect.

[Which Tyler]

I love that they're "rethinking Sansa - Vol 1" tonight

[Colonel Green]

They're "over" Theon and just want him to disappear ?

That's a wholly explicable sentiment, to me. While his material has been better this year, spacing the Reek buildup over two seasons has not benefited the story. Viewers who've read the books know where this is going, but without that knowledge, I don't think I would care for this plot at all either.

[Zombies That Were Promised]

Oooo, there's gonna be some angry Unsullied heads turning when they have to suffer the "Boring" Night's Watch for an entire episode and then waiting another whole week to see (what they believe to be) Tyrion's execution - everyone's most favorite character.

[Grayven]

If they really want to troll the Unsullied :devil:

If you love Unsullied trolling.. just wait and see this entire board once the show catches and passes the books. It's going to be glorious.

[ebevan91]

I hate how they'll never know that the sept scene wasn't intended to be rape, cause they always mention it when talking about Jaime and the horrible things he has done.

[Good Guy Garlan]

That's a wholly explicable sentiment, to me. While his material has been better this year, spacing the Reek buildup over two seasons has not benefited the story. Viewers who've read the books know where this is going, but without that knowledge, I don't think I would care for this plot at all either.

Yeah, I was about to say this actually. And it's not just the PTV Unsullied who don't like the Theon/Dreadfort storyline. It's a recurrent sentiment in other Unsullied sites/recap. Hell, I hate that storyline myself, despite being one of my favorites in the books

But overall I agree. The PTV crowd seem like they don't enjoy the show anymore. And I think they'll totally going to hate the Viper's death

[kephv]

The unsullied discontent is entirely the shows fault for handling many plot points so clumsily--something the average viewer won't catch (who the shows clearly made for), but what is definitely caught by sharp viewers like the unsullied. Things like why anyone would ever be stupid enough to trust Littlefinger (a major reason they find it hard to believe he's able to be behind so many things), the coincidence of Sansa wearing the necklace Dontos gave her, the absurdity of Asha's whole arc this season, Stannis' whole arc, why Shae would so easily betray the one she loved, etc.

Anyway, I'm glad to see someone else agree that PD's performance in that speech really was over the top,

I also agree.