Blazfemur Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 actually, truly, it was arya. hitting joffrey in the head with a stick at the river, causing the brain damage that turns joffrey into the monster he became. if you notice, before that scene, he's all prince charming. after the hit from arya, and sansa's chilling foreshadowing line, "no, no stop it! youre ruining it!", clearly arya is the cause for all this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarsbane Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 you cant go on words alone, you need evidence. when you have people like tywin, cersei, people who LOVE power, and would do anything to defend it, you need yourself a compelling case first that leaves NO question. saying, "Your kids are all jaime's.." wouldnt cut it alone. Lack of evidence doesn't stop him from declaring them all bastards AFTER Robert is dead and he is in line to inherit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazfemur Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 He had the proof that he and Jon Arryn collected, a strong circumstantial case. IOW the same proof that Ned had. You say it yourself, Stannis didn't go to his brother because to do so would potentially expose him to the Lannisters, so instead he kept his mouth shut and ran away from KL. Ultimately his inaction sucked Ned in once Robert appointed him Hand, again with suitable prodding from LF. All of the plotting in the world would have meant nothing had Stannis gone to his brother and laid it all out, especially once Jon Arryn died, Stannis must have known that the incest discovery and the sudden death were linked in some way. oh i guarentee it. and you put up a very good argument. still, stannis' not acting, isnt what caused, the war. it definitely helped it spread like fire. but the initial blow is certainly not with him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazfemur Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Truth be told, one could also say, that Robert's Rebellion, put all these actions in motion. Without Robert sitting the throne, none of this would have happened. Tywin wouldve pawned Cersei off to some lordling, while resuming Hand position with Aerys. Dont get me wrong, with Varys feeding Aerys his own paranoia, it wouldve led to a totally different war with people like Robert. Bt if Robert never led his Rebellion? None of today's results would have happened as they did. So blame Robert, not Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Truth be told, one could also say, that Robert's Rebellion, put all these actions in motion. Without Robert sitting the throne, none of this would have happened. Tywin wouldve pawned Cersei off to some lordling, while resuming Hand position with Aerys. Dont get me wrong, with Varys feeding Aerys his own paranoia, it wouldve led to a totally different war with people like Robert. Bt if Robert never led his Rebellion? None of today's results would have happened as they did. So blame Robert, not Stannis. If you're going that route, blame Jon Arryn, not Robert. He's the one who called his banners and refused to send Ned and Robert's heads to Aerys on a platter. It was Jon's Rebellion really. They just called it Robert's because it sounds better since he ended up with his butt in the chair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defeatarion Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 LF never meant to start the war. He just wanted them to let him in.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertPooner Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Definitely that dumb bitch Cat and all her idiotic decisions. Glad she got her neck meat sliced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obsidious Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 I'd say it's a domino effect of incest. - Cersei and Jamie have children.- Discovered by Jon Arryn and killed.- Ned brought to King's Landing as the new Hand.- Also discovers the incest secret and acts on it.- Condemned for treason and ultimately leads to his death.- War breaks out between the North and the South. Also, as an appetizer to get things warmed up, the little part of Catelyn seizing Tryion falls in there as effect to the King and party going to Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester2chainz Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 It was indeed Littlefinger who started this whole mess; if he hadn't convinced Lysa to poison Jon Arryn, there would be no reason to come North to ask Ned to be hand. What does Jon (Snow) have to do with finding out the truth about Bran? and starting a war over it? Robb would of still been head of household at Winterfell. If Robert had still been alive and learned of Cersei and Jamie their heads would of been viewing KL. It was a set of Domino's and Littlefinger gave them a first push. I thought it was fairly obvious I was talking about Jon Arryn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 Cersei and Jaime.Littlefinger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Antony Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 Cersei and Jaime.Littlefinger. Its no single person but yeah id say most of the blame falls on these 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faydra Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 Baelish caused it, Tywin started it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alia Atreides Posted May 12, 2014 Share Posted May 12, 2014 I thought it was fairly obvious I was talking about Jon Arryn I'm sorry it wasn't obvious; the first time I read it.... You posted this: Ser Mack, on 09 May 2014 - 4:31 PM, said: TBH it can't be Lysa or Littlefinger because if Jon found the truth about Cersei and Jaime then war would have broke out Between IT and the west. If anything they delayed the inevitable.. Cersei and Jaime could have kept their mouths shut about Bran. He doesn't really remember what he saw anyways. My vote is for Joff That to me was a bit confusing as the subject context jump from one situation to the other with no paragraph break at all and one small question? What does TBH mean is that another users initials or mean something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shpati Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 If someone can help me out here... I finished the last 3 books in a short time so my memory is all over the place. But did Little Finger have anything to do with the Valyrian Steel Dagger that Joffery gave to the assassin to kill Bran? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazfemur Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 If you're going that route, blame Jon Arryn, not Robert. He's the one who called his banners and refused to send Ned and Robert's heads to Aerys on a platter. It was Jon's Rebellion really. They just called it Robert's because it sounds better since he ended up with his butt in the chair. whether robert or jon, it certainly doesnt fall on stannis, and that was the point i was trying to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King Of Cooked Steak Posted May 13, 2014 Author Share Posted May 13, 2014 If someone can help me out here... I finished the last 3 books in a short time so my memory is all over the place. But did Little Finger have anything to do with the Valyrian Steel Dagger that Joffery gave to the assassin to kill Bran? He pretty much lied to Catelyn that the dagger was Tyrion's when really it was Robert's so as to not cause any stir-ups between the Starks and Robert, leading to Cat arresting Tyrion etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osha13 Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Bran and Jaime Lannister. Without Bran being pushed and almost dying, Catelyn has no need to try to kidnap Tyrion, which is why Tywin went to war and jaime attacked Eddard in the first place. Varys and Littlefinger were trying to enable this conflict between stark and Lannister, but it ended up being an event outside of their actual plans which enabled them to be expedited tremendously. War may have not come so quickly if Bran doesn't get pushed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Broke Howard Hughes Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 Joffrey. Killing Ned assured a war was going to come. One guy's death caused thousands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 It's Robert, for being a shitty drunken king who couldn't notice his wife cheating on him due to him being unable to let go his dead love. He also let the wrong men stay in KL: Jaime, LF, Varys. And completely neglected the care of his heir. The last straw was allowing the killing of Lady. Personally, I think that open Ned's eyes and made him follow the investigation, knowing that KL was ruled by the Lannisters, not the King, and things were a bit odd there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 War was inevitable when Cersei had Jaime father her children and not Robert. LittleFinger prevented a smaller war and the Lannister's demise when he killed JA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.