Good Guy Garlan Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Yeah, that was dumb. Asha: Epic finale speech about saving her brother 6 episodes later Ashe: I've come to rescue you little broth- oh fuck him we out. The Ironborn are so shat on by D&D lol.Yara is the show's Quentyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typhoon Swell Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Yara is the show's Quentyn At least Quentyn's story had a satisfying ending Yara's felt like they were wrapping up the season and suddenly remembered "Oh shit! We were supposed to do something with that." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dany4eva Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 For me the biggest failure is cutting out LSH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beric175 Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 @Dany4eva: because she did soooooooooooooooooooooooo much in the book, right..? @Prince Lou of House Reed: they weren't afraid of Ramsay or the dogs...it's just that Yara had realized that Theon wasn't Theon any longer , hence their expedition had failed from the start and it was pointless to hang about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HousePotterz Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 The two biggest failures in the show in my own opinion have to do with, not surprisingly, one of GRRM's most complex characters: Jaime Lannister. The most glaring is, of course, the rape scene in the Sept of Baelor after Joffrey's death. It's unclear to me how this scene turned out so differently from the one that all involved believed they had filmed. Perhaps a part of it was filmed that showed Cersei eventually wanting what was happening, and then that part was cut in editing. It doesn't matter. The scene that was depicted in the final release was a rape. It's a tough scene even in the book, so I can believe they had difficulty making it a true adaptation, but the final product can only be described as a shocking rape scene that does undermine a lot of the redemption arc that Jaime had already undertaken. What compounds the error of the Sept scene is how they handled Jaime's arc over the rest of season 4, but especially in "The Children." The clearly consensual sex they have in Jaime's quarters was very puzzling to me, given that Jaime's arc, and a major part of his redemption arc, is his rejection of Cersei to the point where by the end of ADWD he doesn't care if she lives or dies. To bring them together at the end of the season didn't sit right with me. But if I had to guess, it will be his freeing of Tyrion that will drive them apart, and eventually he will reach that point (by the end of this season, if we're still speculating). The final error that I think is worth mentioning is the omission of the Tysha reveal in that same episode, also involving Jaime. It's a development that is critical for Tyrion's frame of mind in ADWD, and it isn't as if they show had omitted the Tysha backstory altogether. The scene where he tells Shae and Bronn about her in season one is one of Peter's greatest on the show thus far, and he even mentions Tysha again in Season 4 during one of his scenes with Jaime, and in that scene Jaime looks like he wants to say something to Tyrion, but doesn't. I understand the show expanded Shae's role to Tysha 2.0, but I found both Shae's betrayal of Tyrion and Tyrion's subsequent decision to visit Tywin after Jaime frees him to be forced without the Tysha stuff. It also hurts the show in that I felt like they cast an untalented actress as Shae. She just got demolished by Peter in most of their scenes together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Lou of House Reed Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Beric I undetstand that but they still could have maybe avenged all the flayed IB men that Ramsay killed and taken him out he is their biggest threat after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HouseHarrison Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 There's too many failures to list individually now, the general issue now is they're not accurate to the source material, and the material the show replaces with it is just far less interesting and intelligent. Cutting the Ironborn storyline is probably the worst though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 @Dany4eva: because she did soooooooooooooooooooooooo much in the book, right..? Can you lend me your copy of TWoW ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Smith Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 At least Quentyn's story had a satisfying ending Not sure if serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earth127 Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 How can you know what is in tWoW? And she really doensn't do anything important in Dance or feasts bedsides the kingsmoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daske Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Yes, this is the failure thread, but can't... stop... myself... The Hound's code... surely just because someone says or thinks they have a code doesn't mean they do. So, the Hound is a hypocrite. Ok, fine. Everyone's a cheerleader for the 'grey', conflicted, complicated characters in this story, but heaven forbid when a character says one thing but does another - it is the worst thing ever? Even though it's closer to what most people do in real life, especially parents when talking to their kids, which is maybe relevant here as we are dealing Arya and her surrogate father figure. On the Yara/Ramsay run-away, I think people are underestimating how dangerous such dogs are going to be in this world. Very likely Yara's lot could have defended themselves and killed the dogs, but even if you ignore the fact that these are Ramsay's trained, psycho dogs, in this world without antibiotics just a single bite from any dog like that is probably going to end up being fatal. My flatmate was hospitalised for two days by the freekin cat, and that's in a (relatively) clean house, with soap by the sink, and the cat about 1/5 the size of a Ramsay dog. And Yara had nothing left to fight for, Theon was gone. If he has said 'yes, I'm coming with you' then they may have gone out fighting (or maybe won). Anyway, just my take, I like to look for possible reasons, even if the reasons aren't obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Yes, this is the failure thread, but can't... stop... myself... The Hound's code... surely just because someone says or thinks they have a code doesn't mean they do. So, the Hound is a hypocrite. Ok, fine. Everyone's a cheerleader for the 'grey', conflicted, complicated characters in this story, but heaven forbid when a character says one thing but does another - it is the worst thing ever? Even though it's closer to what most people do in real life, especially parents when talking to their kids, which is maybe relevant here as we are dealing Arya and her surrogate father figure. On the Yara/Ramsay run-away, I think people are underestimating how dangerous such dogs are going to be in this world. Very likely Yara's lot could have defended themselves and killed the dogs, but even if you ignore the fact that these are Ramsay's trained, psycho dogs, in this world without antibiotics just a single bite from any dog like that is probably going to end up being fatal. My flatmate was hospitalised for two days by the freekin cat, and that's in a (relatively) clean house, with soap by the sink, and the cat about 1/5 the size of a Ramsay dog. And Yara had nothing left to fight for, Theon was gone. If he has said 'yes, I'm coming with you' then they may have gone out fighting (or maybe won). Anyway, just my take, I like to look for possible reasons, even if the reasons aren't obvious. They're ironborn. They pay the iron price. The idea they would (a) not be able to kill or seriously wound a shirtless guy in silk pants is ludicrous to start with, that it is then compounded by (b) all standing around while the shirtless guy unlocks the kennel, and © run away from the dogs and then worst of all (d) leave Theon alive, in a dog cage, knowing he's been castrated and tortured to the point of wanting to stay with his torturing instead of giving him a clean death is crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 Yes, this is the failure thread, but can't... stop... myself... The Hound's code... surely just because someone says or thinks they have a code doesn't mean they do. So, the Hound is a hypocrite. Ok, fine. Everyone's a cheerleader for the 'grey', conflicted, complicated characters in this story, but heaven forbid when a character says one thing but does another - it is the worst thing ever? Even though it's closer to what most people do in real life, especially parents when talking to their kids, which is maybe relevant here as we are dealing Arya and her surrogate father figure. Except the Hound is one of the few characters in the books that's completely honest about the fact that he's a dick. One of the least hypocritical, so he's being kind of ooc here. They just included that line because they thought it sounded cool (which it does not). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWeepingKnight Posted April 11, 2015 Share Posted April 11, 2015 Except the Hound is one of the few characters in the books that's completely honest about the fact that he's a dick. One of the least hypocritical, so he's being kind of ooc here. They just included that line because they thought it sounded cool (which it does not). Didn't you know? Any stupid shit D&D do is really super genius when you find an equally stupid excuse and explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWeepingKnight Posted April 11, 2015 Share Posted April 11, 2015 Based on the comments above... is there really dislike for Quentyn's conclusion SIMPLY because you were expecting some victory after Doran's "Fire and Blood" speech? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knez Snow Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Biggest show failuers are inconsistently written dialogues. Its irritating. Some parts seem like chilldren wrote them. I did not realise at first, but once I did it was like in that episode of HIMYM when they all start noticing other peoples faults they did not notice before - it's everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Martell Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Making Stannis a toy for Melisandre, especially making her decide to not kill Davos and go to the North. Although they are changing that this season. He's getting a lot more awesome (as he should be).Their complete abandonment of the Greyjoys. I would be ok with it if they hadn't introduced them in the first place, but leaving them out as a loose plot line is just not acceptable even if I hadn't read the books.Not including pivotal and really awesome scenes with completely unnecessary ones. I feel like they sometimes intentionally force slow actionless episodes at the beginning of the season. Weasel Soup, Jon's story in CoK, NW elections, etc. Sometimes they stretch things out so long just to keep the dynamic of episode 9 as the highest point. They can pack so much more and give constant big hits across the season rather than a slow progression and fewer big hits almost all at the end, some being underwhelming in that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihlus Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Because the latest episode reminded me: Show Brienne. Everything about Show Brienne.-Retarded show-only fight with the Hound.-Very rude and mean-spirited in general. She's just not likeable.-I can't recall her actually doing anything that could really be called "heroic".-Goes to the North and Vale for derpy reasons rather than stay in the Riverlands.-Oh, and she's twice the age of her book counterpart. Just thought I'd nitpick that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Not-Jeyne Westerling.What was the point of changing her story? Why did she need to be a foreigner instead from a noble house in the Westerlands? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocksniffer Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 The two biggest failures in the show in my own opinion have to do with, not surprisingly, one of GRRM's most complex characters: Jaime Lannister. The most glaring is, of course, the rape scene in the Sept of Baelor after Joffrey's death. It's unclear to me how this scene turned out so differently from the one that all involved believed they had filmed. Perhaps a part of it was filmed that showed Cersei eventually wanting what was happening, and then that part was cut in editing. It doesn't matter. The scene that was depicted in the final release was a rape. It's a tough scene even in the book, so I can believe they had difficulty making it a true adaptation, but the final product can only be described as a shocking rape scene that does undermine a lot of the redemption arc that Jaime had already undertaken. What compounds the error of the Sept scene is how they handled Jaime's arc over the rest of season 4, but especially in "The Children." The clearly consensual sex they have in Jaime's quarters was very puzzling to me, given that Jaime's arc, and a major part of his redemption arc, is his rejection of Cersei to the point where by the end of ADWD he doesn't care if she lives or dies. To bring them together at the end of the season didn't sit right with me. But if I had to guess, it will be his freeing of Tyrion that will drive them apart, and eventually he will reach that point (by the end of this season, if we're still speculating). The final error that I think is worth mentioning is the omission of the Tysha reveal in that same episode, also involving Jaime. It's a development that is critical for Tyrion's frame of mind in ADWD, and it isn't as if they show had omitted the Tysha backstory altogether. The scene where he tells Shae and Bronn about her in season one is one of Peter's greatest on the show thus far, and he even mentions Tysha again in Season 4 during one of his scenes with Jaime, and in that scene Jaime looks like he wants to say something to Tyrion, but doesn't. I understand the show expanded Shae's role to Tysha 2.0, but I found both Shae's betrayal of Tyrion and Tyrion's subsequent decision to visit Tywin after Jaime frees him to be forced without the Tysha stuff. It also hurts the show in that I felt like they cast an untalented actress as Shae. She just got demolished by Peter in most of their scenes together. i just rewatched all 4 seasons to get ready and there are bits in all that fall short...but i just gotta address these comments first, i am curious how that scene keeps getting interpreted as rape as you can clearly see her gripping him and responding to the point that she has her legs wrapped around him....in addition he had one fucking hand and for at least the time it takes to untie his pants and whip old stumpy out he has no hand to grip her...if she wanted to stop, why didn't she use that opportunity to twist away...just saying second, because they changed tyrions escape and left out tysha, they also left out cersei is fucking osmond kettleblack, lancel and moonboy...words that jamie obsesses over during his transformative period third, tyrion goes straight to kill daddy in show as a result of him sentencing him to death though tywin knows tyrion to be innocent...it is really about a lifetime of hate coming to a head...and surely tyrion believes he will never see old pops again since he has to flee for his life, so why not settle old debts...in book it is mostly about tysha in show it is the sum of the hatred and abuse ...just my not so humble opinion...feel free to disagree... :smoking: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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