NFL Draft: Every pick is a Pro Bowler!

[Fez]

Okay, here's the whole NFL letter (bolded by me):

"The New England Patriots were notified today of the following discipline that has been imposed for violations of the NFL Policy on Integrity of the Game and Enforcement of Competitive Rules relating to the use of under-inflated footballs in the AFC Championship Game of this past season:

For the violation of the playing rules and the failure to cooperate in the subsequent investigation, the New England Patriots are fined $1 million and will forfeit the club’s first-round selection in the 2016 NFL Draft and the club’s fourth-round selection in the 2017 NFL Draft. If the Patriots have more than one selection in either of these rounds, the earlier selection shall be forfeited. The club may not trade or otherwise encumber these selections.

Patriots owner Robert Kraft advised Commissioner Roger Goodell last week that Patriots employees John Jastremski and James McNally have been indefinitely suspended without pay by the club, effective on May 6th. Neither of these individuals may be reinstated without the prior approval of NFL Executive Vice President of Football Operations Troy Vincent. If they are reinstated by the Patriots, Jastremski is prohibited from having any role in the preparation, supervision, or handling of footballs to be used in NFL games during the 2015 season. McNally is barred from serving as a locker room attendant for the game officials, or having any involvement with the preparation, supervision, or handling of footballs or any other equipment on game day.

Quarterback Tom Brady will be suspended without pay for the first four games of the 2015 regular season for conduct detrimental to the integrity of the NFL. Brady may participate in all off-season, training camp and pre-season activities, including pre-season games.

Commissioner Goodell authorized the discipline that was imposed by NFL Executive President Troy Vincent, pursuant to the commissioner’s disciplinary authority under the NFL Constitution and Bylaws and the Collective Bargaining Agreement with the NFL Players Association.

“We reached these decisions after extensive discussion with Troy Vincent and many others,” Commissioner Goodell said. “We relied on the critical importance of protecting the integrity of the game and the thoroughness and independence of the Wells report.”

Following are excerpts from Troy Vincent’s letters to the Patriots and Tom Brady:

From Troy Vincent’s letter to the Patriots:
“On May 6th, independent investigator Ted Wells issued his report regarding the footballs used by the Patriots in this year’s AFC Championship Game. That report established that the footballs used by the Patriots were inflated at a level that did not satisfy the standard set forth in the NFL’s Official Playing Rules and that the condition of the footballs was the result of deliberate actions by employees of the Patriots. The activities of the Patriots’ employees were thoroughly documented in the report, including through a series of text messages and telephone communications, as well as evidence of a breach in pre-game protocol. In addition, the conclusions were supported by extensive scientific analysis, as detailed in the report.
“Based on the extensive record developed in the investigation and detailed in the Wells report, and after full consideration of this matter by the Commissioner and the Football Operations department, we have determined that the Patriots have violated the NFL's Policy on Integrity of the Game and Enforcement of Competitive Rules, as well as the Official Playing Rules and the established guidelines for the preparation of game footballs set forth in the NFL’s Game Operations Policy Manual for Member Clubs. In making this determination, we have accepted the findings contained in the comprehensive report independently prepared by Mr. Wells and his colleagues.
“In determining that a violation occurred, we applied the standard of proof stated in the Integrity of the Game Policy: namely, preponderance of the evidence, meaning that ‘as a whole, the fact sought to be proved is more probable than not.’ This is a well-recognized legal standard, which is applied in courts and workplaces every day throughout the country. The evidence gathered during the investigation and reviewed in the report more than satisfy this standard and demonstrate an ongoing plan by at least certain Patriots’ employees to deflate footballs, to do so in a secretive manner after the game officials have certified the footballs as suitable for play, and to hide these activities even from their own supervisors.
“As you know, we regard violations of competitive rules as significant and deserving of a strong sanction, both to punish the actual violation and to deter misconduct in the future. In this case, the footballs were intentionally deflated in an effort to provide a competitive advantage to Tom Brady after having been certified by the game officials as being in compliance with the playing rules. While we cannot be certain when the activity began, the evidence suggests that January 18th was not the first and only occasion when this occurred, particularly in light of the evidence referring to deflation of footballs going back to before the beginning of the 2014 season.
“It is impossible to determine whether this activity had an effect on the outcome of games or what that effect was. There seems little question that the outcome of the AFC Championship Game was not affected. But this has never been a significant factor in assessing discipline. There are many factors which affect the outcome of a game. It is an inherently speculative exercise to try to assign specific weight to any one factor. The key consideration in any case like this is that the playing rules exist for a reason, and all clubs are entitled to expect that the playing rules will be followed by participating teams. Violations that diminish the league's reputation for integrity and fair play cannot be excused simply because the precise impact on the final score cannot be determined.
“Here, there are several factors that merit strong consideration in assessing discipline. The first is the club’s prior record. In 2007 the club and several individuals were sanctioned for videotaping signals of opposing defensive coaches in violation of the Constitution and Bylaws. Under the Integrity of the Game Policy, this prior violation of competitive rules was properly considered in determining the discipline in this case.

“Another important consideration identified in the Policy is ‘the extent to which the club and relevant individuals cooperated with the investigation.’ The Wells report identifies two significant failures in this respect. The first involves the refusal by the club’s attorneys to make Mr. McNally available for an additional interview, despite numerous requests by Mr. Wells and a cautionary note in writing of the club’s obligation to cooperate in the investigation. The second was the failure of Tom Brady to produce any electronic evidence (emails, texts, etc.), despite being offered extraordinary safeguards by the investigators to protect unrelated personal information. Although we do not hold the club directly responsible for Mr. Brady’s refusal to cooperate, it remains significant that the quarterback of the team failed to cooperate fully with the investigation.
“Finally, it is significant that key witnesses – Mr. Brady, Mr. Jastremski, and Mr. McNally - were not fully candid during the investigation.
“In accepting the findings of the report, we note that the report identified no evidence of wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing on the part of any member of the coaching staff, including Head Coach Bill Belichick, or by any Patriots’ staff member other than Mr. Jastremski and Mr. McNally, including head equipment manager Dave Schoenfeld. Similarly, the Wells report is clear that Patriots ownership and executives did not participate in any way in the misconduct, or have knowledge of the misconduct.

“Nonetheless, it remains a fundamental principle that the club is responsible for the actions of club employees. This principle has been applied to many prior cases. Thus, while no discipline should or will be imposed personally on any owner or executive at the Patriots, discipline is appropriately imposed on the club.”

From Troy Vincent’s letter to Tom Brady:

“With respect to your particular involvement, the report established that there is substantial and credible evidence to conclude you were at least generally aware of the actions of the Patriots’ employees involved in the deflation of the footballs and that it was unlikely that their actions were done without your knowledge. Moreover, the report documents your failure to cooperate fully and candidly with the investigation, including by refusing to produce any relevant electronic evidence (emails, texts, etc.), despite being offered extraordinary safeguards by the investigators to protect unrelated personal information, and by providing testimony that the report concludes was not plausible and contradicted by other evidence.

“Your actions as set forth in the report clearly constitute conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the game of professional football. The integrity of the game is of paramount importance to everyone in our league, and requires unshakable commitment to fairness and compliance with the playing rules. Each player, no matter how accomplished and otherwise respected, has an obligation to comply with the rules and must be held accountable for his actions when those rules are violated and the public’s confidence in the game is called into question.”

SpyGate strikes again!

[Rockroi]

When you start an investigation, over nothing, you hope and pray that the people you are investigating do something to justify the punishment that you already have in mind. Sure, you hope to uncover something, but you know you probably won't.

It was the McNally 5th interview that the Pats refused to help with- thankfully, that is the "non-cooperation" the NFL and their owners will gratefully hang their hat on. Because that was what this investigation was about the whole time- aggravate the Pats, get their phones and emails and eventually they will get fed up with this non-sense and screw up and BOOM! You can justify ... a first-round draft pick and a 4th round pick (the Saints- in an operation designed to injure other players, lost only two second-round picks; a million-dollar fine (largest in league history IIRC) and a 4 game suspension for the QB... while Ray Rice got two.

You guys wanted me to go nuts when the punishment got handed out, but its so absurd; so utterly biased; so clear;y managed and advanced by the other owners, so designed ahead of time (I mean... why do the sting operation if having under-inflated balls is SUCH an advantage? You played a whole half like that?!?!? Why, if it was sooooo unfair?)- its so absurd (even this very board, virtually everyone agrees its too much), that my comments don't need to go any further.

The absurdity speaks for itself.

[James Arryn]

Again to me it's more about did Brady

A) Have an issue with balls, chew a guy out, was assured it wouldn't happen again, and didn't know the way that issue was being resolved or whether the balls were below the legal limit

or

B ) did Brady in any way know that the balls were below the legal limit and that it was breaking the rules.

or worst case scenario

C) did he actually say "screw the rules" I want the balls below the legal limit because I think it helps me.

To me it's very plausible Brady knew something. The extent of which, and whether it was a clear knowledge of the rules being violated is up for debate. And in Brady's case that's pretty relevant to how he is held accountable. It's one thing to say "hey these balls were hard as f'ing rocks, don't let it happen again", and "hey I want the balls below the legal threshold".

I'm assuming that if you're fucking with the air pressure for the balls Tom Brady is going to use in the game and not using any kind of calibration, then you definitely are using 'what Tom wants' as your rubric. Imagine it the other way; screwing with the air pressure and telling Brady to like it or lump it. Sound plausible to you?

So, to me, the 'lack of measurement' argument actually implies Brady's direct involvement more so than otherwise. You get a number you know he likes, that's repeatable. But if it's a 'feel' thing, only one guy's feelings actually matter.

Rock, are you seriously arguing that the NFL is interested in marginalizing it's poster boy player and perennial top merchandising franchise because of...something? You think that the origins of this are outside the Patriots? You think this is something the league is actually happy about it being a thing?

Anyways, as with any argument with many people on either side, there WiLL be a cogent narrative to back up your side in this at some point. Don't know what, but it's certain that some argument will come along to hang your hat on, at which time you can break out the all caps more effectively. It would be awesome if you were the Pats fan who comes up with it, so please keep plugging away.

[Jaime L]

SpyGate strikes again!

I bet the random 2017 4th rounder was due to Spygate 2.0

I love Goodell's repeated use of "appropriately" in the report. That word doesn't mean what he thinks it means.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

I'll just leave this here.

http://s1336.photobucket.com/user/Lumpy67/media/Brady%20Bunch%20Deflated_zpsr3jvnumd.jpg.html

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

And anyone notice who's on the Pats schedule in Week 5?

[Rockroi]

And anyone notice who's on the Pats schedule in Week 5?

Not going to look; guessing Colts.

I was wrong. Technically speaking, Dallas is the Pats Week 5 opponent (Pats have a BYE week in week 4).

The first opponent Brady will play in 2015 will be the Colts after his suspension is over***. Its already the Sunday Night game.

I'm sure its just a remarkable coincidence.

*** Its going to get knocked down to 2 games, at least. All of this will be moot.

The fact that it will get knocked down to 2 and that 2 sill be the final number is INFURIATING because it makes people think that two is acceptable, which is lunacy.

[Reny of Storms End]

Rock you can't really believe all the other owners conspired against the Pats right?

[Rockroi]

Rock you can't really believe all the other owners conspired against the Pats right?

I never said that.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Rock you can't really believe all the other owners conspired against the Pats right?

Yeah, you have to employ Occam's Razor here. The answer is obvious...

http://s1336.photobucket.com/user/Lumpy67/media/Garoppolo_zpsk6lwu5wm.jpg.html

[Reny of Storms End]

I never said that.

So what did you mean by this?

"You guys wanted me to go nuts when the punishment got handed out, but its so absurd; so utterly biased; so clear;y managed and advanced by the other owners,"

[Bronn Stone]

Rockroi did not say what he said. You can't trust him when he quotes himself.

[Rockroi]

Sorry; I confused the platforms I was talking on.

I should have said that this was done to appease the other owners. That was what I said in the other place I was on.

My mistake.

Still an absurd decision.

[sperry]

I don't agree with taking away the draft picks, since the conclusion was that the organization as a whole wasn't aware.

A 4 game suspension seems just about right, though. You get 4 games for a PED. 4 games for a different form of premeditated cheating seems about right.

And bringing up the Ray Rice situation is ridiculous, because everyone and their dog knew from teh beginning that that suspension was a joke. If you want to follow that flawed logic, then why don't we bring up the fact that Josh Gordon is getting a full year's suspension for drinking some beer on a plane. If we're comparing severity of offenses, Brady ought to be gone for about 4 years by that metric.

[James Arryn]

Sorry; I confused the platforms I was talking on.

I should have said that this was done to appease the other owners. That was what I said in the other place I was on.

My mistake.

Still an absurd decision.

If you've answered this and I missed it, apologies, but I'm still curious as to why you think they did this if it comes with no competitive advantage. How does this play in Rock's head?

[trickster]

Which is why Brady's numbers on the road (where Brady would have no chance to doctor the ball) are vastly worse than his numbers at home:

Home Games Road Games

Passer Rating 100.2 99.7

Passing Yards per Game 271.8 274.3

TD-to-Interception Differential Plus-96 Plus-96

And by "vastly worse" I mean "completely indistinguishable."

Seriously, he just likes the footballs to be a certain way; no evidence it ever impacted a single game ever.

IamnowcontractuallyobligatedtomentionthatthisisnotthepointandthatitsaboutfollowingtherulesblahblahblahblahBobLoblawblahblahblah.

SO I WILL JUST LEAVE THIS HERE:

http://yourteamcheats.com/

Your team is a cheating cheater who cheats. All of them.

Don't want to start another rant from rock. But a good chunk of those home games were played in pretty bad weather. With an outdoor stadium, NE probably presents one of the most challenging conditions for playing football. May be softer balls did help Brady perform as well as he did in the bad weather home games? :leaving:

[Rockroi]

Don't want to start another rant from rock. But a good chunk of those home games were played in pretty bad weather. With an outdoor stadium, NE probably presents one of the most challenging conditions for playing football. May be softer balls did help Brady perform as well as he did in the bad weather home games? :leaving:

Recall a game ~3-4 years ago against Chicago where the Pats were playing in a blizzard.

Brady had a "good" game. Seriously, there is little evidence this helped anyone do anything. Except that that was the way he liked them. .

[Reny of Storms End]

Sorry; I confused the platforms I was talking on.

I should have said that this was done to appease the other owners. That was what I said in the other place I was on.

My mistake.

Still an absurd decision.

No worries, was just trying to understand your position.

[trickster]

Recall a game ~3-4 years ago against Chicago where the Pats were playing in a blizzard.

Brady had a "good" game. Seriously, there is little evidence this helped anyone do anything. Except that that was the way he liked them. .

It does make it easier to catch the ball, probably easier to hold onto the ball and not fumble in the cold. But then again no other NE player seems to be involved in any of this. May be Brady has a soft ball fetish :dunno:

If Brady had nothing to do with this, then as I mentioned earlier, he has decided that protecting his privacy is more important than keeping his professional reputation intact.

[Rockroi]

If Brady had nothing to do with this, then as I mentioned earlier, he has decided that protecting his privacy is more important than keeping his professional reputation intact.

I can't imagine he had "nothing" to do with this; I think it was something where he made it known he does not like over-inflated balls and then they decided to take matters into their own hands after that.