NFL Draft: Every pick is a Pro Bowler!

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

It's not the sting operation that's a problem. It's that it was an incompetent sting operation where they didn't even record the pressure after inspection and let half the game go by with potentially doctored equipment.

51-49 is pretty generous given what's actually said in the wells report.

[Rockroi]

The league really went after Pittsburgh, San Francisco, and Dallas during their equal or more successful runs.

Different league.

Different leadership.

Different interests.

[Jace, Extat]

Different league.

Different leadership.

Different interests.

I'm reminded of Season 1 Episode 1.

Maester Luwin: A different time, a different King...

Remember how that ended up?

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

It will be fun to see if some news outlet doesn't float a fat check to one of these two Jamokes before Kraft does.

[Jaime L]

It's not the sting operation that's a problem. It's that it was an incompetent sting operation where they didn't even record the pressure after inspection and let half the game go by with potentially doctored equipment.

51-49 is pretty generous given what's actually said in the wells report.

Really, did you read the texts of those equipment managers? http://deadspin.com/the-hilarious-brady-bashing-texts-sent-by-the-pats-bal-1702598756

They freaking call Brady "the deflator". Not only that but it's clear they were doing it during multiple games during the season. I would say a 95% chance of Brady being involved with this is hopelessly conservative.

[Kalbear]

This makes the whole everything look bad. There's not a single thing good about it. It sucks that the Pats were cheating about something so completely trivial. It sucks that Brady lied about it and acted like he was just called out cheating on his wife and tried to gaslight all of us. It sucks that Belichick actually looks like a good guy in this who backed his QB, probably didn't know a fucking thing about it, and still gets hosed. It sucks that Goodell mismanaged everything again and that Ray Rice and AP still look like they got off light, but letting air out of balls gets 4 weeks and a million bucks and two draft picks. The conspiracy theories suck, the clutching of pearls about the NFL's integrity of the game sucks.

The whole thing makes me like the whole sport less.

[dbunting]

Ridiculous overreaction by the NFL. Ray Rice is seen on video dragging his fiancee out of an elevator and he intially gets 2 games. Brady "most likely knew" about delation of balls and he gets 4?!?!?!?!? People using steroids or cocaine get 4 games, those are against the rules and ILLEGAL.

So liking a ball softer is worse than beating a woman, until public steps in. Cmon NFL get it together.

[Rockroi]

They freaking call Brady "the deflator". Not only that but it's clear they were doing it during multiple games during the season. I would say a 95% chance of Brady being involved with this is hopelessly conservative

IIRC, one of the "Jamokes" - either McNally or the other one- called themselves "the deflator"; not Brady.

I think these guys got heat from Brady in one form or another wherein Brady said that he liked the balls at or very near 12.5, if not lower, BUT that the refs are the ones who fill the balls IF, after they measure, a ball comes in under 12.5; hence why after the Jets game, there is a text where McNally or the other guy complains that the refs "screwed" them by taking a ball and inflating it up to 16. So, I think these guys were in a predicament; do we inflate balls at 12.5 and then take the risk that a ref will, on his own, just fill them up way high? Or do we just put in footballs we know Brady does not like?

I think Brady was "involved" on only insofar as he knew that a couple of equipment guys were making sure the balls got to the field the way Brady wanted them; I HIGH:Y DOUBT that Brady was making guys jump into bathrooms to deflate footballs.

And I am starting to lose my mind on the McNally thing. Imagine being that guy.

"Com in for an interview"

"Sure"

"Okay come in for another interview where we only highlight those problems we had with your first interview... and make you look stupid. BTW, we are all lawyers and you are an equipment guy."

"Sure."

"Okay, we need a third interview because we now want to take the stuff you said the first time, and parse it with the stuff you said the second time and make it seem like you are a dishonest jerk who is got something to hide. Also, we are going to make you feel Soooooo fucking stupid this whole time. I mean, like that time we asked you 'Why did you go to that bathroom' and you said 'To use the urinal' and we jumped all over you because that bathroom only had a toilet; no urinal!' J'ACCUSE!!!!!!!!"

"Ah... okay ... but, guys, you know I have another job and a life and stuff to do, right?"

"Okay, but now we want a fourth interview so, again, we can act smart and superior and the searcher of truth and you can look like an air-brained underling who has no idea what is going on and hiding stuff. You idiot!"

"Whatever, okay so I have now been interviewed FOUR times, that's it, right?"

"NOPE! Fifth times a charm! We need more opportunities to invade your life and privacy and catch you in meaningless, trivial contradictions that would never make a judge bat an eyelash,but to us?!?!? FUCK YOU YOU CRIMINAL!!!!!!"

"No."

CHEATERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fucking hate this.

[DanteGabriel]

All I want to say has more or less been said. The only way this ridiculous punishment makes any sense after the Wells report cleared Belichick and the organization itself is that the Pats are being punished for the institutional arrogance of defying the league in this ham-fisted investigation with some fairly transparent lies about McNally's availability.

It's still fucking ridiculous. I guess Goodell has now proven he's not Kraft's boy. So Richard Sherman got proved wrong about something. Yaaay Commissioner Weathervane. Fuck Goodell. I hope this is the beginning of the end for his career as an overpaid handmaiden to billionaires.

And no one will ever convince me that this was NOT a sting operation by the league and that dickhead ex-Jets exec who runs game operations, who was there at the AFC Championship. If Walt Anderson had been notified in advance that there may be shenanigans with the balls, and Anderson knew that the balls had been out of his view for a few minutes, why play the fucking first half with those balls? You don't even have to notify the Pats, or whatever argument BearShin is making -- just use the other fucking set of balls. The alternate balls were already on their way to the field when Deflator McNally turned up with the under-inflated balls. This whole thing stinks, but at least the NFL got what they wanted: cover for their own fuckups and enough of a pretext to bring the hammer down on an organization that has been treating the rest of the NFL like Benedict Cumberbatch's Sherlock treats regular cops.

And no one will ever convince me that this would have been as much of a big fucking stink if Goodell hadn't had to endure a season's worth of being shat on from every angle for the sweetheart treatment Bisciotti initially convinced him to give Ray Rice.

The Pats should have taken a different tack from the beginning: brought a ball out to apologize for being underinflated and causing this mess. Then I'm sure Goodell would have been much more lenient.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

All I want to say has more or less been said. The only way this ridiculous punishment makes any sense after the Wells report cleared Belichick and the organization itself is that the Pats are being punished for the institutional arrogance of defying the league in this ham-fisted investigation with some fairly transparent lies about McNally's availability.

It's still fucking ridiculous. I guess Goodell has now proven he's not Kraft's boy. So Richard Sherman got proved wrong about something. Yaaay Commissioner Weathervane. Fuck Goodell. I hope this is the beginning of the end for his career as an overpaid handmaiden to billionaires.

And no one will ever convince me that this was NOT a sting operation by the league and that dickhead ex-Jets exec who runs game operations, who was there at the AFC Championship. If Walt Anderson had been notified in advance that there may be shenanigans with the balls, and Anderson knew that the balls had been out of his view for a few minutes, why play the fucking first half with those balls? You don't even have to notify the Pats, or whatever argument BearShin is making -- just use the other fucking set of balls. The alternate balls were already on their way to the field when Deflator McNally turned up with the under-inflated balls. This whole thing stinks, but at least the NFL got what they wanted: cover for their own fuckups and enough of a pretext to bring the hammer down on an organization that has been treating the rest of the NFL like Benedict Cumberbatch's Sherlock treats regular cops.

And no one will ever convince me that this would have been as much of a big fucking stink if Goodell hadn't had to endure a season's worth of being shat on from every angle for the sweetheart treatment Bisciotti initially convinced him to give Ray Rice.

The Pats should have taken a different tack from the beginning: brought a ball out to apologize for being underinflated and causing this mess. Then I'm sure Goodell would have been much more lenient.

Pretty much, yes. Though I think the pressure came from the other owners rather than the public.

Also, Kraft stuck behind Goodell during the Ray Rice debacle. So this is partially on him.

[Mazrick]

Wow, as a Cowboys fan, I'm generally ambivalent to patriots, aside from finding the hoodie generally being an interesting figure, but the NFL went full retard here. The punishment certainly didn't meet the crime, and it felt more like a PR move for the league to try to regain some sort of credibility after the shit run they've had. Seriously, deflating the balls had no effect on the game, and many other people, including the best QB in the league, agreed to fudging this kind of stuff in the past.

Guess I shouldn't have expected more from Goodell. Now, I hope that the Pats come out next year and tear up the league like they did after Spygate. A berth in the Superbowl, and losing to the Cowboys in an exciting game sounds just like what the doctor ordered! :P

[DanteGabriel]

Pretty much, yes. Though I think the pressure came from the other owners rather than the public.

Also, Kraft stuck behind Goodell during the Ray Rice debacle. So this is partially on him.

I was pretty annoyed that Kraft stuck up for Goodell then, but at that point Goodell had already had his golf game with Bisciotti and played see-no-evil with the elevator tape, so it's not like Kraft was responsible for Goodell's initial fuckup with the Rice penalty.

[Jaime L]

It's still fucking ridiculous. I guess Goodell has now proven he's not Kraft's boy. So Richard Sherman got proved wrong about something. Yaaay Commissioner Weathervane. Fuck Goodell. I hope this is the beginning of the end for his career as an overpaid handmaiden to billionaires.

I think the most interesting aspect to watch going forwardis Goodell effectively is now biting the hand that feeds him. He could levy insane punishments against the Skins and Cowboys during the uncapped year and on the Saints for Bountygate because he had the full backing of some of the most powerful owners - Mara and Kraft especially. I think it was clear the whole "we expect an apology from the league" thing was a shot across Goodell's bow to not fuck with Kraft on this. He was fanatically "upholding the integrity of the league" in the batshit crazy manner he perceives it and he had enough backing to do it.

But now he's like a rabid dog lashing out irrationally at everyone. This is the moment where his minders finally start meaningfully talking about putting him down.

To the point earlier in the thread, this is why you care that your commissioner is incompetent as an owner even though you're making money hand over fist. The capriciousness of his rulings and his bullshit rationale could be turned on you someday.

[Fez]

Kraft may have more influence than most owners, but he's still only 1 of 32 votes when it comes down to it. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Goodell asked around and found that a majority of owners supported harsh penalties on the Patriots; some of whom only felt that way because they wanted to see the Patriots hurt after all their continued successes.

[Reny of Storms End]

Can Pats fans please stop acting like their team was punished due to them being too dominate of a team. You actually have to have multiple championships won in the last ten seasons for that to even be close to true. Maybe you could have played this angle in 2005, but now it just robs you of the chance for sympathy from around the league.

ETA: I get the Pats have also been very successful during the regular season in the last decade, and been to three Super Bowls. But that is not unique to just the Pats, there have been many teams with the same level or greater success since the 2005 season. Though I could see how it might piss of the owners of like the Jags, but that would be directed at the Giants, Colts, Steelers, Saints, Broncos, and Ravens as well.

[DanteGabriel]

Can Pats fans please stop acting like their team was punished due to them being too dominate of a team. You actually have to have multiple championships won in the last ten seasons for that to even be close to true. Maybe you could have played this angle in 2005, but now it just robs you of the chance for sympathy from around the league.

ETA: I get the Pats have also been very successful during the regular season in the last decade, and been to three Super Bowls. But that is not unique to just the Pats, there have been many teams with the same level or greater success since the 2005 season. Though I could see how it might piss of the owners of like the Jags, but that would be directed at the Giants, Colts, Steelers, Saints, Broncos, and Ravens as well.

You don't think the owners of, oh, say, the Ravens and the Colts, at least, would feel a little bit axe-grindy about the Pats? Especially since they seem to be most implicated in the possible sting by the league in the AFC Championship Game?

I also think there's something else at play besides being dominant -- Belichick is an arrogant asshole who pisses off a lot of his colleagues and the press. Hence my comparison to the Cumberbatch Sherlock Holmes. I believe a lot of the lightning rod status of the Pats is because people in power and people who shape opinion don't like Belichick.

[BormonReborn]

Can Pats fans please stop acting like their team was punished due to them being too dominate of a team. You actually have to have multiple championships won in the last ten seasons for that to even be close to true. Maybe you could have played this angle in 2005, but now it just robs you of the chance for sympathy from around the league.

ETA: I get the Pats have also been very successful during the regular season in the last decade, and been to three Super Bowls. But that is not unique to just the Pats, there have been many teams with the same level or greater success since the 2005 season. Though I could see how it might piss of the owners of like the Jags, but that would be directed at the Giants, Colts, Steelers, Saints, Broncos, and Ravens as well.

Well its sort of true though. The Patriots have been dominate for more than a decade... and I don't think any team has had greater success, even since 2005. (Look how many AFC Championship games and Superbowl appearances). The problem is, in this day and age of league parity... the Patriots shouldn't have been able to sustain the success. So in the eye of public opinion, they must have cheated.

For the first time, I have read the "damning" texts. Brady makes no attempt to hide that he likes the balls deflated to the lowest possible PSI. And like MOST NFL QB's he is picky about the game balls. HOWEVER there is no indication that he asked anyone to lower them beyond the game legal limit. This is a PR witch hunt for Goodell. I think Brady will win his appeal hands down.

[Reny of Storms End]

You don't think the owners of, oh, say, the Ravens and the Colts, at least, would feel a little bit axe-grindy about the Pats? Especially since they seem to be most implicated in the possible sting by the league in the AFC Championship Game?

I also think there's something else at play besides being dominant -- Belichick is an arrogant asshole who pisses off a lot of his colleagues and the press. Hence my comparison to the Cumberbatch Sherlock Holmes. I believe a lot of the lightning rod status of the Pats is because people in power and people who shape opinion don't like Belichick.

Good points, hadn't considered it that way.

ETA: Bormon since the 05 season the Giants and Steelers have more championships, and the Steelers have played in the same number of Super Bowls. Peyton has the same record in Super Bowls as the Pats since the 05 season. Yes they have been a dominate force, but more like one of five or six as opposed to all by itself.

[grozeng]

I think everyone agrees Brady cheated and should be punished and that the punishment was ridiculous.

Let's talk about some more meaningful stuff like how the first home game back (where they may raise the banners) will be against the Jets. Yayyyy.

[Kalbear]

I think it's more to do with the notion that the nfl believes Brady and the pats lied and hindered the investigation. It's very akin to how the NCAA works - where they rely heavily on self policing and that the worst thing a team can do isn't break the rules - it's cover up and lie about breaking the rules.

Which is bullshit there and bullshit here, but it's vaguely logical in a self serving process over results way.