arwyn-t Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 As we all know, Aerys and Rhaella were very unfortunate with children. One son, Rhaegar, born alright and then a series of tragedies. Has anyone wondered why? A possible scientific answer to this question/mystery hit me just now: Plain old Rhesus factor and Rhesus Disease. Rhaella was Rhesus negative. Aerys Rhesus positive. Or some Valyrian equivalent to that. The children got to be either positive or negative. I will spare you the medical mumbo jumbo. The simple story is that Rhaella's immune system, her blood, clashed with her babies' blood and the babies were either miscarried, stillborn or short lived. The first child, first pregnancy, when of a Rh positive child, causes the mother's immune system to fire up during birth, when mother's and baby's blood may mingle. The first baby is OK though. However, once the immune system is fired up, then every positive baby after, embryo or newborn, is recognized as foreign and its blood attacked. Only the babies after that get to have the mother's Rhesus type, negative, are alright. Every positive baby is doomed. And chances of a positive baby are larger than negative, due to the complicated Rhesus genes. Nowadays, this is prevented by modern medicine that gives the mother a nice injection that prevents her immune system to act against her child's blood. In Westeros though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shockwave Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 they were probably poisoned. Aerys did his crazy precautions with Viserys, and he lived. Also Rhaella was pregnant with Daenaerys on Dragonstone and the child lived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I don't see what is the point of this thread. Can we test Rhaella and Aerys? No. Lysa had at least two stillborns and many miscarriages like her mother, when Rhaella had only two stillborns. After all just like in Medieval times, Westeros hadn't 21st century medicine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~DarkHorse~ Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Maybe the emotional trauma and abuse Rhaella was going through took it's toll. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lord of the Crossing Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 they were probably poisoned. Aerys did his crazy precautions with Viserys, and he lived. Also Rhaella was pregnant with Daenaerys on Dragonstone and the child lived. Pycelle. Pycelle probably did them in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tucu Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Centuries of incest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinoiserie Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Interesting. I think there could be just a simple explanation for the missarreages, stillborns and babies dying in infancy rather than some conspiracy theory or vague "incest" that seems not to have even been problem for the Targaryens before. GRRM probably mainly neened a reason for the large age difference between Rhaegar and Viserys and rather large one between him and Daenerys. The dead children became one part of why Aerys had mental issues. Not that conspiraces are impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bent branch Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I believe that Pycelle was killing the babies and gaslighting Aerys. Here is a link to the Wikipedia article on gaslighting. Pycelle was basically killing Aerys and Rhaella's children and then making Aerys look crazy for believing that someone was killing his children. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raving Stark the Mad Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Seems like a plausible explanation. Hard to prove it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dornishdame Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 Incest seems a plausible explanation - just look at the Habsburgs - but Rhesus Positive/Negative is also a good theory. The infamous Don Carlos II of Spain (husband first to Marie Louise of France and latterly to Maria Anna of Neuberg) shows the consequences of decades of incest akin to that of the Targaryens, and when I first read of the Targaryens as a dynasty, my first thought was that of the Habsburgs. Carlos II was incapable of producing a dead child, never mind a live one, and was physically and psychologically affected by decades of inbreeding. While the Rhesus Positive/Negative theory (which has been discussed with regards to Henry VIII and the multiple still births of Catherine of Aragon and - to a lesser extent - Anne Boleyn) is a possibility, the fact is that incest and multiple cousin (never mind sibling) marriage can result in birth defects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Targaryens had fertility problems sometimes. No other explanation necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Pycelle. Pycelle probably did them in. This or the natural problems due to Targ incest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slant Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 make sense yes here I was thinking they were more time traveling foetuses, but this version is better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saer Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 The Rh thing is an elegant explanation, although it seems odd that two children of married siblings would manage to get different genes in that respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blackmont Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Putting my faith in incest for too fucking long.I don't know if it has been mentioned, but the Habsburgs had problems with childbirth too, and they were likely less inbred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victarion Chainbreaker Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It's yet another clue that Dany is not Aerys's and Rhaella's child. :commie: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It's yet another clue that Dany is not Aerys's and Rhaella's child. :commie: This smells of lemons... :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Rose Crown Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 make sense yes here I was thinking they were more time traveling foetuses, but this version is better Snort. If the babies were murdered, how did rhaegar get by? I'm sure poisoning dinner is just as easy as poisoning a baby bottle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bent branch Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 It's yet another clue that Dany is not Aerys's and Rhaella's child. :commie: Actually, Dany's survival is evidence that Pycelle was killing the children of Aerys and Rhaella. Both Rhaegar and Dany, who were delivered by different maesters survived. The only child delivered by Pycelle that survived was Viserys and he only survived because Aerys took "crazy" measures to ensure that he would. This pattern of survival of Aerys and Rhaella's children screams out that Pycelle was killing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bent branch Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Snort. If the babies were murdered, how did rhaegar get by? I'm sure poisoning dinner is just as easy as poisoning a baby bottle. Rhaegar was born at Summerhall and was delivered by a different maester. After that he was at Dragonstone until Aerys became king. Rhaegar was about three years old then. Far to old and healthy for Pycelle to make it look like just another sickly infant dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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