A Ghost of Someone Posted August 21, 2015 Author Share Posted August 21, 2015 Yes and sometimes showwriters improve the characters that GRRM has poorly written such as Jorah not being a pervy, ogling rapist-in-waiting, and Dany an ever ready tit-bearing lesbian come the night. I tend to view the orginal source as the model standard like it or not, the characters are the way they are in the books because GRRM created them. The show twists and turns them as they see fit. Granted there is more of a risk for the show to do so but that is their perogative. Jorah is what he is and Dany is somewhat a lonely woman in the books who had an intimate relationship with Drogo, her first husband. I think she misses the sex, therefore it affects her as she is still in her mid-teen years and has desires. It would be different for her maybe if she never had sex before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanïelNorth Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 She and theon are obviously headed for the wall thanks to ramsays remark about Jon being LC. There has been no other possible link between them in the show that could point them being romantically involved in the future. Maybe she will fall in love with him when she witnesses the (possible) resurrection ( sacrifice of theon) and his battle against ramsays forces? Jon killing Ramsay will be some well deserved fan service and thus highly unlikely, but if D&D want a Jon + Sansa romance they could use that as a romantic turning point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehandwipes Posted August 21, 2015 Share Posted August 21, 2015 Yes and sometimes showwriters improve the characters that GRRM has poorly written such as Jorah not being a pervy, ogling rapist-in-waiting, and Dany an ever ready tit-bearing lesbian come the night. Making a character more likable is not the same thing as making them a better character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKitttenGuard Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 Jorah does not seem as pervy because Dany is not thirteen on the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VenezuelanLord Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 I think Sansa will end up with Tormund or even more likely Tyrion at the end. I think Sansa will end up alone and bitter after all she have been through, unless she encounters her paragon of knighthood ( I haven't see him) I dont think she would be overly excited about a new marriage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ghost of Someone Posted August 22, 2015 Author Share Posted August 22, 2015 I think Sansa will end up alone and bitter after all she have been through, unless she encounters her paragon of knighthood ( I haven't see him) I dont think she would be overly excited about a new marriage... I think she dies before the end on the show and in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valhalla Morghulis Posted August 22, 2015 Share Posted August 22, 2015 GRRM is generally a good writer but he does make some massive cock ups which DD have cleaned up on the shows for which they deserve credit, such as that bloody irritating raven of Mormont's that puts Jar Jar Binks to shame and Ygritte saying You know Nothing every goddamn paragraph, just such poor writing. If you are going to criticise Dorne ad nauseum then so you have to these GRRM blunders, to have any kind of balanced opinion. And if GRRM or DD cheapen Jon's story with a love story with one of his sisters or both, then well we have precedence for moronic choices either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woman of War Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Now to be fair, a love story of Jon and Sansa would indeed be cheap but there might be an arranged loveless political marriage between Sansa and Jon for whatever political goal - very consciously entered by both parts, not at all arranged by a third party and yet not a love story at all but political business like nearly every marriage arrangement during the War of the Roses. Though I do not believe that Jon - if he is indeed dead and resurrected - will ever enter any marriage. To quote myself: Do you really think that Jon, if he is dead as in physically DEAD and then gets resurrected, will have a normal life? That he will love and have sex, with healthy babies and a happy wife? Death as small inconvenience? I know this is fantasy. But Martin as author is not someone going for cheap plots. He writes in the tradition of Western moral, religious and first of all humanist philosophical thoughts. And death is something to be in awe of, to respect as last border, taking a life as the ultimate crime, taking your own life as ultimate decision. Death in our philosiophical tradition is the big unknown, the limit of human knowledge and I guess Martin will reflect that in his story. He will not simply negate the enormity of someone having been dead. Meaning that someone who has definitely crossed that final border will not return, go on with life and be whole as human being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ghost of Someone Posted August 23, 2015 Author Share Posted August 23, 2015 Now to be fair, a love story of Jon and Sansa would indeed be cheap but there might be an arranged loveless political marriage between Sansa and Jon for whatever political goal - very consciously entered by both parts, not at all arranged by a third party and yet not a love story at all but political business like nearly every marriage arrangement during the War of the Roses. Though I do not believe that Jon - if he is indeed dead and resurrected - will ever enter any marriage: I am curious of what type of person he would be if he is resurrected? People change it seems. Stoneheart - decayed and the manner and place of her death and by whom as well as what was on her mind when she died. Dondarion was on a mission to restore order to the Riverlands so he is pursuing justice the best way he can. Jon, on the show, defend the realms of men so it could be interesting to see what frame of mind he would be in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven's Bastard Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I don't really ship them; I just think it's likely to happen. I ship Jon and Val, and her show version, Karsi, was killed 15 minutes after we met her :frown5: Yes, you do ship them. Admit it. Confession is good for the soul... Karsi was a freakin' awesome character ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven's Bastard Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Poor Rickon! :crying: At least Shaggydog loves him. Lots of people probably love Rickon. But as a wild child, no one really likes him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ghost of Someone Posted August 23, 2015 Author Share Posted August 23, 2015 Yes, you do ship them. Admit it. Confession is good for the soul... Karsi was a freakin' awesome character ! Karsi was fantastic, I wonder if they regret not having her make it south of the wall. Her and Tormund would be a cool couple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven's Bastard Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 GRRM is generally a good writer but he does make some massive cock ups which DD have cleaned up on the shows for which they deserve credit, such as that bloody irritating raven of Mormont's that puts Jar Jar Binks to shame and Ygritte saying You know Nothing every goddamn paragraph, just such poor writing. If you are going to criticise Dorne ad nauseum then so you have to these GRRM blunders, to have any kind of balanced opinion. And if GRRM or DD cheapen Jon's story with a love story with one of his sisters or both, then well we have precedence for moronic choices either way. Wow. That's an interesting viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ghost of Someone Posted August 23, 2015 Author Share Posted August 23, 2015 GRRM is generally a good writer but he does make some massive cock ups which DD have cleaned up on the shows for which they deserve credit, such as that bloody irritating raven of Mormont's that puts Jar Jar Binks to shame and Ygritte saying You know Nothing every goddamn paragraph, just such poor writing. If you are going to criticise Dorne ad nauseum then so you have to these GRRM blunders, to have any kind of balanced opinion. And if GRRM or DD cheapen Jon's story with a love story with one of his sisters or both, then well we have precedence for moronic choices either way. We are under the presumtion that they are his cousins and not sisters. However, Arya and jon are close like brother and sister, Jon and Sansa are more like two people that grew up together as aquaintances, not relatives. Sansa grew up much like Cat but not hateful to Jon, just cordial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valhalla Morghulis Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 On the show Jon will come back pretty much the same as before. He will not be half-Jon or reduced-Jon as that won;t work with a TV audience who would rather have him dead in that case, so he would be free to marry his sister who is now his cousin, but still can't see it happening on the show, just too gross to watch. In the books, yes both could happen, Jon could come back completely different, maybe three quarters reduced or much darker and vicious, and he could marry Sansa and Arya and possibly Dany too. Ironic thing is in the shows and in TV/Film there has to be a sense of realism and it cannot be so grotesque, whereas an author is his own master and can write whatever he pleases. There are no rules in novel writing, which is why screenwriting is so much harder, not only do you have to get the beauty and art into your script but you also have a huge number of rules and constraints you have to negotiate through as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter's Cold Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 We are under the presumtion that they are his cousins and not sisters. However, Arya and jon are close like brother and sister, Jon and Sansa are more like two people that grew up together as aquaintances, not relatives. Sansa grew up much like Cat but not hateful to Jon, just cordial. Arya and Jon were close like brothers and sisters. After Jon discovers his true heritage, it's quite likely that their relationship will change. That's the excuse that GRRM used to pair them in the outline at least. Jon and Arya's intense feelings for each other might morph into something romantic by the end of the series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Writhen Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Yeah they may be first cousins, not half-brother and half-sister. IDK a pairing with Arya may be possible too. Not really defending it, but throughout human history it has occurred from time to time... :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingelheim Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 Yes, you do ship them. Admit it. Confession is good for the soul... Karsi was a freakin' awesome character ! Naah, I really don't, trust me. But if Jon has to be in love with one member of his family, I prefer Sansa over Dany or Arya. And yeah, she was amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven's Bastard Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 Naah, I really don't, trust me. But if Jon has to be in love with one member of his family, I prefer Sansa over Dany or Arya. And yeah, she was amazing. Why ? I can understand the Arya/Jon shippers, but the whole Sansa/Jon thing to me is like oil and water. There's no chemistry there, none. Both in the books and on the tv show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valhalla Morghulis Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 Why ? I can understand the Arya/Jon shippers, but the whole Sansa/Jon thing to me is like oil and water. There's no chemistry there, none. Both in the books and on the tv show. It's not chemistry, it's biology that's the problem, lol. Viserys touching up Dany was done to show how slimy and wrong Viserys was so by that precedence Jon and Sansa would cast Jon in a villainous and worse now an abusive role given that Sansa is now a domestic violence and rape victim and very vulnerable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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