Discussing Sansa XXII: Porcelain, ivory, steel...

[Raksha 2014]

40 minutes ago, Colonel Green said:

180 degrees.  If she moved 360 degrees she'd be back to quivering wreck.

Oops.  I never was much good at geometry.

[Commander Jon Snow]

I think this is the first  time Sansa is not a pawn in someone else's game. Before she was a prisoner of the Lannisters, Littlefinger, and then Ramsay. Now, she is free and she wants to get revenge. I'm loving this.

Also loved her reunion with Jon. I remember reading AFFC where she said that she would love to see him again. To me, how the scene played out is how I think it would have happened in the books as well. May not have been close but still family and still overjoyed to see her brother again

[Mrslannistark]

2 minutes ago, Commander Jon Snow said:

I think this is the first  time Sansa is not a pawn in someone else's game. Before she was a prisoner of the Lannisters, Littlefinger, and then Ramsay. Now, she is free and she wants to get revenge. I'm loving this.

Also loved her reunion with Jon. I remember reading AFFC where she said that she would love to see him again. To me, how the scene played out is how I think it would have happened in the books as well. May not have been close but still family and still overjoyed to see her brother again

Yes, agree!

[Princess of Dragonflies]

41 minutes ago, Robb_Warged said:

Guys, in the show, I'm shipping Jon and Sansa now.  Got a thread pending approval with deeper thoughts on the situation.  Not sure if the thread will be approved or just moved to this one

30 minutes ago, SamuelVimes said:

Ewwww. I mean, yes, I understand this on a show level, but I wish the show had a message other than "keep it in the family" and "incest is best"...

 

I liked Sansa in this episode, I feel like she's finally taking control of her life and I'm glad she wants Jon to be at her side. After Ramsay is killed ( sacrificed to the Winterfell heart tree with Ice/ Oathkeeper? Maybe?) by Jon that's the end of the Bolton line, Sansa becomes the Lady of Winterfell, the Dreadfort and Wardeness. I would like to see her carry on Robb's mission (and legitimization?) to secede the North from the Throne and the Lannisters.

[Robb_Warged]

3 minutes ago, Princess of Dragonflies said:

Are you with me in supporting the Jon/Sansa ship?  We all saw the romantic interest in her stare at him when they were talking about home.  She needed to hear him say he forgave her for the way she treated him.  Jon, as always, knows nothing, and will take some time to realize what he feels for her.  His interest in Ygritte was his subconscious acting out on his yearning for the redhead he truly likes (Sansa)

[tmug]

2 hours ago, Pies are coming said:

She is tough. Now she also needs to be smart. I guess their next stop is Bear Island - the show stopped at Longclaw for a reason, so I guess Jon will want to go there to return the sword and, since he also remembers Lyanna Mormont's letter, it's a safe place to start recruiting and adding numbers to their host.

OTOH, we have a Sansa-Littlefinger (who was great in his scene today) meeting next episode.

 

Here's hoping for Sansa to cut Ramsay's throat and hang his entrails to the Winterfell's Hearth Tree in a sacrifice to the Old Gods. Probably won't happen, though

Lyanna Mormont? With D&D going out of their way to rename characters to alleviate some confusion (Yara/Asha/Osha, Hodor/Walder/Wyllis), do you think it is coincidence they allowed this name to stay the same as Ned's sister, 

Spoiler

or Jon's momma,

 not to avoid confusion but to hammer into our heads that Mormont's either know about Jon's true heritage or are just plain devout Stark loyalists.

Did Poppa Mormont know about Jon's identity? Thus, giving over his sacred family sword so easily, grooming Jon to become a leader/Lord Commander rather than going out in danger as a Night's Watch Ranger? Possibly not because Jon was merely a half-Stark bastard

Spoiler

but the potential true heir to the Iron Throne?

 

[dantares83]

1 hour ago, Wilnova said:

Maybe she was a quivering wreck in the first episode because she had just leaped off a tower, trudged through snow and freezing water and was tired and hungry? And now that she has met family and got some food into her and she is all warm and cozy, she wants some retribution? Come on guys, not everything needs to be explained.

 

yes, she was literally just hours away from her latest raping and possibly torture in episode 1, getting chased by dogs in episode 2 so it was ok that she was scared and whiny.

but after she got her protector and traveling for days and knowing that her half-bro has the support of the Wildlings and possibly the North and the NW, she would want revenge.

[dantares83]

37 minutes ago, Robb_Warged said:

Are you with me in supporting the Jon/Sansa ship?  We all saw the romantic interest in her stare at him when they were talking about home.  She needed to hear him say he forgave her for the way she treated him.  Jon, as always, knows nothing, and will take some time to realize what he feels for her.  His interest in Ygritte was his subconscious acting out on his yearning for the redhead he truly likes (Sansa)

i do not think neither Sansa nor Jon is interested incest as they are still half-siblings (for now).

[Robb_Warged]

36 minutes ago, dantares83 said:

i do not think neither Sansa nor Jon is interested incest as they are still half-siblings (for now).

For how much longer will they think they are half-siblings?  3 episodes?

[dogprivilege]

The show has been pretty terrible lately but I'll give credit where it's due lol. The Jon/Sansa scenes were very good and emotionally satisfying (which wasn't a given after how underwhelming her return to Winterfell was). I also like that they're finally taking the character where we knew she needed to go by having her be so determined, but it would have been nice if there had been more of a bridge getting there. 

[Mladen]

1 hour ago, Robb_Warged said:

For how much longer will they think they are half-siblings?  3 episodes?

It is not how much they WILL think, it is how much they HAVE thought they are siblings. The fact that they are cousins doesn't change the fact they grew up as siblings.

Some random thoughts...

1. DnD like dramatic changes, so change in Sansa was done in that fashion. Simply, they wanted to make the point of how mature she has become and how strong she is and they did it.

2. In show, and this is all due to Miss Turner, it is so hard to ship her with anyone. The hug alone was incredibly funny. It was supposed to be in vein of Sansa finding her protector, and given Sophie's stature, it looked more like she hugged her baby brother.

3. The dialogue about forgiveness should have been done better. They needed to bring more gravitas, more self-reflection... It needed to be more poignant.

4. And I swear to God, Sansa pushing Jon to action... That one was so cool.

[Woman of War]

This time I really hoped that someone has opened the inevitable Sansa thread so I have a place to praise the character and her actress.

Badass! She was the one encouraging Jon who - understandably - has lost faith in himself. She was proud and she was kind.

And I loved how she struggled with that food a noble lady would normally not even get close to. Those small things, apart from her newfound radiance,  showing that she is not little Sansa anymore who denies reality. 

The show did so much for me to finally not being only mildly interested in little (book) Sansa  but to really love her character on the level like I love Arya, Dany, Tyrion, Brienne and Jon. Sophie Turner is playing her character into my heart.

 

[Woman of War]

6 hours ago, Pies are coming said:

She is tough. Now she also needs to be smart. 

OTOH, we have a Sansa-Littlefinger (who was great in his scene today) meeting next episode.

 

This

But I hope we will not lose Baelish too soon, even at the expense of Sansa being too trusting again. The show needs good, cunning and ambiguous villains, players not brutes. Don't kill off LF now!

 

[Mr Smith]

4 hours ago, Colonel Green said:

Sansa is also at Bear Island, from the season trailers.  There's not much for them to do separately.

The Sansa/Jon scenes this week were great, but afterward I was thinking about all the stuff they jumped over.  Jon was evidently told about Sansa being Ramsay's wife, given the later scene with the letter, so I'm fine jumping over that.  But, e.g., Jon dying, everything with the White Walkers; given that Sansa's never had anything to do with magic, that seems like a big reveal.  Unless they didn't talk about that and it's coming later.  We can also assume they compared notes on siblings, though since Sansa is sending Brienne away next week perhaps we'll see them talk about Arya beforehand.

I'm not wild about the show telling the characters stuff the audience already knows, just so they can react to it. Sometimes it's appropriate, but most of the time It's just not great writing, and the show does it too much. I'm glad they forged ahead and got on with the 'what happens next'.

[Mladen]

15 minutes ago, Woman of War said:

This time I really hoped that someone has opened the inevitable Sansa thread so I have a place to praise the character and her actress.

Not so inevitable It is only when we have material to discuss our favorite character. But this has turned into a really nice place for discussing Sansa...

15 minutes ago, Woman of War said:

The show did so much for me to finally not being only mildly interested in little (book) Sansa  but to really love her character on the level like I love Arya, Dany, Tyrion, Brienne and Jon. Sophie Turner is playing her character into my heart.

I see this Sansa as some more dramatic, adult version of Sansa. In some aspects, what we can hope for the character in the books. Not entirely, since this Sansa is sometimes lacking depth and nuance and she can be a bit overly dramatic but this is undoubtedly some version of what we can expect book Sansa to do in the future. 

[Woman of War]

1 minute ago, Risto said:

Not so inevitable It is only when we have material to discuss our favorite character. But this has turned into a really nice place for discussing Sansa...

I see this Sansa as some more dramatic, adult version of Sansa. In some aspects, what we can hope for the character in the books. Not entirely, since this Sansa is sometimes lacking depth and nuance and she can be a bit overly dramatic but this is undoubtedly some version of what we can expect book Sansa to do in the future. 

I hope that you are right, actually I think you are right. Sansa will have to go through some horrors in the books as well before she sheds her character's shell, I guess. 

[WinterCloak]

6 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I think Jon goes to bear Island. I think he and Sansa split up, Davos and Mel with Jon, Brienne and Pod with Sansa. Preview with next week has Sansa confront LF. I look forward to that.

 

Me too! I hope Sansa doesn't believe his bull$h!t. I'd prefer if she gave him an ultimatim to prove that his words aren't wind. LF is a smug little prick and I get it, the show needs it but can we not have Sansa's character development go one step forward three steps back?

 

I've never understood the Jon/Sansa shipping, but each to their own. I don't think it's in Jon's destiny to live 'happily ever after' in a 'let's get married and have babies' kind of way. Wouldn't it be cool if Sansa took a leaf out of Maege Mormont's book and have her own children without a husband?

[Mladen]

2 minutes ago, WinterCloak said:

Me too! I hope Sansa doesn't believe his bull$h!t. I'd prefer if she gave him an ultimatim to prove that his words aren't wind. LF is a smug little prick and I get it, the show needs it but can we not have Sansa's character development go one step forward three steps back?

Well, we have been there, with Season 4/Season 5 events...  So, things are a bit off with regards to what we can or can't have.

[the tower of albion]

If you died and came back to life, don't you think you would mention that to your sister? I was right about Tormund getting all googly eyed, that was funny.

[The Hound 25]

Anybody notice the look of concern on Tormund's face while Jon was reading the letter? I love the little bromance they have. Tormund is a hardcore, rough and tough man but to see him warm up to Jon is a testament to Jon's character IMO. And we all know Tormund is always ready for a fight. I can just see it now, Jon having his inevitable showdown with Ramsay and Tormund having a one on one fight with Small Jon Umber. Two big, bearded, tough sons of bitches fighting it out to the death is gonna be so freaking awesome to see!!!!