Pycelles rookie error?

[Neds Secret]

In AGoT when Ned Stark is investigating Jon Arryns death Ned speaks to Grand Maester Pycelle about Jon Arryns movements and actions in the time leading up to Arryns death. Pycelle informs Ned that Arryn had been studiously reading a "ponderous tome" about the births and lineages of the great houses of Westeros. I would think that in order to obscure the true nature of Arryns interests which we believe was to uncover Cerseis children being bastards born of treason that Pycelle could have just told Ned that Jon Arryn had been reading any book at all, a book that had nothing to do with lineages, and by doing this Pycelle could have further  concealed Cerseis treason. Seeing as Pycelle was working for the Lannisters then  him giving Ned the exact book seems very careless, or even stupid and short sighted given the circumstances. What do you all think? Was Pycelle careless or did he act deliberately, and for what reason?

[Lost Melnibonean]

26 minutes ago, Neds Secret said:

In AGoT when Ned Stark is investigating Jon Arryns death Ned speaks to Grand Maester Pycelle about Jon Arryns movements and actions in the time leading up to Arryns death. Pycelle informs Ned that Arryn had been studiously reading a "ponderous tome" about the births and lineages of the great houses of Westeros. I would think that in order to obscure the true nature of Arryns interests which we believe was to uncover Cerseis children being bastards born of treason that Pycelle could have just told Ned that Jon Arryn had even reading any book at all, a book that had nothing to do with lineages, and by doing this Pycelle could have further  concealed Cerseis treason. Seeing as Pycelle was working for he Lannisters then  him giving Ned the exact book seems very careless, or even stupid and short sighted given the circumstances. What do you all think? Was Pycelle careless or did he act deliberately, and for what reason?

Of course a real person in Pycelle's situation would not have done that. But this is a story, not a history. The author (not Pycelle) wanted to lead us (not Eddard) down that path. 

[The Fattest Leech]

51 minutes ago, Neds Secret said:

In AGoT when Ned Stark is investigating Jon Arryns death Ned speaks to Grand Maester Pycelle about Jon Arryns movements and actions in the time leading up to Arryns death. Pycelle informs Ned that Arryn had been studiously reading a "ponderous tome" about the births and lineages of the great houses of Westeros. I would think that in order to obscure the true nature of Arryns interests which we believe was to uncover Cerseis children being bastards born of treason that Pycelle could have just told Ned that Jon Arryn had even reading any book at all, a book that had nothing to do with lineages, and by doing this Pycelle could have further  concealed Cerseis treason. Seeing as Pycelle was working for he Lannisters then  him giving Ned the exact book seems very careless, or even stupid and short sighted given the circumstances. What do you all think? Was Pycelle careless or did he act deliberately, and for what reason?

I think, maybe in addition to what LM noted, that Pycelle was more of a Tywin man specifically. Yeah, I know that exposing Cersei could threaten himself and maybe the Lannisters, but I think there could have been a way Tywin could have "worked around" if need be. Hmmm, where did he leave his mountain again???

Pycelle was the biggest blubberer at the Tywin funeral:

• Of all the mourners, Grand Maester Pycelle had seemed the most distraught. "I have served six kings," he told Jaime after the second service, whilst sniffing doubtfully about the corpse, "but here before us lies the greatest man I ever knew. Lord Tywin wore no crown, yet he was all a king should be."
• The vapors rising from the corpse were making Pycelle's eyes water. "The flesh . . . as the flesh dries, the muscles grow taut and pull his lips upward. That is no smile, only a . . . a drying, that is all." He blinked back tears. "You must excuse me. I am so very tired." Leaning heavily on his cane, Pycelle tottered slowly from the sept. That one is dying too, Jaime realized. Small wonder Cersei called him useless.

[A Ghost of Someone]

1 hour ago, Neds Secret said:

In AGoT when Ned Stark is investigating Jon Arryns death Ned speaks to Grand Maester Pycelle about Jon Arryns movements and actions in the time leading up to Arryns death. Pycelle informs Ned that Arryn had been studiously reading a "ponderous tome" about the births and lineages of the great houses of Westeros. I would think that in order to obscure the true nature of Arryns interests which we believe was to uncover Cerseis children being bastards born of treason that Pycelle could have just told Ned that Jon Arryn had been reading any book at all, a book that had nothing to do with lineages, and by doing this Pycelle could have further  concealed Cerseis treason. Seeing as Pycelle was working for the Lannisters then  him giving Ned the exact book seems very careless, or even stupid and short sighted given the circumstances. What do you all think? Was Pycelle careless or did he act deliberately, and for what reason?

I think you are right, since Pycelle of course new about the twincest and was a Lannister Fan Boy. Yeah, big mistake indeed.

[Aedam Targaryen]

1 hour ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

I think you are right, since Pycelle of course new about the twincest and was a Lannister Fan Boy. Yeah, big mistake indeed.

Do we know that he knew? I didnt think it was very common knowledge until Stannis started spreading the word. 

I always thought that Pycelle didn't know about the twincest, was just answering Ned's questions honestly, and was a bit naive to the informations eventual repercussions. 

If Pycelle knew about the twincest, I can't explain it at all. 

[A Ghost of Someone]

Just now, Aedam Targaryen said:

Do we know that he knew? I didnt think it was very common knowledge until Stannis started spreading the word. 

I always thought that Pycelle didn't know about the twincest, was just answering Ned's questions honestly, and was a bit naive to the informations eventual repercussions. 

If Pycelle knew about the twincest, I can't explain it at all. 

Pycell knew. Tyrion tricked him in ACOC when he tested Varys,LF and Pycell. Pycell knew all along. He also acknowledged that he let Jon Arryn die because Jon Arryn, well, "he knew" and he was protecting House Lannister.

[Aedam Targaryen]

55 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Pycell knew. Tyrion tricked him in ACOC when he tested Varys,LF and Pycell. Pycell knew all along. He also acknowledged that he let Jon Arryn die because Jon Arryn, well, "he knew" and he was protecting House Lannister.

Thanks!  I totally forgot about that. So yea, he knew, and giving Ned that book was really stupid. 

3 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Of course a real person in Pycelle's situation would not have done that. But this is a story, not a history. The author (not Pycelle) wanted to lead us (not Eddard) down that path. 

Since Pycelle seems to know about the twincest, this is really the only explanation that makes sense. 

[The Sleeper]

Perhaps Pycelle didn't know why Arryn was reading it. It is not like the first page read that Lannister-Baratheon unions yield black headed children. It is supposed to be an exhaustive who is who with hundreds of lineages. Or for the same reason did not believe that Ned would figure it out.

He does seem kind of reluctant to give it to him though. It seems to me that in Pycelle's thinking, he thought that Ned could well have found out about the book from other sources and that he would draw more attention to it by being obscure, while simultaneously draw suspicion onto himself. Not necessarily, the best judgement, but it seems plausible to me.

Or, it could be a plot hole.

[John Doe]

I'm not sure if it's a mistake. What if other people saw Arryn with that book? Ned might have asked them too, and lying about the book would be a lot more suspicious than just telling the truth and hoping Ned wouldn't read it all, or at least draw the correct conclusions. 

[Greywater-Watch]

38 minutes ago, John Doe said:

I'm not sure if it's a mistake. What if other people saw Arryn with that book? Ned might have asked them too, and lying about the book would be a lot more suspicious than just telling the truth and hoping Ned wouldn't read it all, or at least draw the correct conclusions. 

Agreed.

Take for example Stannis who was close to Jon Arryn and obviously accompanied him visiting Gendry. Pycelle had to assume that Stannis was informed about Jon Arryn's suspicion and his reading  Grand Maester Malleon's book The Lineages and Histories of the Great Houses of the Seven Kingdoms. And Ned Stark tried to communicate with Stannis, which Pycelle knew or had to assume.

The risk of given false Information to Ned was too high.

[A Ghost of Someone]

1 hour ago, Greywater-Watch said:

Agreed.

Take for example Stannis who was close to Jon Arryn and obviously accompanied him visiting Gendry. Pycelle had to assume that Stannis was informed about Jon Arryn's suspicion and his reading  Grand Maester Malleon's book The Lineages and Histories of the Great Houses of the Seven Kingdoms. And Ned Stark tried to communicate with Stannis, which Pycelle knew or had to assume.

The risk of given false Information to Ned was too high.

Which leads me off topic a bit but Stannis kind of hung Ned "out to dry" by not even communicating with him and Robert too.

[Greywater-Watch]

33 minutes ago, A Ghost of Someone said:

Which leads me off topic a bit but Stannis kind of hung Ned "out to dry" by not even communicating with him and Robert too.

As you say, your remark is "Off-Topic" as it is irrelevant to my argumentation. Pycelle, even if he knew Stannis was reluctant to answer Ned, he could not be sure that he would not answer at all.

[A Ghost of Someone]

1 minute ago, Greywater-Watch said:

As you say, your remark is "Off-Topic" as it is irrelevant to my argumentation. Pycelle, even if he knew Stannis was reluctant to answer Ned, he could not be sure that he would not answer at all.

Perhaps Pycelle underestimated Ned's intelligence as was suggested above. The Northerners do seem to be looked upon as lesser intelligent it seems but tough militarily.

[Lost Melnibonean]

5 hours ago, The Sleeper said:

Perhaps Pycelle didn't know why Arryn was reading it. It is not like the first page read that Lannister-Baratheon unions yield black headed children. It is supposed to be an exhaustive who is who with hundreds of lineages. Or for the same reason did not believe that Ned would figure it out.

He does seem kind of reluctant to give it to him though. It seems to me that in Pycelle's thinking, he thought that Ned could well have found out about the book from other sources and that he would draw more attention to it by being obscure, while simultaneously draw suspicion onto himself. Not necessarily, the best judgement, but it seems plausible to me.

Or, it could be a plot hole.

Plausible. It could be that Pycelle simply did not connect the two. 

[Lost Melnibonean]

5 hours ago, John Doe said:

I'm not sure if it's a mistake. What if other people saw Arryn with that book? Ned might have asked them too, and lying about the book would be a lot more suspicious than just telling the truth and hoping Ned wouldn't read it all, or at least draw the correct conclusions. 

Didn't Pycelle volunteer the information about Jon reading the ponderous tome? I don't believe Eddard asked about the book until Pycelle brought it up. 

[Walda]

It is consistent with Pycelle's character and motives, I think. (After all, if Pycelle had reason to deny Eddard the book, GRRM could always have had Eddard come by the book without Pycelle freely telling him of it or offering it to him. Have Eddard borrow it from the library or something. Actually, never noticed before, but the Red Keep apparently doesn't have a library. Did the Targaryens keep all their books at Summerhall, where they went up in flames, like the library of Winterfell? or were all their books carried off in the Sack of Kings Landing?)

Pycelle is much maligned. Everything suggests that he served King Robert loyally and well for fifteen years, and Jon Arryn as hand, too. He might well be disturbed by the death of Jon Arryn. He knew it was poison, a rare and expensive poison, that might be found in his own pharmacopoeia but not very many others places in Westeros (and why he kept the Tears of Lys in his pharmacopoeia is a fair question, as its sole purpose seems to be killing undetectably.)

So, when Pycelle meets with Eddard, he has reason to fear he has been stolen from, set up, and might be the next man to be poisoned if he says a word wrong. However, he has no reason to distrust Lord Stark.  Eddard is the only person at court he knows has played no part in the poisoning, so anything Eddard can do to identify the real murderer is good news for him. Having Eddard track down the poisoner is like Eddard having Jory interview Ser Hugh. People won't suspect him of acting for Pycelle, and if he is successful he might prevent Pycelle's murderer, so why wouldn't Pycelle co-operate?

His fears and no doubt suspects Varys, and never passes an opportunity to cast shade on him.  Even for things he did himself:

Quote

it was Varys, there are things I might tell you of that eunuch that would chill your blood (ACoK, Ch.25 Tyrion VI)

Varys is also the least protected of Pycelle's suspects. Looking at the other potential poisoners: Cersei has the Red Cloaks, Baelish has the Gold Cloaks, Renly has the swords of Highgarden, Barristan the Kings Guard, Stannis had left the capital.

His 'betrayal' of Tyrion's plans to wed Myrcella to Trystane demonstrates his clear sense of duty. He knows Queen Cersei is the Regent, Tywin is Hand, Tyrion is acting as Tywin's proxy, and his job is to design and implement her policies. Since Cersei became Regent, she has been patronised, ignored and undermined by Joffrey, Varys, Baelish, Slynt, the Gold Cloaks, the High Septon,  Lord Tywin, and soon enough, Tyrion. It wasn't her idea to kill Ned, it wasn't her idea to give Slynt a lordship, it wasn't her idea to retire Barristan, and she doesn't know who murdered Jon Arryn (ACoK,Ch.03 Tyrion I).

Pycelle proves to be the only member of the small council that won't undermine the rightful ruler of the seven kingdoms, Cersei the Queen Regent:

Quote

“Just so,” said Pycelle, “and the king—”
“—is a boy of thirteen. I speak with his voice.”
“So you do. Indeed. The King’s Own Hand. Yet … your most gracious sister, our Queen Regent, she …”
“… bears a great weight upon those lovely white shoulders of hers. I have no wish to add to her burdens. Do you?” (ACoK, Ch.17 Tyrion IV)

 He was the only one that couldn't be bribed or flattered out of doing his duty to Cersei. He has no scheme to foster Tyrion's complicity for, and every reason to distrust his reasons for not telling Cersei. Keeping back one of the letters to show Cersei was a proper to do. Intimating that telling her would be bad for her health, and staring at Pycelle until he squirmed are excellent indications that Tyrion is trying to put through something the regent ought to be informed of. Pycelle still fears the poisoner in the Keep (hence his spare breakfast, and overcooked plums), although apparently he does not suspect Tyrion as a poisoner. Still, it seems negligent in Pycelle that he did not call his serving girl back to attend the Hand before leaving the breakfast room, and extremely negligent that he kept his poisons in the same room he ate in, and not locked up in a cabinet for which he held the only key, but on display, on open shelves. Much less sensible than giving Eddard the book.

When Pycelle tells Tyrion how he advised Aerys to open the gates to Tywin's army, he spun it as his betrayal of the king, and loyalty to his former hand, which was natural, when a Lannister hand had a knife at his throat after he had failed to betray the Regent. At the time, advising Aerys to open the gates might have been the best service Pycelle could see to give. He isn't especially strategic or far-seeing, but Pycelle can be practical with what he sees in front of him. Clearly, he didn't trust Rossart, after what happened to Chelsted for merely advising against burning the place to the ground, and Pycelle might still have hoped for a peaceful end to the siege if King's Landing did not resist Lord Tywin. Remembering what happened at Duskendale might have had him fear for the city if they offered Tywin resistance, or he might have remembered the merciless treatment of the Darklyns and the Hollards was done on the King's orders. As  Lord Tywin's own son guarded the king, Pycelle might even have hoped Tywin's host would defend the city against the Northerners. He might not have known that Aerys and Rossart were going to set the whole town on fire and wanted Tywin to burn with the rest. Anyway, Pycelle survived the siege, and continued loyal to the Lannisters, and to the new King Robert, and to the new Hand Arryn, for fifteen years.

Pycelle continues to serve Cersei loyally, as loyally as Tywin. His failing to attend Tywin's corpse, running off to summon the silent sisters, instead of having her woken, and tending to her father with his own grieving hands, is the first time we see Cersei turn on Pycelle (AFfC,Ch.03 Cersei I). Jaime hears his grief for Tywin, but that does it for Cersei, she sees only the silly grin on Tywin's face, and Pycelle seemingly failing asleep at his funeral. Cersei is paranoid and not quite sane, but I think she has picked up on something the others have missed - that Pycelle never really loved her father, but knew how Tywin served those that were loyal and those that were not, that he had backed Tywin over Aerys, but now Tywin was dead, and the roses were growing strong all around his corpse, Pycelle's loyalty might fail her.

It is after that that she tires of Pycelle forever suggesting older men captain her navy, command her armies (interestingly, Pycelle's military advise seems to be particularily good in Feast for Crows - although it is difficult to tell, as we have yet to see the consequences of the hundred seasoned men sent from Kings Landing to relieve the wall, and most of his advice is shut down by Cersei, and replaced with schemes that are very likely to go belly-up, which doesn't mean that the schemes they replaced were better. However, in the last two books, we hear Pycelle quietly demonstrate a gift for military strategy that was never heard in the previous three books.) It is after that she dates Pycelle's fall to the day Tyrion shaved off his beard and put him in the black cells.  It is after that she accuses Pycelle of slowly killing all those he is charged with healing skills- Jon Arryn, and Robert, and Eddard Stark, and Gregor Clegane, and Lord Gyles,  even Joffrey, who was dead before he had time to fetch his healing potions. At least with Gregor and Joffrey, Pycelle demonstrates an excellent knowledge of poisons. It is breathtakingly stupid of Cersei, given how little she trusts him, and how publicly she condemns his medical skills, that she relies almost entirely on his evidence, about the moon tea, to convict Margaery of adultery.

It is Pycelle's uniform lack of success treating patients, the fact that he seems only able to prolong deaths, or ease them, combined with his knowledge of poisons and his shelves full of them, that convinces me he never attempted to kill Jon Arryn. He had the means and the ability to poison competently, if he wished. He didn't show a similar facility for curing anyone. Maester Coleman also seems to have learnt a blundering, experimental style of medicine. They want to cure their patients, but never really learnt how.  It seems unlikely that Pycelle would want to kill every person he undertakes to heal, because he has the poisons there, and he doesn't use them. Because his ministrations leave Jon Arryn able to tell his wife and Robert "the seed is strong". Because Eddard can still climb up the Iron Throne and hold court, can still climb up the steps of Baelor and beg forgiveness, with Pycelles cast rotting on his leg. (Ballabar, too, has a lot of faith in the power of a healing cast and milk of the poppy - Tyrion takes this as proof Cersei wanted to kill him, but I think, by removing his cast when he did, he probably got the best of the healing effects of the plaster, and removed the worst risk of infection, and Ballabar was only doing worlds best practice medicine at the time.)

In any case, he serves Cersei loyally and well, and for the first two books, she serves him well too. He tries to prevent Tyrion taking her Red Guard off her, she demands Tyrion release him from the black cells. Kevan shows contempt for Pycelle as Hand, gives him less than half an ear, but we are shown his clear and detailed map of JonCon's incursions, and know the importance of his accurate information on Daenarys (whom neither Robert or Joffrey underestimated as a threat). The Rosby inheritance might be militarily significant too - it's exactly between Dragonstone and King's Landing as the dragon flies, and having no settled master means that whomever defends it will be defending it against other pretenders, not defending King's Landing against external foes.

His 'confession' is full of Tyrion's ego - he tries to tell Tyrion that he had identified that Robert's bandages were poisoned (probably by the boiled wine they were seeped in), that Jon Arryn was poisoned because he knew...Tyrion cuts him off, claiming he knows what Arryn knew, which I doubt. Just as Pycelle, Lysa, and Eddard read their own meaning into "the seed is strong", Tyrion and Eddard decide that "what Jon Arryn knew" is nothing more than Cersei's incest. By itself, that is nothing. Whatever people know without eye witness, or documented confession from the guilty parties, means nothing. As long as Robert acknowledged Joffrey as his son and Cersei as his wife, they were safe.

I suspect what Pycelle knew was a plot against the Lannisters by Stannis, because when he can't tell that, he tells of Renly's plot to have Robert put Cersei aside and take Margaery as his queen (It isn't clear if Renly had intended Margaery's progeny to inherit the throne, or was merely attempting to reduce the influence of the Lannisters over his brother. When Stannis told Renly of the incest, it seemed to be a new idea to him.) When Tyrion has shown himself resistant to everything Pycelle says that isn't what he wants to hear, when Pycelle is literally a whisker away from death, he gives in, and tells Tyrion exactly what he wanted to hear, fumbling to cobble together a plausible account he can defend if need be.

So, I don't think it is out of character for Pycelle to give the book to Eddard, hoping that he might discover the poisoner before the poisoner discovered Pycelle. I don't think Pycelle suspected any Lannister of being the poisoner. 

Lysa claimed it was Petyr Baelish who gave her the tears of Lys that she put in Jon Arryn's wine. Petyr Baelish actively helped Eddard round up Ser Hugh, the pot boy, the stableboy/goldcloak, the maid/goodwife for him. Petyr wanted to make sure that Eddard saw the bastard child in the brothel, even when Eddard and all his men combined proved incapable of finding the best-known brothel in King's Landing ("It might have taken us years to find this brothel without you"(AGoT, Ch.35 Eddard IX))

Petyr wanted to make sure that Eddard knew about the bastards that lived within the shadow of the keep, and Petyr bought the Goldcloaks that went to kill them with Eddard's coin. And, blamed Cersei for their deaths, and Eddard's death, at the hands of the Goldcloaks that took his money and Petyr's orders. It is also Petyr that tells Eddard Cersei had twin bastards sired at Casterley Rock killed, setting her up to be blamed for everyone he has killed in her name. We know how easily and slyly Petyr Baelish lies. Cersei is kind of delusional, seeing the people she kills as thoes who have betrayed her, mostly. But there is this "Her husband’s by-blows had his look as well, though at least Robert had the grace to keep them out of sight."(AFfC, Ch.17 Cersei IV) - how would Cersei know Robert's bastards have his look, if she had never seen them, or known about them, until after Robert was dead? Yes, she effectively tells Robert that she will try to kill his bastard daughter if he brings her to court, but it is clear that Cersei wasn't bothered by unacknowledged bastards that did not exist in her presence. Knowing there were two in the shadow of the keep was unpleasant, but it wasn't something that threatened her. On the other hand, once Baelish had played those cards, living, they could only testify that this or that Hand of the King had visited shortly before his death.

What Eddard read in Malleon was probably not what Jon Arryn read. Sansa pointed out that Joffrey didn't look at all like Robert's son, and she didn't need to read a book to notice that. Eddard had seen Mya, Gendry, and Barra. Malleon's records supported what Sansa had pointed out, Eddard has an epiphany and assumes Jon Arryn consulted Malleon for exactly that purpose. Baelish, Varys, Lord Tywin, Cersei, Renly, all knew of Robert's black-haired bastards and golden heirs. Stannis didn't consult Malleon, when he brought his suspicions to Arryn (unlike Baelish, I trust Stannis to tell the truth, or at least, what he believes is the truth.). As soon as Catelyn heard, she knew who had defenestrated Bran, and why, without consulting Malleon. Why would Jon Arryn,  who had already found respectable provision for at least one of Robert's bastards, need a book to tell him what anyone with eyes could suspect, what anyone who knew Robert and Cersei could tell?  

 Malleon's information was not a stronger proof than what their own eyes already offered. (actually, I wonder about Malleon recording each child's hair colour - irl some babies are born bald, or with fuzz of a completely different colour to the hair they grow after. The colour of a child's hair at birth is an even less reliable indication of paternity in a society in a society without knowledge of genetics, one that relies on institutions like marriage, and associated values that involve policing female sexuality, like maidenly virginity, and beddings (to witness the breaking of the hymen), and ladies in waiting, and bedmaids, so that the chastity of the wives of men of power can be assured. In such a society, as long as a man acknowledges his wife and her children, she is fine.

Eddard saw in Malleon what Stannis saw without Malleon. I doubt that is what interested Jon Arryn about Malleon. My guess is that Jon Arryn had discovered certain strategically significant magical powers, inherited from the First Kings, and that he had gone to Malleon hoping to find hereditary clues as to the causes of his current infertility - to determine if the problem was with his seed, or the Tully/Whent vessel. That his thinking might have been assisted by certain observations in his breeding of hunting hounds, that is, that he knew more about genetics than the common knowledge of the world he lived in.  (The magical powers I'm thinking of are things like the mythical strength of Orys Baratheon's right arm, so clearly inherited by Robert and Gendry, that might have been inherited from the Storm Kings, as the blue eyes were from the Dragonlords. Perhaps the Arryns had similar powers from the combination of Griffin-kingsblood, and Dragonblood.  And maybe Aerys had identified these mystical powers of old kings, as part of a prophecy, or as something that might facilitate or impede the breeding of dragons, or of dragon lords. Maybe that was his reason for wanting to sacrifice every Arryn, Baratheon, Stark, Royce, and Mallister, but never mind Glover. 

I suspect Pycelle's maid is one of Varys's little birds (if she is the same mute child that opened the door to Kevan) and keeping track of who looks into Malleon. The only person we know that has looked on Malleon and lived is currently Petyr Baelish, who idly flipped open the cover when he visited Eddard after Pycelle (AGoT, Ch.47 Eddard XIII). Baelish typically does the things he is most deeply interested in idly, and Eddard senses he is being plumbed for information when Baelish asks him about Malleon, but tells him it is the book Jon Arryn was reading when he died, anyway.

Baelish took care before he opened the book, that nobody but Eddard witnessed him do it. He had scoped out Eddard's solar carefully for blind spots, and the locations of likely little birds, the time Eddard had come from Pycelle with Malleon, to find Petyr at the windowseat. But when Pycelle looked into it he was not so lucky. I suspect Malleon was the last book he read, because his two last orders of business were the Rosby inheritance and Myrcella's wedding preparations, both of which might involve consulting Malleon to determine matters of precedence. Also, we have Kevan's fat-headed musing about Pycelle "That is how it is when a man grows as old as Pycelle. Everything you see or hear reminds you of something you saw or heard when you were young." - Malleon goes back to the time of Pycelle's youth, or a half-dozen years before it. Something he had seen or heard that day, reminded him of something he had seen or heard four generations earlier. And while Pycelle deeply absorbed in his reading, he got a reading-candlestick to the back of the head (we can tell he had been reading a while, from the amount of liquid wax in the candle). I suspect Varys partly because we know Varys was on the scene for that one, and partly because Varys specialised in little birds that were trained to read documents, make copies, or give accurate accounts of the contents, and let the originals lie, apparently untouched.

So even if Pycelle had suspected twincest, and even if he had suspected Jon Arryn was poisoned because he knew about the twincest, he might not have made the connection between twincest and The Lineages and Histories of the Great Houses of the Seven Kingdoms, With Descriptions of Many High Lords and Noble Ladies and Their Children. Giving Eddard a book that tells of marriages made 90 years ago, is not like giving Eddard proof of Cersei's adultery, even if Eddard seems to think it is. Pycelle seems to be cautious but honest in his dealings with Eddard, and Eddard likewise. He doesn't seem to have been so completely honest in his dealings with Tyrion - and his claim that he killed Jon Arryn out of loyalty to the Lannisters is most likely an invention to keep his throat from being cut.

TL:DR Not an error if Pycelle wasn't trying to kill Jon Arryn, and didn't know about the twincest.

[Wrl6199]

7 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Plausible. It could be that Pycelle simply did not connect the two. 

Yeah tats true.

[Ygrain]

7 hours ago, The Sleeper said:

Perhaps Pycelle didn't know why Arryn was reading it. It is not like the first page read that Lannister-Baratheon unions yield black headed children. It is supposed to be an exhaustive who is who with hundreds of lineages. Or for the same reason did not believe that Ned would figure it out.

Quite possibly.

Besides, it would rouse suspicion if Pycelle lied about the book and Ned managed to find out from other sources, e.g. if he started to correspond with the Vale.

[Ser Duncan of Flea Bottom]

15 hours ago, Neds Secret said:

In AGoT when Ned Stark is investigating Jon Arryns death Ned speaks to Grand Maester Pycelle about Jon Arryns movements and actions in the time leading up to Arryns death. Pycelle informs Ned that Arryn had been studiously reading a "ponderous tome" about the births and lineages of the great houses of Westeros. I would think that in order to obscure the true nature of Arryns interests which we believe was to uncover Cerseis children being bastards born of treason that Pycelle could have just told Ned that Jon Arryn had been reading any book at all, a book that had nothing to do with lineages, and by doing this Pycelle could have further  concealed Cerseis treason. Seeing as Pycelle was working for the Lannisters then  him giving Ned the exact book seems very careless, or even stupid and short sighted given the circumstances. What do you all think? Was Pycelle careless or did he act deliberately, and for what reason?

I think he never imagined Ned would never found out even with the book, that was a small detail, most people in Westeros would never figure that out and Ned is not known for his intelligence, he is a brilliant commander and a honorable man, but that is it.

Another reason was the fact he liked Tywin, not necessarely Cersei, and Cersei was always treating him poorly, she was never fond of him, we don't see them interact in book 1, but later on we learn how Cersei despises the man.

[John Doe]

He wasn't a brilliant commander.