MCUniverse- Captain Marvel Rises!

[Darth Richard II]

Sure buddy.

[sifth]

1 minute ago, Darth Richard II said:

Sure buddy.

Hey, I work in a very racist community, but what do I know about peoples reactions.

[polishgenius]

1 hour ago, sifth said:

Hey, I work in a very racist community, but what do I know about peoples reactions.

I think Darth's point is that if her choice of words is only poor because it offends racists, then it's the racists that are the problem not her choice of words.

[Darth Richard II]

2 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

I think Darth's point is that if her choice of words is only poor because it offends racists, then it's the racists that are the problem not her choice of words.

That too, but my main point was her choice of words being reported is actually made up and false. She never said the things being reported. At all.

[polishgenius]

1 minute ago, Darth Richard II said:

That too, but my main point was her choice of words being reported is actually made up and false. She never said the things being reported. At all.

Fair enough.

[Calibandar]

Let's bring up her actual quote so we can judge for ourselves:

 

Quote

"About a year ago, I started paying attention to what my press days looked like and the critics reviewing movies, and noticed it appeared to be overwhelmingly white male. So, I spoke to Dr Stacy Smith at the USC Annenberg Inclusion Initiative, who put together a study to confirm that. Moving forward, I decided to make sure my press days were more inclusive."

A previous statement from her commenting on a negative review of the film A Wrinkle in time.

Quote

I don’t need a 40-year-old white dude to tell me what didn’t work about A Wrinkle in Time. It wasn’t made for him! I want to know what it meant to women of color, biracial women, to teen women of color, to teens that are biracial.

Darth Richard's statement that she didn't make that comment about white men is false, as I expected when Darth Richard started apologizing.

Sifth's remark that Brie Larson *did* say that, is correct.

[sifth]

6 hours ago, polishgenius said:

I think Darth's point is that if her choice of words is only poor because it offends racists, then it's the racists that are the problem not her choice of words.

Here's the thing though, she herself gave them a rallying call. I'm sure some people would blindly hate this film because, trolls will always be trolls, but when you actually give them a reason to rally behind, it's like shooting yourself in the foot. I mean what she said is the equivalent of saying "there are too many black people in the NBA", instead of "I want to see people of all races playing professional basketball". The former brings up race and could easily start a dumpster fire, while the latter is making a kind remark on how people of all skin color should have an equal opportunity.

You have to walk a very careful tightrope when you play the race game, that's just the crazy world we live in.

[The Anti-Targ]

11 hours ago, Calibandar said:

Let's bring up her actual quote so we can judge for ourselves:

 

A previous statement from her commenting on a negative review of the film A Wrinkle in time.

Darth Richard's statement that she didn't make that comment about white men is false, as I expected when Darth Richard started apologizing.

Sifth's remark that Brie Larson *did* say that, is correct.

I don't think Darth denied her saying either of those quotes. And those quotes are not what people are saying she said. They are saying things like she said she doesn't want white men at her press junkets, which she never said. And they are saying she said that she doesn't want white men seeing her movie, which she never said. Or at least that's what people are saying people have said that is what she's said. Now I'm saying that people are saying that people are saying that this is what she said. So I might be wrong about what people are saying that people are saying that this is what she said, or I might be wrong about people saying that this is what she said. But at least we know what she actually said.

And there is really nothing wrong with either of the things you've quoted, which she has definitely said. Particularly the Wrinkle in Time quote, since she's not even talking about Captain Marvel. She's talking about a movie aimed at tween girls (of colour?), and it's their opinion that matters. Of course it does seem their opinion is that the movie was kinda bad, which means it aligned with the 40 year old white dude opinion, but that's not always what happens.

It would be kinda dumb to say that about Captain Marvel, because 40 year old white dudes should be a target demo, since they are a substantial part of the comicbook audience. So the opinion of 40 year old white dude critics is something she should care about, but not the only opinion she should care about. I'm a 40 year old white dude, and there is nothing offensive to me in anything she's said. Mostly seems like moral outrage by right-wing snowflakes to me.

I hadn't heard about her kickstarter to get girls to go see the movie. The outrage over that is curious, since I seem to recall people trying to make it possible for more African Americans to see Black Panther being mostly praised, or at least no one openly criticising it. Personally I have a cynical attitude to both of those initiatives. I don't see any reason why people should be raising charity money to help Disney make even more profits. If you want to do something for your community using a film you think might have a positive impact on people, then convince Disney to use (or forego) some of its profits and run a few free screenings at, say, women's refuge shelters. 

17 hours ago, sifth said:

I believe she did. Had she not signaled out "white men" no one would have called her out on this. This crap happens whenever people signal out one race as being an issue in something, regardless of the reason. Trust me, I've been around this block before. Had she just said "I want people of all skin colors and gender to review my movie", no one would have said a thing.

I think in principle, if people always tried to say what they want instead of what they don't want there would be less moral outrage over what people say. But what she said really isn't that big of a deal to people who are not already determined to be outraged. And if Brie had actually said "I want more diversity" I think a lot of the people who are outraged over her white men phrasing would still be outraged. Brie Larsen is a dirty SJW in their eyes, which means anything she says is either an overt attack on white men, or a dogwhistle. 

 

[Darth Richard II]

Yeah, thanks. I don’t want to get into a who said what thing, but what I was trying to say, I guess poorly, is the things the right wing nutters are accusing her of saying, she did not say, I can’t remember the exact wording but it was something baling the lines of her not wanting white guys to see the film. And other more foul things I won’t repeat. Maybe I was not clear about that but I don’t appreciate the accusations of lying or the mocking tone.

[sifth]

51 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I hadn't heard about her kickstarter to get girls to go see the movie. The outrage over that is curious, since I seem to recall people trying to make it possible for more African Americans to see Black Panther being mostly praised, or at least no one openly criticising it. Personally I have a cynical attitude to both of those initiatives. I don't see any reason why people should be raising charity money to help Disney make even more profits. If you want to do something for your community using a film you think might have a positive impact on people, then convince Disney to use (or forego) some of its profits and run a few free screenings at, say, women's refuge shelters. 

I think in principle, if people always tried to say what they want instead of what they don't want there would be less moral outrage over what people say. But what she said really isn't that big of a deal to people who are not already determined to be outraged. And if Brie had actually said "I want more diversity" I think a lot of the people who are outraged over her white men phrasing would still be outraged. Brie Larsen is a dirty SJW in their eyes, which means anything she says is either an overt attack on white men, or a dogwhistle. 

 

I'll be honest, I did not know about the Black Panther Kickstarter. Had I known about it at the time, I'd have issue with that as well. Like you I find both equally disgusting.

It's all about the phrasing though at the end of the day. Don't get me wrong, I know there would have been people who would blindly hate her regardless, but like I said above she gave them a rallying call and that's never a good thing. It's basically like adding gas to a fire. You have to be so careful what you say these days it's not even funny and some people are just very easy to anger. The sad truth is Brie had a really good message and it's something I openly support. Had she just tweaked her words a little and drop the whole "white males" line, I doubt this "controversy" would be even half as big. Those are just my thoughts though.

[Kalbear]

Yeah, if the problem is that a person is trying to drum up enthusiasm for something has to be careful what they say because they might piss off the wackjobs and make them go crazy, the solution is not 'be more considerate of wackjobs'. The solution is to end the wackjobs. 

[A True Kaniggit]

2 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I hadn't heard about her kickstarter to get girls to go see the movie. The outrage over that is curious, since I seem to recall people trying to make it possible for more African Americans to see Black Panther being mostly praised, or at least no one openly criticising it. Personally I have a cynical attitude to both of those initiatives. I don't see any reason why people should be raising charity money to help Disney make even more profits. If you want to do something for your community using a film you think might have a positive impact on people, then convince Disney to use (or forego) some of its profits and run a few free screenings at, say, women's refuge shelters. 

 

You're just looking at it wrong. Disney making more money would just be a side effect, not the goal. 

Edit: And what kickstarter? Is it even a thing, or just gossip? A 4 minute internet search came up with zip.

[Darth Richard II]

32 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

You're just looking at it wrong. Disney making more money would just be a side effect, not the goal. 

Edit: And what kickstarter? Is it even a thing, or just gossip? A 4 minute internet search came up with zip.

Yeah I don't know about the Captain Marvel thing but I believe, and I'm sure you will all fact check me in a seconds anyway, the BP one was a guy who paid out of his own pocket.

[The Anti-Targ]

2 hours ago, sifth said:

I'll be honest, I did not know about the Black Panther Kickstarter. Had I known about it at the time, I'd have issue with that as well. Like you I find both equally disgusting.

It's all about the phrasing though at the end of the day. Don't get me wrong, I know there would have been people who would blindly hate her regardless, but like I said above she gave them a rallying call and that's never a good thing. It's basically like adding gas to a fire. You have to be so careful what you say these days it's not even funny and some people are just very easy to anger. The sad truth is Brie had a really good message and it's something I openly support. Had she just tweaked her words a little and drop the whole "white males" line, I doubt this "controversy" would be even half as big. Those are just my thoughts though.

Y'know who complains about people telling them to be sooooo careful about how they say things so as not to offend? Right wing trolls.  "Don't try to censor me bro!" "Oh did I say something the wrong way? So sorry that you are such a sensitive snowflake!" It's funny how people are so ready to be offended by stuff, and yet at the same time tell other people to not be so offended by stuff.

@ the bold my point was that people are going apeshit at Brie Larsen, when the precedent has already been set as a largely OK thing to do. They are not going apeshit on any rational principle, they are going apeshit because it's Brie Larsen doing a girl power thing.

[Jace, Extat]

Just now, The Anti-Targ said:

Y'know who complains about people telling them to be sooooo careful about how they say things so as not to offend? Right wing trolls.  "Don't try to censor me bro!" "Oh did I say something the wrong way? So sorry that you are such a sensitive snowflake!" It's funny how people are so ready to be offended by stuff, and yet at the same time tell other people to not be so offended by stuff.

Welcome to America?

[sifth]

1 minute ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Y'know who complains about people telling them to be sooooo careful about how they say things so as not to offend? Right wing trolls.  "Don't try to censor me bro!" "Oh did I say something the wrong way? So sorry that you are such a sensitive snowflake!" It's funny how people are so ready to be offended by stuff, and yet at the same time tell other people to not be so offended by stuff.

Sounds like every kid I've ever taught, and most of their parents as well.

[sifth]

43 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

You're just looking at it wrong. Disney making more money would just be a side effect, not the goal. 

Edit: And what kickstarter? Is it even a thing, or just gossip? A 4 minute internet search came up with zip.

https://www.gofundme.com/captainmarvel

 

It was a Go Fund Me page. Sorry about the mix up.

[The Anti-Targ]

8 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

Yeah I don't know about the Captain Marvel thing but I believe, and I'm sure you will all fact check me in a seconds anyway, the BP one was a guy who paid out of his own pocket.

You might be right. I thought it was people asking for donations to help people see BP. I don't think there was any kickstarter for it.

Yeah, just fact checked, it was a gofundme, "the Black Panther Challenge"

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/opinion-joseph-black-panther-challenge_us_5a786c52e4b06ee97af530b9

 

[The Anti-Targ]

2 minutes ago, Jace, Basilissa said:

Welcome to America?

Hey, don't sell yourself short. AFAIK it's everywhere. We just hear about it more in America.

[Jace, Extat]

12 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Hey, don't sell yourself short. AFAIK it's everywhere. We just hear about it more in America.

America is just like everywhere else. Only more so.