US Politics: Biden vs. Ron DeCardassian in the Delta quadrant

[DMC]

5 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Having said that; her discomfort is less important than protecting the rights of hundreds of millions of people and protecting democracy.

The problem is she already thinks she is.  And you have no reasonable argument to say she isn't other than "you're gonna die soon."  That's..not cool.

[DMC]

Let's look at this empirically.  There have been plenty of really old MCs in recent years, even decades.  Strom Thurmond, Robert Byrd, Daniel Inouye, John Dingell, John Conyers.  The only one to affect anything was Ted Kennedy.  And why?  Because he had brain cancer and he knew he was gonna die.  Dianne Feinstein does not have cancer, as far as I know.  She has no reason to believe she's gonna die soon, as far as I know. 

Let's leave Dianne Feinstein alone and maybe give her some dignity.  The people of California elected her to be Senator until January 3, 2025.  I don't see any reason not to respect that.

[Varysblackfyre321]

31 minutes ago, DMC said:

The problem is she already thinks she is

That is the problem yes. So did Ginsburg. 

31 minutes ago, DMC said:

And you have no reasonable argument to say she isn't other than "you're gonna die soon."

My argument is that she an 88 year old woman should retire when a democrat can immediately replace her.

31 minutes ago, DMC said:

That's..not cool.

What benefits do you think outweigh the risks of keeping Feinstein during a potential Republican governorship?

Yes. The recall can still fail. There’s a significant chance it won’t though and the democrats agendas would rest tremendously on a 88 year old woman.

15 minutes ago, DMC said:

She has no reason to believe she's gonna die soon, as far as I know. 

Except her advanced age.

15 minutes ago, DMC said:

Let's leave Dianne Feinstein alone and maybe give her some dignity. 

You’re making this about respecting the wishes of one old woman in regards to continuing a career that brings her personal enjoyment.

Instead of how best to insure the democratic agenda isn’t impeded.

If Newsom does lose the recall—and there is a significant chance he will—would you not rest easier if Feinstein retires before a maniac like Elder assumes power?

Yes she may not die and live to see a hundred. Hope she does. I am not willing to bet our democracy on any particular old individual’s health.

[HoodedCrow]

So , if we find anyone in office with an incurable disease of any age, they should be required to quit their job. How about you Varys. Have you had a check up lately?

[Varysblackfyre321]

13 minutes ago, HoodedCrow said:

So , if we find anyone in office with an incurable disease of any age, they should be required to quit their job. How about you Varys. Have you had a check up lately?

That’s a ugly misinterpretation of what I’ve been arguing.
It could be a moral and pragmatic for someone to retire. Because they’re decisions to stay could do a lot of damage to a lot of people.

Roe v Wade is on the chopping block. It wouldn’t be if Ginsburg had retired in 2012.

[HoodedCrow]

Wait for insurance companies to have your genetic material. Hope your never in a car accident . I think what you are saying is hideous.

[Varysblackfyre321]

11 minutes ago, HoodedCrow said:

Wait for insurance companies to have your genetic material. Hope your never in a car accident . I think what you are saying is hideous.

Would Roe V Wade be as endangered as it is if Ginsburg retired in 2013?
You know it probably wouldn’t. 

It’s unwise to pretend a single individuals’ feelings outweigh the preservation of the rights and safety of millions.

 

[HoodedCrow]

If I were Empress of the World, I would have foreseen Trump in 2013. Darn it. I would have cloned RBG:)

[Arakan]

39 minutes ago, HoodedCrow said:

So , if we find anyone in office with an incurable disease of any age, they should be required to quit their job. How about you Varys. Have you had a check up lately?

I think it’s a matter of intrinsic socio-cultural world view. 
If the individual is valued over the community then of course she should stay. If the community as a whole is valued higher than any single individual then you will do what’s best for the community. Of course this is very simplified but the stakes are very high and the margins are very fine. 

And ultimately someone like RGB was selfish and too much in love with her position which gave her power and validation. Many people might or will suffer because of her decision. Personal sacrifices, and be it just one’s own ego are sometimes necessary to do what’s important and essential for the life of many people. 

[Varysblackfyre321]

4 minutes ago, HoodedCrow said:

If I were Empress of the World, I would have foreseen Trump in 2013. Darn it. I would have cloned RBG:)

Republicans were seen as likely to take back congress in 2014.

They did.

Ginsburg has weeks to leave before they were sworn into power.

She didn’t.

It didn’t take seer a Republican President soon following in 2016. It didn’t have to Trump.

Any good Republican would have appointed a conservative to replace her when she died.

This is 

[Zorral]

10 minutes ago, Arakan said:

RGB was selfish and too much in love with her position which gave her power and validation.

It is equally possible that like most human beings throughout history she couldn't face the reality that she was going to die, particularly the reality that she was far likely to die sooner rather than later, so stayed in denial.

[Varysblackfyre321]

4 minutes ago, Zorral said:

It is equally possible that like most human beings throughout history she couldn't face the reality that she was going to die, particularly the reality that she was far likely to die sooner rather than later, so stayed in denial.

Which is understandable to a degree. It can be hard to recognize ones own mortality and frailty. It can be scary.

[HoodedCrow]

She missed it by a few months:(

[DMC]

2 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

You’re making this about respecting the wishes of one old woman in regards to continuing a career that brings her personal enjoyment.

Instead of how best to insure the democratic agenda isn’t impeded.

No, you're insanely overreacting to a single possibility and acting as if all of democracy is at stake whether or not one old woman resigns from the Senate or not.

[DireWolfSpirit]

I've always questioned anyone's sanity that willingly works beyond 62.

Beyond 65 then I'm not questioning that sanity, I'm flat out convinced its (their sanity) taken flight.

But 70-90 and still tethered to a position of some sorts, there's a personal tragedy playing out, I don't admire anything about the lack of curiosity or imagination to experience the rest of nature and life the way one can only do when not weighed down by the toiling they tragically crave apparently.

[Arakan]

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

It is equally possible that like most human beings throughout history she couldn't face the reality that she was going to die, particularly the reality that she was far likely to die sooner rather than later, so stayed in denial.

This is a fallacy. Retiring from a position to secure a smooth transition and one’s life achievements doesn’t equal facing imminent death. And anyway, that is life. In 2014 she was already 81, time to enjoy retirement. 

Anyway, what you write is not true. Until very recently death was a constant companion of life. It’s only in the last decades that we (in the rich West) can deny our mortality, thanks to availability and progress in medicine, no hunger, no major catastrophic wars. For the politicians I grew up with, the old generation, death was a fact of life. Gerhard Schröder‘s father died fighting in WW2, Helmut Kohl‘s brother as well, Helmut Schmidt saw dozens of comrades die, and those are just three recent chancellors and the tip of the iceberg. 

RBG did a lot of great and important things and no one will take her legacy away from her (well maybe yes) but that doesn’t mean she can’t be criticized. I am a huge fan of accountability, she could have retired in 2014 and enjoy her life AND secure her legacy. She chose otherwise and for this one should be able to criticize her. 

[HoodedCrow]

Sure critcise. She did a lot of good and she worked at the important job that she loved. 

[Zorral]

12 minutes ago, Arakan said:

This is a fallacy. Retiring from a position to secure a smooth transition and one’s life achievements doesn’t equal facing imminent death. .... 

12 minutes ago, Arakan said:

Anyway, what you write is not true. Until very recently death was a constant companion of life. It’s only in the last decades that we (in the rich West) can deny our mortality, thanks to availability and progress in medicine, no hunger, no major catastrophic wars.

 

You seem to understand as little about real human beings as those who glibly proclaim that in the middle ages parents didn't grieve the many losses of their infants and little children because so many of them died before age three.  That is the fallacy.

[Ormond]

2 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

I've always questioned anyone's sanity that willingly works beyond 62.

Beyond 65 then I'm not questioning that sanity, I'm flat out convinced its (their sanity) taken flight.

But 70-90 and still tethered to a position of some sorts, there's a personal tragedy playing out, I don't admire anything about the lack of curiosity or imagination to experience the rest of nature and life the way one can only do when not weighed down by the toiling they tragically crave apparently.

Come on, people who really want to continue working past 70 (as opposed to those who feel they must because of financial reasons) do so because the work in their occupation is NOT "toiling" to them. They are people who love what they do and whose sense of self is wrapped up in their occupation and position. They believe they are getting much more enjoyment on average every day by continuing to work then they would if they retired -- in their minds retirement would lead to boredom and depression. I don't think that's really what would happen to most of them, but I think that is their own belief about the matter. 

[SpaceChampion]

Milo Yiannopoulos seems to have covid, and appears to be injecting ivermectin. 

Appears is the operative word.  It's probably a grift to claim ivermectin is a miracle cure, and get right wing media interested in having him on tv again.