The Wheel of Time TV Show 5: Eye of the Fandom [BOOK SPOILERS]

[IFR]

4 hours ago, Gertrude said:

Hey! We agree!

But honestly, I'd be fine with them just dropping Moiraine/Thom completely, even if they don't do Moiriane/Siuan. Neither Moiraine/Thom or Siuan/Bryne added anything to the story for me personally. They were means to an end (Moiraine's rescue and Bryne with the Little Tower) and I think how those things happen could be set up differently with little consequence.

I wish they would drop every romantic relationship in the book, or leave it mostly to inference. It was a weak point for Jordan and I have every confidence that it will be a weak point for this show. But I fear that it will be an even more significant part of the show than the books. Sex sells, even in the form of hackneyed romance.

Although the writers may be able to do something interesting with Mat and Tuon. That was less of a relationship and more of a power play driven by the inevitability of fate. As opposed to a vanilla romance flavored by non-stop moments of couples harranguing each other over gender expectations and differences.

[Gertrude]

If they can do something interesting with a romance, I'm all for it. I do think there is a lot of room for interesting romances, but so many of them ended up feeling like they were thrown together - everyone had to be coupled up just because. Honestly, there's no reason Egwene has to have Gawyn by her side and I hope they just don't go there with her.

Although sex and romance aren't the same thing. There's plenty of room for sexy time that doesn't have to be romance .... enter Mat!

[fionwe1987]

13 hours ago, IFR said:

I wish they would drop every romantic relationship in the book, or leave it mostly to inference. It was a weak point for Jordan and I have every confidence that it will be a weak point for this show. But I fear that it will be an even more significant part of the show than the books. Sex sells, even in the form of hackneyed romance.

Although the writers may be able to do something interesting with Mat and Tuon. That was less of a relationship and more of a power play driven by the inevitability of fate. As opposed to a vanilla romance flavored by non-stop moments of couples harranguing each other over gender expectations and differences.

I'm fine with Lan and Nynaeve. I can actually see what they find attractive in each other, and the way Nynaeve matures and takes an active hand in allowing Lan to do his duty was one of the better bits of writing RJ did. 

Rand and Min makes sense to me too. She really does like him, and he desperately needs her, by the time they get together. 

Perrin and Faile somehow went through all the crazy and ended up healthy? They should clean it up from the books, certainly, but that can stay, as well.

Egwene, I agree, could totally be single and the story would work just fine. 

Elayne should end up with Aviendha, if she ends up with anyone at all. Or if they genuinely want to show a poly relationship, they can. They just need to work on making it be better than in the books. 

[Ran]

I always loved the conversation between Lan and Nynaeve that Rand overheard in EotW. 

[David Selig]

 

This is better than a trailer for me.

Looks pretty good, apart from being a bit too dark.

[Ran]

Ooooof.

The direction is horrible.

[fionwe1987]

1 hour ago, Ran said:

I always loved the conversation between Lan and Nynaeve that Rand overheard in EotW. 

Agreed. 

3 minutes ago, Ran said:

Ooooof.

The direction is horrible.

Yeah I'm not particularly feeling this scene. Maybe it works better in context, but this felt awkward.

[Ran]

3 minutes ago, fionwe1987 said:

Agreed. 

Yeah I'm not particularly feeling this scene. Maybe it works better in context, but this felt awkward.

Yeah, to be fair, this is not the opening scene but something further on. Maybe they'll build up these two mysterious figures being spotted in the shadows, lurking about here and there, and then they suddenly waltz in after everyone's on edge. But as it is, the extreme focus pulls (especially the one hiding Moiraine's appearance as she approaches) and the rapid succession of reaction shots felt painfully amateurish, calling attention to itself. And this is from a proven cinematographer and director, so I can only assume the showrunner had a hand in making it look as it did...

Wildly different reception than from the book, though, regardless, where everyone but Nynaeve was taken with "Lady Moiraine" and her "guard". No one realizes Moiraine is an Aes Sedai until the Trolloc attack, either.

 

[fionwe1987]

3 minutes ago, Ran said:

Yeah, to be fair, this is not the opening scene but something further on. Maybe they'll build up these two mysterious figures being spotted in the shadows, lurking about here and there, and then they suddenly waltz in after everyone's on edge.

Yeah, the tension might play differently if we have establishing scenes of hooded strangers, and more context for the obvious Rand-Egwene tension here.

Quote

Wildly different reception than from the book, though, regardless, where everyone but Nynaeve was taken with "Lady Moiraine" and her "guard". No one realizes Moiraine is an Aes Sedai until the Trolloc attack, either.

 

Yeah. But I can see there being no time for things like that here. They can't spend a whole episode on the Two Rivers. It's just not feasible in an 8 episode season, so a dramatic entrance makes some sense. 

What doesn't is Lan just barging in like that. It doesn't make particular sense, from his perspective, unless they're running in after a chase or something. Which, again, in context this can work.

It's a weird clip to pick, I guess? In theory, it makes sense to show the moment Moiraine walks into their lives. But in execution, this isn't exactly a standout scene. 

 

Is the music from the show? I like the beat. It's somewhat distinct, at least. 

[David Selig]

Rafe Judkins just announced that Elayne would be in the season 2 and will be played by Ceara Coveney, as the leaks suggested.

[Corvinus85]

25 minutes ago, David Selig said:

 

This is better than a trailer for me.

Looks pretty good, apart from being a bit too dark.

I thought it had good tension. But it was a bit too dark.

I like how big the common room of the inn is, even though the Winespring Inn isn't supposed to be a huge inn.

[Gertrude]

Yeah, I wasn't impressed with this scene. It was ok, just really awkward. Loved the look of it though!

[Corvinus85]

20 minutes ago, fionwe1987 said:

What doesn't is Lan just barging in like that. It doesn't make particular sense, from his perspective, unless they're running in after a chase or something. Which, again, in context this can work.

The door opened normally. I wouldn't call it barging in. The Warder went in ahead of the Aes Sedai to make sure it's safe. The weirder part is him acting as a herald. 

[fionwe1987]

36 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

The door opened normally. I wouldn't call it barging in. The Warder went in ahead of the Aes Sedai to make sure it's safe. The weirder part is him acting as a herald. 

He comes in and just stands there. That felt very weird. Like, I get that maybe you're supposed to worry he's one of the hooded riders. But he doesn't know about the riders, so why's he imitating them?

The inn is the largest building in the village, and serves the whole village and the surrounding farms..so I'm not surprised it is fairly large. That's the sense I got from the books, too. 

 

ETA: I guess the clip resolves one thing for me. Whatever the physical chemistry may be between Rand and Egwene, we're getting the tension in their relationship right from the start. Good to see that preserved. 

[SpaceChampion]

From the soundtrack: https://music.apple.com/us/album/alnaito-from-the-wheel-of-time-soundtrack-single/1589084571

[Liffguard]

1 hour ago, Ran said:

Ooooof.

The direction is horrible.

Yeah, the best way I can think to describe it was that it was directed almost like a stage play. Which isn't bad...on stage. On camera it comes off way too melodramatic. Though as you say, it might land better in the context of the whole episode.

[Corvinus85]

I have to chuckle at the direction criticism, as it reminds me of GoT's Red Wedding that did feel like a stage play at times, especially Roose's drive-by knifing moment. And the actor is in this scene, too. 

[fionwe1987]

54 minutes ago, David Selig said:

Rafe Judkins just announced that Elayne would be in the season 2 and will be played by Ceara Coveney, as the leaks suggested.

And two others who are potentially Elaida and Verin. Meera Sayal is hilarious, and she'd make a great Verin, who's capable of some very funny jokes that only make sense in retrospect when you know her long game. 

Verin is someone whose role I hope they really expand. Though that may be hard to do and keep her motives unclear enough. I feel her final reveal was perfectly obvious in retrospect, but despite obsessive theorizing about her goals, no one quite got it entirely right. 

She's the shadowy hero who's pulling more strings than even Moraine and Siuan, and yet was completely impossible for most of the fandom to parse the motives of, which is why she's such a fan favorite, I think. 

I wonder how much the theorizing and guessing-game aspect of WoT, which was kind of a conversation between the author and the readers, can be preserved in the show. This played a huge role, at least for me, for respecting the books so much. They're far from perfect, but the author displayed enough intelligence and creativity in his discussions with the fans that you were both the consumers of his media output but also kind of cheerleaders to this success. 

Though I guess a cynical way to see this is that you ended up getting invested in wanting a good ending that would justify your time in this world. That the payoff would make you feel pleased you got into these involved discussions of the books, rather than sad about the time you wasted. 

Well, Verin was one of those payoffs that was very pleasing. It worked. It had emotional heft. And best of all, despite obsessive theorizing, no one did predict it in it's entirety, or at least, they didn't manage to make it so popular a large bunch of readers figured that was the truth.

And not because it was particularly convoluted, but because it was fairly simple. It made sense with what we knew of the character. That one of her clearest traits is what led her down this path, that was the key to the mystery, do it was actually in plain sight.

If they want a sequel, something that's a little more dark and noir-ish, they should do an "Adventures of Verin" prequel. Cadsuane would work too, for this. They both have sufficient history that we can flesh out the outline of a story that is true to the books, but then add nuance and layers that they don't get because they have very little screentime in the books. 

Of course, she's an author self-insert. And those don't always translate well on screen, so all this speculation may be for nothing. But that's nothing new to a WoT fan, lol. 

[Ran]

33 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

I have to chuckle at the direction criticism, as it reminds me of GoT's Red Wedding that did feel like a stage play at times, especially Roose's drive-by knifing moment. And the actor is in this scene, too. 

I had to look again to spot McElhatton. Good catch.

And you're not wrong. I disliked the staging of the Red Wedding quite a lot, as it happened...

[Elaena Targaryen]

4 hours ago, Ran said:

Yeah, to be fair, this is not the opening scene but something further on. Maybe they'll build up these two mysterious figures being spotted in the shadows, lurking about here and there, and then they suddenly waltz in after everyone's on edge. But as it is, the extreme focus pulls (especially the one hiding Moiraine's appearance as she approaches) and the rapid succession of reaction shots felt painfully amateurish, calling attention to itself. And this is from a proven cinematographer and director, so I can only assume the showrunner had a hand in making it look as it did...

Wildly different reception than from the book, though, regardless, where everyone but Nynaeve was taken with "Lady Moiraine" and her "guard". No one realizes Moiraine is an Aes Sedai until the Trolloc attack, either.

 

nvm