[No Spoilers] Episode 109 Discussion

[Ran]

Spoiler free discussion here.

[Zorral]

Finally, somebody gets it, and it would be Rhaenys, if one's got a dragon of one's own, let's use it.  But yet, in the end, no dracarys -- just almost death by dragon halitosis.  Of course, otherwise, no more plot, amirite? 

[Zorral]

Also totally lost since didn't King V die the same night after his heroic walk to Iron Throne and then the dinner?  So where is Rhaenyra and fam?  I swear Daemon stayed behind and he's pretending all along to be Aemond.

Who the eff are these Erics? Where in hell did they come from?

What a frakin' mess.  No connective tissue.

And how inexpressibly ugly, creepy and horrible Alicent playing strip poker with Larys for info.  The only thing worse than that tonight was the fighting pits of the kids. Despite Alicent and Larys being mutually consenting adults. Don't let them near any kids at all in any way.

Edited October 17, 2022 by Zorral

[Corvinus85]

5 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Also totally lost since didn't King V die the same night after his heroic walk to Iron Throne and then the dinner?  So where is Rhaenyra and fam?  I swear Daemon stayed behind and he's pretending all along to be Aemond.

Who the eff are these Erics? Where in hell did they come from?

Rhaenyra tells Alicent they were leaving for Dragonstone but that she would return of dragonback. So they left right after the dinner.

Ser Arryk and Ser Erryk were shown in episode 8 as well, one of them is the one who brings Alicent the news about her rapist son. And there are a few shots with both of them guarding the family at the dinner.

[Zorral]

22 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

there are a few shots with both of them guarding the family at the dinner.

These guys all look alike, you know the mullet etc. same age, same build etc.  Hard to tell the difference w/o any character building. You know, like the multiples of dum blonde grrrlys.   Plus, you know, all those scenes are really dark and one can hardly see anything, much less faces.

In any case, the Big Take Away, is whatever one may think about Alicent, etc., whatever she did or didn't do, the Greens, particularly her Big Daddy, were all along planning coup -- just like we know who, as was shown on other tv just Thursday.  Bad people.  Why o why didn't Rhaenys flame them?  She killed all those other people anyway.  O ya, again, recall, gotta keep the franchi$e going with bogus plot points that never were there in the first place.

Again, you know, Criston kills a very highly ranked person among many other highly ranked persons and NOTHING AT ALL HAPPENS TO HIM.

Ya, total writing mess.

 

 

Edited October 17, 2022 by Zorral

[Corvinus85]

32 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Again, you know, Criston kills a very highly ranked person among many other highly ranked persons and NOTHING AT ALL HAPPENS TO HIM.

That was per the book, except here it seemed accidental. In the book it's likely he murdered him since he was the only dissenting voice and the rest were all in on the coup. So no writing mess there.

Btw, is this thread no spoilers or no book spoilers?

Edited October 17, 2022 by Corvinus85

[Steelborn]

edit

Edited October 17, 2022 by Steelborn

[Cashless Society]

4 hours ago, Zorral said:

Again, you know, Criston kills a very highly ranked person among many other highly ranked persons and NOTHING AT ALL HAPPENS TO HIM.

Ya, total writing mess.

But why would you expect anything to happen to him this time around?

[Zorral]

Finally, somebody gets it: you got a dragon you use it, thank you, Rhaenys! 

OTOH, so, the greens can’t be taken out by dragon halitosis? So, um, you too did not use your dragon. Sad, sad, sad.

Who was that blonde kid sleeping, who wakes, trots off to the kitchen and tells Alicent’s maid that King V is dead?  How does HE know? He was asleep! How in the world are we know that’s … Aemond … in that hoodi ... and not Daemon? Coz I swear by the seven, whatever they are, that he is Daemon. He even thinks he should be his brother’s heir, like Daemon believed he should have been King V’s, his brother’s heir. Wot da fook that footsie strip poker with Larys and Alicent? Who in hell are these “Erics” that suddenly show up from where? that we learn are Erics, Eric 1 and Eric 2?  Who soon break into Dumas’s The Three Musketeers' France and non-purposely cloak-and-sword fight on stairs WTH? Why is Aegon, the Nothing of His Name, for a night out on the town, hang out under a table?

It was pretty good to look at, at the coronation – though hard to see through the omnipresent murk that is the signature pollution of King’s Landing – makes ya miss the rats. Or, maybe not, since before that, it was running round and round like rats on a wheel, another  murder by Criston for which he suffers no consequences, this time at the Small Council, which shrugs and carries on with its coupsterage.

Some say otherwise, but it was just the day before King V again declared Rhaenrya the Heir, while Alicent determined he meant the son, Aegon, Nothing of His Name, that she herself can’t stand, the heir.  Come on, Alicent, with all your book learning, you’re smarter than that, so ya, you’re a hypocritical, lying, two-faced coupster yourself. At least Rhaenys recognizes that, even if she couldn't cut bait and have her dragon incinerate all these useless rats.

Show’s done an excellent job at getting me to loathe the disgusting Hightowers, etc., yet, it is an incoherent mess. No to mention icky/creepy/vomitous – little kids fighting and tearing each other in a pit to the death while adults bet on them like cocks, footsie mutual masturbation – notice Alicent participates in the barely allowed shaking as Larys barely shakes –  yuck.

Hmmmm. Featured in each: a special dagger of Valyria in HotD and a special dagger from Valinor in RoP.  An old, impaired king dies in each too. Coincidence?

Edited October 17, 2022 by Zorral

[DMC]

2 hours ago, Zorral said:

Who was that blonde kid sleeping, who wakes, trots off to the kitchen and tells Alicent’s maid that King V is dead?  How does HE know? He was asleep!

They never show him asleep or waking up.  The first shot is of him leaving a room - presumably Viserys' room as he's the first one who discovered him dead.  It it reflects the books, presumably he's a serving boy.

[Zorral]

It sure looked as though he was sleeping -- and such a blondie -- I thought he was one of Daemon's or V's kids -- or grandkids.  Nor can I believe for a second that there was no adult in King V's bedroom, considering his state of near death. 

 

[DMC]

16 minutes ago, Zorral said:

It sure looked as though he was sleeping -- and such a blondie -- I thought he was one of Daemon's or V's kids -- or grandkids. 

I mean he was fully dressed.  And yeah between the blonde hair and his red garb, my first thought was "is that Tommen?"

[BlackLightning]

33 minutes ago, Zorral said:

It sure looked as though he was sleeping -- and such a blondie -- I thought he was one of Daemon's or V's kids -- or grandkids.  Nor can I believe for a second that there was no adult in King V's bedroom, considering his state of near death. 

I thought it was Daeron.

[Zorral]

 

Quote

it was Daeron

Who is this Sylvia What Is She, That All the Swains Commend Her?     Erm I mean Daeron. Never heard of him.  He's not on the show. But on the show we hardly even hear of most of the people who are on it.  (This is the forum where we don't drag in the book(s), lore, etc. We are dealing only with what we get on the screen.

~~~~~~~~~~~

I guess They told her to say it.  Except she did kill a whole lot of innocent people.  Hand wave, hand wave, do the Hand Wave!

https://www.vulture.com/article/house-of-dragon-eve-best-interview-escape-green-council.html

Quote

 

Q: Okay, so: Why didn’t Rhaenys just torch the royal family and the whole Green crew?

A: [Laughs long and hard.] I know! The temptation is there, right? In the end, she makes a bigger choice. We see that at the moment with what’s going on in Ukraine; to choose not to destroy is the better choice. That’s an important thing for us all to remember right now.

It’s why she would have made such a great leader. She had, in that moment, all the power. Yet she has respect for Alicent as a woman and a mother. They understand being in the grip of other people who might torch them. They know the only right choice is not to go there. Furthermore, it’s the intelligent choice, on her part, not to torch a whole bunch of innocent people in the room. What’s to be gained? In the end, it’s not her battle.  ....

 

But it will be her battle.  There's no getting around that.  Her granddaughters are alive and heirs to Drift Mark.  As far as we know, her husband is still alive, and he ain't no greeny.

Further as far as not killing innocent people, that use of Ukraine was a terrible choice for justification, because people are killing all over the place, and would be even if Ukraine chose not to resist.

In the meantime Rhaenys's choice means seasons and seasons, decades and decades, of the high born she chose not to incinerate burning, plundering, raping, starving, selling, murdering and destroying thousands and thousands of innocent small folk, and to a lesser degree, each other.  So Imma not buying into this.

Ya They She doesn't know all this, but she does murder innocent smallfolk -- who moreover were rounded up against their will to be in that horrible dark dank place to 'witness' the crowning of a cruel, heartless, ignorant, stupid pos.  Whom she knows to be all those things.

It sure doesn't look like anything to look forward to -- there's no stories here.  Just a lot of blood and immiseration lurching and thudding back-and-forth over Westros.  Quite unlike what Sharon Kay Penman did with the Anarchy in her novel. It has somewhere to go.  This doesn't.  At least so we're told, that there are no good guys here, no admirable figures, just ugly, degenerate power hungry sadists.

Edited October 17, 2022 by Zorral

[Cashless Society]

22 hours ago, Zorral said:

 How in the world are we know that’s … Aemond … in that hoodi ... and not Daemon? Coz I swear by the seven, whatever they are, that he is Daemon. He even thinks he should be his brother’s heir, like Daemon believed he should have been King V’s, his brother’s heir.

Why is Aegon, the Nothing of His Name, for a night out on the town, hang out under a table?

another  murder by Criston for which he suffers no consequences, this time at the Small Council, which shrugs and carries on with its coupsterage.

Some say otherwise, but it was just the day before King V again declared Rhaenrya the Heir, while Alicent determined he meant the son, Aegon, Nothing of His Name, that she herself can’t stand, the heir.  Come on, Alicent, with all your book learning, you’re smarter than that, so ya, you’re a hypocritical, lying, two-faced coupster yourself.

Well, one has an eyepatch while the other doesn't.

After finding out about Viserys' death (Talya lighting the candles in his room), Mysaria spotted an opportunity and opted to kidnap Aegon the Elder and ransom him in exchange for the crown putting an end to Fight Club: Kids Edition.

Why would anybody punish Criston for this specific deed?

But she's been a coupster since the middle of episode 5. 

[Zorral]

3 hours ago, Cashless Society said:

Well, one has an eyepatch while the other doesn't. 

After finding out about Viserys' death (Talya lighting the candles in his room), Mysaria spotted an opportunity and opted to kidnap Aegon the Elder and ransom him in exchange for the crown putting an end to Fight Club: Kids Edition.

You're so right about that.    However, there's no reason why Daemon couldn't have donned a patch in imitation, right? 

As far as Mysaria kidnapping Aegon -- how is that since he's under a table in a -- sept? -- and there aren't even any guards?  Wasn't Talya lighting candles in the kitchen, not V's chambers? There are all these cooks already working as one does in a castle. So I for one have no idea he was kidnapped at all. So, no don't think there was kidnapping.  I kinda thought she sorta told the trackers where he might be, and that was at best.  The action is as opaque in this show as the scenes' lighting. 

Edited October 18, 2022 by Zorral

[Cashless Society]

11 hours ago, Zorral said:

As far as Mysaria kidnapping Aegon -- how is that since he's under a table in a -- sept? -- and there aren't even any guards?  Wasn't Talya lighting candles in the kitchen, not V's chambers? There are all these cooks already working as one does in a castle. So I for one have no idea he was kidnapped at all. So, no don't think there was kidnapping.  I kinda thought she sorta told the trackers where he might be, and that was at best.  The action is as opaque in this show as the scenes' lighting. 

Nope, after the boy informs her of Viserys' death, Talya informs Alicent who in turn informs her father. It is while Alicent is away that Talya lights the candles in the room.

Mysaria to Otto: 

Quote

The Prince is in Flea Bottom, where no one is to be trusted. I'd best secrete him somewhere safe... in case they come looking for him [...] He is safely tucked away.

 

[EggBlue]

On 10/17/2022 at 10:11 PM, BlackLightning said:

I thought it was Daeron.

my first thought too! 

is Daeron going to be in the show? I'm getting worried, I expected that someone mentions him in ep8's dinner ... 

[$erPounce]

2 hours ago, EggBlue said:

my first thought too! 

is Daeron going to be in the show? I'm getting worried, I expected that someone mentions him in ep8's dinner ... 

Daeron will be in the show. George confirmed it in his NotABlog.

[BlackLightning]

4 hours ago, EggBlue said:

my first thought too! 

is Daeron going to be in the show? I'm getting worried, I expected that someone mentions him in ep8's dinner ... 

GRRM has confirmed that Daeron is in the show (him not being in the show would pulverize the plot when the war starts), but it's weird how they are not mentioning him at all. They should've name-dropped him in at least episodes 8 and 9.