So, I hate Daenerys

[Swordsaint]

I used to hate reading Dany's Pov's too, but she's getting more interesting with each book. What boggles my mind is how she could remain so naive to the city's of Slaver's Bay after seeing children gutted and crucified on the way to Meereen. If was me in her shoes, there would have been no Grand Master's, or slavers at left to oppose me. There would have been no Son's of the Harpy, no pits, and no marrying the fat bastard. I think George is just using that as another "growth phase" for her.

As for her entitlement..... she's done the time, so she might as well do the crime. She's ran her whole life from assassins, been sold as a wife for an army, Her whole family was murdered. Bet your A$$ she has an entitlement issue! Who wouldn't? Now she has dragons, and weather she's entitled or not she's coming for that throne. Hell, I'd marry her:P

[Jaghen]

Daario Sparrow just became my favorite character... kinda makes sense, should have seen it earlier !

Kittykatknits, whether Cat confronted Ned or not is irrelevant in the fact that Jon had no part in the shame she suffered whatsoever... I personally started hating her with the "It should have been you...", and have had a harsh judgement on everything she did afterwards.

On a side note, I wonder if Sansa post Feast still gets as many haters as Dany (who's numbers have skyrocketted with Dance) and Cat (unchanged I guess, Uncat being as much controversial as Cat was...).

[Florent Vixen]

I don't hate Dany but I find her very boring and her chapters

tedious for the most part.

Sense of entitlement, signs of incompetence, naive about

attitudes towards her family in Westeros, refusal

to listen to why the " unsurper dogs" acted as they did

aren't in her favor either.

[The Bastard of Summer]

Yes I know she confronted Ned. She did not have to act the way she did. Period.

[Winter's Knight]

Yes I know she confronted Ned. She did not have to act the way she did. Period.

Eh?

[The Bastard of Summer]

Eh?

i was replying to something up above. Didnt feel like hitting the quote button and doing lots of deleting. I'm on my Nook tablet not my pc.

[loveigniting09]

I'm so glad we have this thread back at the top! I've been waiting for the monthly weekly daily hourly "I hate Dany thread," and just the past couple of days, I've been disappointed!

So glad we have this thread here. Yessir.

~plants flowers in the thread~

Oh, and can I just say I don't really like the idea of Dany/Jon? The problem is that Jon is too f***ing boring and flat for her, honestly. His presence would bring down the overall quality of her chapters. No offense to him really, but can't he just, like, stay dead? And Dany and Daario rule Westeros instead? I like that a lot better really.

Please no Dany/Jon. And I'm not even going to think about Dany/Jorah. Brain bleach!!!

*delurks* Heh. The bolded seems hilariously ironical. I mean, I love Jon. I love Dany. But I'm not blind to the differences in how they are written compared to the rest of the characters. Calling one flat without calling the other flat (personal like/dislike for a character is not what I mean but character development) is almost as amusing to me as those who love Jaime and hate Cersei or love Arya and hate Sansa. That's not a perfect comparison but oh well, it's late. *Back to lurking*

[PatrickStormborn]

*delurks* Heh. The bolded seems hilariously ironical. I mean, I love Jon. I love Dany. But I'm not blind to the differences in how they are written compared to the rest of the characters. Calling one flat without calling the other flat (personal like/dislike for a character is not what I mean but character development) is almost as amusing to me as those who love Jaime and hate Cersei or love Arya and hate Sansa. That's not a perfect comparison but oh well, it's late. *Back to lurking*

I don't think "flat" is the right word to describe Dany. If she was a flat character, there wouldn't be several hate threads appearing on the board each week. On the other hand, Jon is not a threatening or controversial character in the slightest -- he's also probably the least grey POV character in the series.

[TheHoodedLady]

I'm just saying that Jorah is an experienced man, who has seen a lot of things in his life, made a lot of mistakes and regretted them and Dany is just and arrogant little girl who thinks that everyone should bow before her only because she's a perfect Targaryen who hasn't even seen Westeros in her life and knows almost nothing about it. And I don't think Drogo would conquer Westeros without Dany and Viserys.

Perhaps I'm not a reader who knows every single word in the book and I'd appreciate if you correct me sometimes but there's no need for hating. The purpose of this forum is to clarify some things and exchange opinions.

[Winter's Knight]

I'm just saying that Jorah is an experienced man, who has seen a lot of things in his life, made a lot of mistakes and regretted them and Dany is just and arrogant little girl who thinks that everyone should bow before her only because she's a perfect Targaryen who hasn't even seen Westeros in her life and knows almost nothing about it. And I don't think Drogo would conquer Westeros without Dany and Viserys.

Perhaps I'm not a reader who knows every single word in the book and I'd appreciate if you correct me sometimes but there's no need for hating. The purpose of this forum is to clarify some things and exchange opinions.

Dany has suffered much more than Jorah and unlike him, wasn't responsible for most of her suffering. To dismiss her as an arrogant, entitled brat is negating her entire storyline in my opinion.

[PatrickStormborn]

I'm just saying that Jorah is an experienced man, who has seen a lot of things in his life, made a lot of mistakes and regretted them and Dany is just and arrogant little girl who thinks that everyone should bow before her only because she's a perfect Targaryen who hasn't even seen Westeros in her life and knows almost nothing about it. And I don't think Drogo would conquer Westeros without Dany and Viserys.

Perhaps I'm not a reader who knows every single word in the book and I'd appreciate if you correct me sometimes but there's no need for hating. The purpose of this forum is to clarify some things and exchange opinions.

Is Dany arrogant? Sure, if by arrogant you mean that she has pride.

But let's look at this more closely: is there anything wrong with Dany's arrogance? Hell, if I birthed the only three living dragons in the world, crossed the Red Waste, was the first female Khal, survived the House of the Undying, sacked three cities, and rode a motherfucking dragon, I think I'd be pretty arrogant about it.

Why is arrogance always viewed so negatively, particularly in comparison to other negative traits exhibited by other (male) characters, such as Jorah's shallow lust for Daenerys and Lynesse? There are a lot of things worse than arrogance in this world.

In addition, I'm not sure why you think Dany believes everyone will bow before her? She has admitted that she will need to conquer Westeros -- she's not expecting to go over there and have everyone bow before her because of her claim.

Drogo probably would have invaded Westeros if Dany and his unborn child had been killed. Their near death causes him to start heading to Westeros, so what makes you think their actual deaths would not? He'd go over to Westeros, avenge his wife and child, and rape and pillage. All because Jorah wanted a pardon.

[All Men Must Rhyme]

I think the only thing more annoying than the constant renewal of "I hate ______" threads is seeing the same people come into said threads and berate the OP for having an opinion. Obviously, it's an opinion that is widely shared. Feel free to disagree with them, but to come in and attack them for having it is equally as annoying. I've said a few times my reasons for personally disliking Daenerys, and they're the same as my reasons for disliking a lot of characters, it's just that she happens to share all of them. Her boring traits, the plot armour if you like, the endless stream of titles, her belief that people should follow her because she is "the blood of the dragon", yet has no idea of her own family history, and refuses to listen when Barriston attempts to educate her in it, yada yada yada.

[Accio Euron]

If I can't stand Daenerys, does that automatically make me a bad person (I also dislike Catelyn with a passion but that would be a topic for a different thread)? Did GRRM even intend for a her to become a likable character?

I'm not going to recount all the reasons why I don't like Daenerys as a character. I always felt like she was the least relatable/likable of GRRM's great cast of characters. Yet the minute I mentioned my opinion in a comment on another website i was assaulted from all sides and singled out as someone who doesn't know women very well or even has no close relationships with the opposite sex. So I would like to know, from female readers especially, if you enjoy reading Dany's POV chapters and some of the reasons why.

Also do you think that GRRM writes his female characters well? I'm not going to presume to give opinion on that particular topic ever again as my ego still hurts from that last flaming tongue lashing I got :( . But I would just like to know.

Personally, I have a love/hate relationship with Dany. I like her some moments such as when she decided to help the people who followed her and she has a good (but often black and white) sense of right and wrong. However, there are times when I think she acts like an old lady with cats (except hers are dragons) and some of her motives, and point of view chapters can be boring and eye rolling. She has this sense of self righteousness that she deserves the Iron Throne because she is Daenerys Targaryen, Stormborn, first of her Name, blah blah blah.

You are not a bad person because you dislike a fictional female character. I don't think GRRM has pushed us to like certain characters. He has his personal favorites that he enjoys writing (Tyrion for instance), but I think each of the characters have good points and bad points. This gives them a human quality. There were times when I wanted to kick Ned in the ass because he was too honorable. And I go from hating to empathizing with Jaime.

I went off on a ramble, but all I wanted to say is, you're not wrong at all. You just happen not to like Dany. :laugh:

[Lummel]

I find it interesting that some posters dislike Daenerys for her arrogance, when arrogance isn't exactly in short supply in Westeros. ;)

Have to agree with Patrick Stormborn, whether you like it or not, Daenerys at least has got good reason to be arrogant!

[Smokingfinehash]

Yup, I hate her too. The whole outrageously entitled thing really sticks in my craw. Hate her, hate her ridiculously emo older brother and her dreadfully boring chapters.

[David Selig]

I find the entitlement complaint hilarious. Who in these books among the PoV characters doesn't feel entitled? All of them are high nobles (except Davos) so entitlement is the most natural thing in the world for them.

[Lyanna Stark]

I find the entitlement complaint hilarious. Who in these books among the PoV characters doesn't feel entitled? All of them are high nobles (except Davos) so entitlement is the most natural thing in the world for them.

Yes. What about Stannis, the Tyrells (who are jockeying for Marg to be queen no matter what and were totally ok with framing Sansa and Tyrion for regicide), Tyrion, the Martells (entitled to revenge and to marry Arianne to the next Targ king), Littlefinger, Tywin, Jaime, Walder Frey, Randyll Tarly, Melisandre, Theon, Robb Stark....the list never ends.

Yet Dany should somehow be this meek little mouse and spend her time on self doubt. Yet when she actually does spend time on self doubt in ADWD, people complain about that too. When will they ever be happy?

[PatrickStormborn]

Yes. What about Stannis, the Tyrells (who are jockeying for Marg to be queen no matter what and were totally ok with framing Sansa and Tyrion for regicide), Tyrion, the Martells (entitled to revenge and to marry Arianne to the next Targ king), Littlefinger, Tywin, Jaime, Walder Frey, Randyll Tarly, Melisandre, Theon, Robb Stark....the list never ends.

Yet Dany should somehow be this meek little mouse and spend her time on self doubt. Yet when she actually does spend time on self doubt in ADWD, people complain about that too. When will they ever be happy?

Exactly! Every character in the series (except Davos) has some degree of entitlement/arrogance, so why is Dany the only one constantly called out on it? I don't think it's a great trait to have (although false humility is just as bad, IMO), but at least Dany has a reason to be arrogant. If you've got it flaunt it, etc. etc.

[The Wood of the Morning]

I really want to like Dany like I did at the beginning of the series, but ugh every time her POV comes up i just find myself skimming over all the Kazraz mo Raznak's to get to the next chapter. I guess that's more of a critique against the direction her story is going and not Dany herself though.

[tws1978]

I think the only thing more annoying than the constant renewal of "I hate ______" threads is seeing the same people come into said threads and berate the OP for having an opinion. Obviously, it's an opinion that is widely shared. Feel free to disagree with them, but to come in and attack them for having it is equally as annoying. I've said a few times my reasons for personally disliking Daenerys, and they're the same as my reasons for disliking a lot of characters, it's just that she happens to share all of them. Her boring traits, the plot armour if you like, the endless stream of titles, her belief that people should follow her because she is "the blood of the dragon", yet has no idea of her own family history, and refuses to listen when Barriston attempts to educate her in it, yada yada yada.

I´m not sure Danny doesn´t want to know about her family history. It´s just whenever Barristan starts to talk about it and she asks THE question he either decides it´s not the right time or someone interrupts them. It´s like Jon´s true parrentage, just a tease GRRM has no intension to play now.

As for the arrogance and endless stream of titles it´s something she needs as a mark of her power, but she is not like Hirzah who constantly corrects everyone when they don´t title him "His magnificence." But she has a very humble and friendly relationships with those close around her. Her handmaidens love her, Barristan adores her and Missandei is like her little sister. She even gets on a friendly base with the hostage children. Plus we see her inner thoughts and she constantly questions herself and who she really is. She knows a lot of what she says about herself and others about her is just for effect or to gain some advantage. She is the exact opposite of Cersei.

If you look for someone who feels truly entitled and thinks Westeros should welcome him with open arms there is Agon. Most of the troubles Varys and Ilyrio have with their plans for Danny stems from the fact she cares for so much more than her revenge and the Iron Throne. She was offered an easy way by Ilyrio and she refused because she realized (with Jorah´s help) she would be just his puppet. And she was offered an easy way again by Xaro but refused because she couldn´t left the people who had trusted her behind. Why some believe she will suddenly join forces with Victarion just because he will offer her ironborn alliance I will never understood. She has a tendency do the unexpect and when she will finally arrive in Westeros it will be under a completely different circumstances than most quess now.