Lost Season 6 thread

[Caligula_K]

No, they're purpose (from what Jacob told Richard) is to prove his point that people are inherently good or die. They're not protecting the Island, they're merely pawns in Jacob and the Man in Black's game. Cindy and the kids and the other kidnapped became Others because they're thinking "Hey, these guys wont kill us if we join them, and fuck, they've got a pretty nice town going on here. Better than being on a beach." The tail section didn't have to put up with the same amount of fuckery from the Others that the fuselage crew did, so it makes sense how much more willing they were to join up. Also, it can be assumed when they got to New Otherton they were fed a lot of the "Jacob loves you" nonsense. The Others are really just a big cult. Its curious that it took so long for the Man in Black to see the help in a bunch of blind followers and get a fan club of his own.

Respectfully, I think this is a pretty lame explanation for all the Others have been up to for the past 5 seasons. First, with regards to Cindy and the kids, it seems something more happened to transform them than "these guys are awesome and it sure beats out living on the beach!" The Tailies definitely had it a lot worse than the fuselage people did- the Others constantly attacked them, abducted them, and murdered them. As Cindy was one of the last ones to get kidnapped, I doubt she'd be super happy about the Others, and the weirdness is emphasized by how weird she acts when she sees Jack in his cage.

As for the Others, they may have started as pawns in the Man in Black's and Jacob's game, but I seriously doubt that this is the only way they view themselves. This might explain their fixation with only abducting "good people," but it's clear through five seasons that they think of the island as theirs, that they are extremely hostile to any outsiders who might threaten their ownership of the island in any way, and that although they are extremely cultish with Jacob, it's the island they really care about, not some game between two men, both of whom they barely know anything about. So I do find it odd all these Others are suddenly cool with leaving the island. And that we might not be getting an explanation for what their purpose is, unless their purpose is really just to hang around, hoping that they're doing good according to Jacob while gassing hippies and kidnapping telekinetic children.

[Gertrude]

Yeah, I'm kind of disappointed in the Others' storyline on the whole. Unless they pull out a whole lot of awesome in the last few episodes, it's very uneven. You could argue that the Temple Others are a different beast than Widmore's/Ben's Others, but it's still poorly explained.

[Jaxom 1974]

Frank: "Looks like she got her voice back."

=Cheesiest thing ever said on this show by twenty miles. I laughed a lot. Way to ruin the reunion scene, writers.

And I now feel vindicated in claiming that Sun losing her English was the dumbest thing ever. Because? It was the dumbest thing ever. So dumb.

I can't argue the cheese factor, but at the same time I kinda applauded that it was something that Frank simply said to himself rather than making it some sort of big proclimation. You know, so he could laugh, Jin and Sun could laugh and everyone could laugh.

I was really convinced either Sun or Jin was going to die as soon as they were reunited. For a second there I thought maybe the fence wasn't turned off as they ran towards one another and was bracing myself for a cringe worthy moment and then when Zoe & Co. pulled out the guns I thought they'd meet their demise that way. What a pleasant surprise to see them both make it through the end of the episode.

I actually expected someone to yell for them to stop before they got fried. So apparently the fence is a just there for aestetics or something because people seem to be able to just run right through it...if it was on at all. Great protection there.

You bring up a question of morality, but there isn't really much of one. All Locke has been saying is they have to leave together. It's fair to assume that he is going to follow through with that promise, for Sawyer and company at least. They aren't leaving these people to die. They're just leaving them.

I've always assumed that Locke meant that the Oceanic Six needed to leave together. Telling everyone else that was simply an means to an end. There was never any plan to take any of the Others or anyone else with them...somehow he planned/plans on eliminating them...

[Demonblade]

Fine - they don't have to talk about it before they leave. Why not talk afterwards? Why not have Hurley come up to Sawyer and tell him that it's uncool, dude, to leave those kids behind. There were chances to bring it up, and they didn't; they'd rather have Jack have a vague feeling about leaving the island.

Heck, that would have been a way to kill two birds with one stone; have Jack have that 'funny feeling' but also not be cool with leaving them behind, and ask Sawyer why he is. Wouldn't that have been interesting for both of them? How Jack has to save everyone (even if it means saving no one), and Sawyer's only interested in saving those in his monkeysphere? Come on, that would have been an interesting conversation, instead of seeing Sawyer's hair whip into an emover.

Seriously, who gives a shit about Cindy and the kids? They're Others, the group that has harassed them since they first got on the island. What possible reason other than them being useless kids would they have to ask them to come along? The Others deserve none of their trust, least of all Sawyer who has been around them longer than anyone else besides Miles. Risking giving away their plans to a bunch of people they fought a war against earlier doesn't seem like much of a good idea.

[Slurktan]

I actually expected someone to yell for them to stop before they got fried. So apparently the fence is a just there for aestetics or something because people seem to be able to just run right through it...if it was on at all. Great protection there.

I actually thought the exact same thing. Rewound it though and then you can hear one of them say "Shut off the Fence" and then there's a noise which I take to be the fence shutting off right before Sun runs up. Fortuitous timing still though.

[Commodore]

everything Jeff Fahey says is awesome

[Caligula_K]

Question for those who read those huge major spoilers a while back (which I didn't, so please don't spoil anything other than the answer to the question):

A long while back there was a report that Terry O'Quinn would basically read four pages of island history in a nighttime scene with Jack. Well, it would seem that we got that nighttime scene and not anywhere close to four pages of island history. Do you know if this scene is something that is coming up in a later episode, or is it likely to have either been a false rumor or exaggeration? Thanks.

[Mya Stone]

Question for those who read those huge major spoilers a while back (which I didn't, so please don't spoil anything other than the answer to the question):

A long while back there was a report that Terry O'Quinn would basically read four pages of island history in a nighttime scene with Jack. Well, it would seem that we got that nighttime scene and not anywhere close to four pages of island history. Do you know if this scene is something that is coming up in a later episode, or is it likely to have either been a false rumor or exaggeration? Thanks.

Caligula,

IIRC, it's coming up in episode 6.14, which is a Jack-centric episode. I seem to remember the spoiler saying that it would take place in the Jack-centric, at any rate. I don't think for one minute that the Christian explanation was the 4 pages of dialogue that the spoiler was referring to. I also seem to remember it stating that we would get 4 pages of Island history, if that helps any.

[Scion of Valyria]

I've always assumed that Locke meant that the Oceanic Six needed to leave together. Telling everyone else that was simply an means to an end. There was never any plan to take any of the Others or anyone else with them...somehow he planned/plans on eliminating them...

I'm sure that's his plan, but Sawyer and crew don't know for sure that he's excluding the rest. There's a chance that the MiB won't kill 'em (apparently Widmore will do that for him), so it could be their justification.

Respectfully, I think this is a pretty lame explanation for all the Others have been up to for the past 5 seasons. First, with regards to Cindy and the kids, it seems something more happened to transform them than "these guys are awesome and it sure beats out living on the beach!" The Tailies definitely had it a lot worse than the fuselage people did- the Others constantly attacked them, abducted them, and murdered them. As Cindy was one of the last ones to get kidnapped, I doubt she'd be super happy about the Others, and the weirdness is emphasized by how weird she acts when she sees Jack in his cage.

There was a lot of kidnapping by the Others, but none of them ended up in polar bear cages. None were strung up by their necks and left for their friends to find them. No preggo ladies' were kidnapped and injected with some questionable vaccine. Raids weren't sent to kidnap all the pregnant women. Out of the 22 Tailies who survived the crash, four died a few days later from injuries, and roughly twelve or so were kidnapped. We see a bunch in the background in season 3, not just Cindy and the kids. The only one directly done in by an Other was Nathan. None were definitively killed by the Others except him. So yeah, Cindy knew they were kidnapping her group, but once it happened to her, she saw that it was better than hangin' with some obnoxiously aggressive cop. I would have joined the Others too, with their temple and nice town and food and fountain of life.

As for the Others, they may have started as pawns in the Man in Black's and Jacob's game, but I seriously doubt that this is the only way they view themselves.

Of course that's not how they view themselves. That doesn't mean that isn't what they are.

This might explain their fixation with only abducting "good people,"

They were told to collect those people. By Jacob, with all his lists Ben was yelling about in "The Incident." They were just following orders, whether they knew why or not.

but it's clear through five seasons that they think of the island as theirs, that they are extremely hostile to any outsiders who might threaten their ownership of the island in any way,

Well, Widmore and Ben think its theirs. But they are powerhungry Napoleonic folks. I imagine they're told they are there because of Jacob, and as such don't really believe they own the Island. They just live their, with Jacob's allowance.

and that although they are extremely cultish with Jacob, it's the island they really care about, not some game between two men, both of whom they barely know anything about. So I do find it odd all these Others are suddenly cool with leaving the island. And that we might not be getting an explanation for what their purpose is, unless their purpose is really just to hang around, hoping that they're doing good according to Jacob while gassing hippies and kidnapping telekinetic children.

They don't even know there is a game going on. The Man in Black for the Others was, as Widmore put it, ghost stories and bumps in the night. He was a campfire tale, only the super high ups know that a war was coming to the Island. They believe, as Richard told them, that Jacob has a plan, Jacob is doing whats best. So they carry out tasks for him in ignorance of the real reason they're doing it.

As to why they want to leave now, put yourself in their heads. The man they've faithfully worshiped has just died, and some new guys offers them safety, protection, and guidance. Oh, and if they don't side with him, they die. Jacob isn't around to protect them, they're probably having the same crises of faith Ben and Richard had. Not to the same extent, but that combined with survival instinct will push them right to the MiB.

That's the tragic thing about the story of Jacob and the Island. All these people are tricked into thinking the Island and Jacob are their saviors, yet Jacob has no problem letting them all die when they fulfill their function.

[CloudFlare]

Re: Cindy& The Kids Joining the Others.

After Jack was captured by the Others, didn't he switch sides as well? Remember when he was playing football with Mr. Friendly? Was he faking, or did the Others win his allegiance? If so, they could have done it with Cindy as well.

[Kalbear]

What's especially odd about the Others is that none of them ever meet Jacob, yet they all follow him and assume he's awesome. The whole 'God loves you and so does Jacob' bit? That had to have come from Richard's eventual leading, not anyone else.

But yeah, despite Jacob supposedly founding this group of Others and saying to Richard that Richard would be his voice, he goes and hangs out with Ilana instead of trusting the Others to take care of anyone, he goes and recruits Dogen instead of having him 'come' to the island...it's very odd. Jacob's a total micromanager.

[Scion of Valyria]

What's especially odd about the Others is that none of them ever meet Jacob, yet they all follow him and assume he's awesome. The whole 'God loves you and so does Jacob' bit? That had to have come from Richard's eventual leading, not anyone else.

Not necessarily (it was 'God loves you as he loved Jacob' I believe). Well, not directly from Richard at least. Its safe to assume that there was no set group of Others till Richard took the job of intermediary. Jacob's existence is known, and thats all the Others really need to develop a fanatic appreciation for him. I mean, shit, no one's ever met Allah or Yahweh, yet you have plenty of people following them and thinking they're awesome. That's just how these things work. And if they know Jacob is protecting the Island, they link its healing properties to him. Thats not odd at all.

I am curious as to how the Man in Black became a ghost story, though. Richard has firsthand evidence that he's more than just some pissed off black smoke. Even if Jacob didn't tell Richard everything (or anything, for that matter) you think he would have pointed out to Ben that the black smoke was bad news. Unless Jacob knew this all that had to happen so told him not to.

[Caligula_K]

Caligula,

IIRC, it's coming up in episode 6.14, which is a Jack-centric episode. I seem to remember the spoiler saying that it would take place in the Jack-centric, at any rate. I don't think for one minute that the Christian explanation was the 4 pages of dialogue that the spoiler was referring to. I also seem to remember it stating that we would get 4 pages of Island history, if that helps any.

Thanks Mya! I have a feeling this next episode is going to rock.

Scion: I'm going to have to disagree with you- sure, the Others did fuck with the fuselage people, but I think Season 2 pretty effectively showed that the Tailies had it much worse. They were under constant threat, whereas the fuselage people had isolated crises which sucked, but which didn't turn them into the paranoid semi-militaristic group which the Tailies became. So I still have trouble believing Cindy would suddenly become cool with the Others and act so strangely towards Jack in season 3 just because they gave her electricity- wouldn't she and the other Tailies captured want to get the hell off the island? And I seriously doubt that if a group of people continuously threatened and kidnapped your friends that you would suddenly become BFF with them because they offered you a suburban paradise.

Anyway, you make some good points, but I still think that if those are the answers, they need to be spelled out better in the show and their story arc needs to be completed, along with Dharma's, preferably. Oh wells.

After Jack was captured by the Others, didn't he switch sides as well? Remember when he was playing football with Mr. Friendly? Was he faking, or did the Others win his allegiance? If so, they could have done it with Cindy as well.

Well, Jack was hanging out with them for a specific reason- he wanted to get off the island and they were going to let him. The Others didn't really have his allegiance. Since Cindy and co. didn't seem to be demanding to get off the island until Smokey came along (and even now they're more passively following rather than demanding anything), I do think there's something different there. Especially since they apparently didn't time travel along with the rest of the Others (what's up with that? Another question to add to the Others' mystery). Then again, neither did Claire for no particular reason, unless her being infected prevented her from time traveling.

[Original Ned's Bones]

A sidenote: Whats the consensus on the "malevolence" the Island is keeping corked up? How many believe it to be the MiB and how many believe its the EM energy that both Jacob and the MiB need to be around to keep at bay? I initially assumed it was just the MiB, but with the set of scales in the cave and the painting of them in Side-Widmore's office, I'm pretty sure that the scales will always find a way to level out. If they aren't level, shit goes bad.

I'm hoping it has something to do with the energy. It makes for a better story imo that MiB is tired of his job and wants it all to go to hell, as opposed to him being a trapped evil being trying to escape. I think someone commented earlier it felt a little Jurassic Park 2-ish, for an "Oh Sh!t! a smoke-monster is on the loose, run for your lives!!!" scenario.

Am I the only one who appreciated the "Burt Reynolds movie" comment about Lapedis from Sawyer? I've always thought he looked like he was stuck on an episode of the Love Boat or something. Obviously a pilot is going to be needed, I can't think of any other reason they keep him on the show, unless they were saving up for his award-winning quote last episode.

[The Pita]

Can someone link to the spoilers? I think I'll just spoil myself and stop worrying every time spoiler tags pop up.

Other than that, I liked the episode a lot. Next week's episode sounds capital.

[Jaxom 1974]

Am I the only one who appreciated the "Burt Reynolds movie" comment about Lapedis from Sawyer? I've always thought he looked like he was stuck on an episode of the Love Boat or something. Obviously a pilot is going to be needed, I can't think of any other reason they keep him on the show, unless they were saving up for his award-winning quote last episode.

Actually, that was the first thing my dad said to me last night when we were talking about the show. He thought it was the best line of the episode.

[Caligula_K]

Actually, that was the first thing my dad said to me last night when we were talking about the show. He thought it was the best line of the episode.

Yep, that was an awesome line. Makes up for the later "looks like somebody got her voice back!" I also like how Sawyer called Frank "Chesty."

[Tb0ne]

The more I think about it the MIB must be trapped/contained by the EM. There's just too many connections between the numbers (on the vaccine to prevent the MIB sickness, the countdown computer, and the candidates) and stopping the MIB/end of the world.

What's especially odd about the Others is that none of them ever meet Jacob, yet they all follow him and assume he's awesome. The whole 'God loves you and so does Jacob' bit? That had to have come from Richard's eventual leading, not anyone else.

"God loves you as he loved Jacob", was the line. Interesting that it says loved, rather than loves.

[kairparavel]

So I went to watch this week's episode the other night and uh, I wound up with the last 15 seconds of Lost and then the full episode of V. I cannot for the life of me understand how this happened. I set up Lost to record as a series.

Any thoughts?

[Scion of Valyria]

So I went to watch this week's episode the other night and uh, I wound up with the last 15 seconds of Lost and then the full episode of V. I cannot for the life of me understand how this happened. I set up Lost to record as a series.

Any thoughts?

Probably just a malfunction of your DVR. Lost aired in the normal timeslot. (if you're a US viewer, couldn't speak for other countries)