George is changing parts of TWOW for Osha?

[The Mother of The Others]

Maury! :D

Rheagar Targaryen, you.....ARE the father!

I like the way the Osha actress made her presence felt through the screen. The role spoke to me more in the brief 10 hours than most of the cast managed to accomplish. You understood from Osha's glare and posture that wildlings were outsiders and alien and you saw in her the stigma and the wounded pride, etc., all done without very many lines. Meanwhile some of the stark actors were just bland kids.

I'm worried about this news for the same reason I worry about Ice&Fire in general:

this might be yet another example of things going off track. If we get more pages than were planned of wandering around with Rickon, how does that spell blockbuster finale? It's just taking pages away from other characters with more porn appeal. And I have bad associations from Cal-OSHA, the only other Osha I know. So here's hoping that it's really exciting on Skagos and worth focussing on because everybody's eating everybody there and Osha is the only one who fights off the hungry zombie attack and is named queen of a new island regime where the first rule is let's slow down and chew our food and stop eating so many people.

[Winter's Lady]

Ah, I beg to differ here... I think Osha is smart, strong, and very adaptable, IMO.

Oh I was thinking more like how other people would react to her, being a wildling and all. That she's capable of adapting is absolutely true. She might just not be accepted easily and therefore have kind of a hard time...ah man I'm not really making sense again :P

[Turkey Jack]

I thought Jon named Ros as his almost first when talking to Sam although I could be mistaken, I have no problem with seeing more of Ros but she is eye candy and banal, if she starts becoming central to the plot I will start to lose interest.

[Falrinn]

I really wouldn't call this spoilers, although I suppose confirming Osha will be alive by the time we see her in TWoW is a minor spoiler.

It'll be interesting how the TV show deals with it her role in Storm of Swords and A Feast for Crows/A Dance with Dragons since they can't completely drop the actors for 2-3 whole seasons and expect them to still be available when it comes time to film the season dealing with The Winds of Winter. Maybe they'll put her and Rickon in as recurring characters and actually show them going to Skagos, and explaining why they went there instead of White Harbor as per the original plan.

I'm sure GRRM will make sure they get any important details right, especially since the first part of their journey will probably be filmed before The Winds of Winter is finished.

Oh I was thinking more like how other people would react to her, being a wildling and all. That she's capable of adapting is absolutely true. She might just not be accepted easily and therefore have kind of a hard time...ah man I'm not really making sense again :P

She could probably pass herself off as being a regular Northerner if need be since she lived in Winterfell for so long. Perhaps claim to be from one of the mountain clans to explain any remaining oddities about her behavior. Since everyone thinks Rickon is dead, she could probably pass him off as her own son. No one would suspect a refugee traveling with her son is really Rickon Stark and his Wildling servant (I imagine the average Northman doesn't even know Osha exists).

[kissdbyfire]

...ah man I'm not really making sense again :P

You are so making sense, and I agree. :-)

[Moshtradamus]

i kind of liked book Osha, just because she came a long way from wildling to Stark friend. i'm kind of curious of what he was originally planning on doing with her, before Natalia Tena did "such a great job".

i'm also over Ros.

hmm need to check back that back and see what other interesting facts there were.

[Jadiecat]

<mod>

This thread contains book spoilers. Read at your own risk

</mod>

apparently, the actress that plays her on the show does such a great job, George is rewriting parts of TWOW so that Osha gets more screen time if/when it gets to that season of the show.

http://www.denofgeek...es_blurays.html

Thanks for the post!

I was kind of riveted when Natalia Tena was on screen. I like the character Osha, but the actress brought something extra. The story will only be helped by more Osha, either way.

I was annoyed by some of the Ros scenes, too, but in addition to the opportunity for more sex on screen (which I sometimes like, sometimes don't), Ros can serve as a convenient expository tool (bed talk) and maybe she can provide the voice at times, of the smallfolk--e.g., how people are being affected by, and how they are understanding all the warring and shenanigans of the main characters. In the book, that often is provided when the characters visit inns and the like, and listen to the talk.

[Moshtradamus]

that's very true, i didn't really think of it like that (how Ros would be able to be the insight of how the small folk feel and are affected) so i kind of hope they utilize that direction.

i also didn't know that none of the child actors had any experience, and that Emilia and John had just gotten out of drama school.

....or the fact that they used a two day old animal for the direwolf pup scene. gross.

[Zar Lannister]

I'm not entirely sure whether I should be happy about the TV show infuencing the outcome of the books. I've heard Martin is normally very jealous of his characters, so hopefully he found inspiration in seeing these cast of actors breathe life into his work. I would prefer it would be the books who dictated the show and not the other way around, but let us see what this spin will bring.

As for Ros,

I thought the whole Ros thing was mainly to channel the sex part away from the main actresses... especially since a few good characters end up whoring around anyway. So, well, my take with Ros is an identifiable whore among the many in the novels, and they'll basically use her to avoid having to cast a bunch of different ones, perhaps?

She's okay, there are a few scenes I consider pointless in the show that come to mind, but somehow they serve to "clear" things that were mildly open to interpretation (take Loras and Renly, for once).

[Nagisa Furukawa]

this might be yet another example of things going off track. If we get more pages than were planned of wandering around with Rickon, how does that spell blockbuster finale?

No way. In the latest book, we have the set-up of a major POV character being given the mission to retrieve Rickon in order to reclaim the North and end the tyranny of the Boltons, some of the biggest villains in the series. If anything, I'd hardly think it'd be a blockbuster finale without Rickon playing a huge role!

It's just taking pages away from other characters with more porn appeal.

????????

I'm not entirely sure whether I should be happy about the TV show infuencing the outcome of the books. I've heard Martin is normally very jealous of his characters, so hopefully he found inspiration in seeing these cast of actors breathe life into his work. I would prefer it would be the books who dictated the show and not the other way around, but let us see what this spin will bring.

Eh, I think the "changing" part of the title is an exaggeration. He's not exactly radically altering the ending or anything. He's simply going to make a supporting character a bit more interesting than he might've otherwise. These are the kind of nips and tucks I'm okay with the books making in regards to the TV show, minor and side things. Martin's always said that books are like a road trip. He knows the destination and the main road to get there, but he doesn't know where he's going to stop and have dinner the second night or what attractions he might visit down the line. So long as the main road stays firm, I don't mind the detours being changed here and there because of the TV show.

[Jadiecat]

IMO, if they'd included Lolys in the show, and she was played by a pretty woman, perhaps GRRM would be able to present her as an actual human being rather than a walking punchline. And stop making cracks like calling Lolys kid (the product of a violent gang rape) "he of the hundred fathers" and dubbing Lolys "small of wit, but great with child" in the appendixes of various books....

Lollys will be the trickiest to portray, I think. Tyrion's (and our) impression of her is shaped first by Littlefinger, who hits the "cow" and "pig" imagery hard, and makes sure to describe her to Tyrion as completely undesirable. Bronn further drives home the undesirable image of Lollys in a most jolly way with Tyrion. And we hear that she's 33 and a maid (neither is accurate) and a lackwit (her mind is broken, it's true, but she wasn't born that way). His own issues make Tyrion too easy to manipulate in this. Tyrion can't duck lady Tanda's efforts to get him to meet Lollys fast enough. He never really LOOKS at Lollys, (though once he notices her absence, regretting a lost chance to get a glimpse of Shae). When the reader sees Lollys, through the eyes of another character, she's sobbing at Tyrion's wedding, or shivering and hunching, or balking or retching. Once she's described as pretty. Sansa describes the look in her eyes. We never really see her clearly, either. Our impressions of Lollys are molded by Littlefinger and others (and serve as the basis for the appendix description). It's an important part of the experience of the story, because we're fooled along with Tyrion.

I just don't know how the same effect can be achieved on film.

[Buckwheat]

I'm not entirely sure whether I should be happy about the TV show infuencing the outcome of the books. I've heard Martin is normally very jealous of his characters, so hopefully he found inspiration in seeing these cast of actors breathe life into his work. I would prefer it would be the books who dictated the show and not the other way around, but let us see what this spin will bring.

This.

But I do not really believe he will change that much, honetsly. Maybe Osha will get some additional lines and be present on more occasions than originally planned (or maybe he will keep her alive some chapters longer), but I cannot see GRRM changing the story much just because of the show.

As for Roz, she's gorgeous, IMO, but the fact of her being naked in each and every scene she's in does get a bit old... seriously, when you have hetero male viewers complaining that gratuitous nudity featuring a gorgeous young woman is "too much," then you know you've gone too far. As for what D and D were referring to when they said the Roz was "fun to watch," I can only imagine.... :cool4:

For some reason, I find this sentence really amusing :).

[Rhodan]

This.

But I do not really believe he will change that much, honetsly. Maybe Osha will get some additional lines and be present on more occasions than originally planned (or maybe he will keep her alive some chapters longer), but I cannot see GRRM changing the story much just because of the show.

I agree. It wil be probably even less significant than Bronn who was supposed to kick it in the first book.

[The Bastard of Bolton]

LOL, it was not only pointless but overtly distracting, and took away from the scene it was supposed to compliment.

As for Roz, she's gorgeous, IMO, but the fact of her being naked in each and every scene she's in does get a bit old... seriously, when you have hetero male viewers complaining that gratuitous nudity featuring a gorgeous young woman is "too much," then you know you've gone too far. As for what D and D were referring to when they said the Roz was "fun to watch," I can only imagine.... :cool4:

The things that men will say when women are listening...

As for Osha....

I love Natalia Teena, but GRRM's newfound fondness for this character has seemed largely based in the good looks of the actress playing her from the beginning. "She's too pretty to be Asha!" Now that he pictures Osha as a gorgeous young actress rather than a hardened, older lady perfectly explains his rapidly increased interest in her. IMO, if they'd included Lolys in the show, and she was played by a pretty woman, perhaps GRRM would be able to present her as an actual human being rather than a walking punchline. And stop making cracks like calling Lolys kid (the product of a violent gang rape) "he of the hundred fathers" and dubbing Lolys "small of wit, but great with child" in the appendixes of various books....

As for Osha let us speak about Lollys?

She is pretty yet you seem to be looking deeply into this matter.

Osha was inevitably going to play a part in the next book, might be that the show has invigorated Martins interest in his character yet t isn't like there wasn't some davos/skagos trip coming up. So it isn't fair to imply that the reason Osha will become more interesting is because GRRM is a lecherous old man?

I admit I've had a chuckle picturing him with sweat on his brow as he describes the shape, colour and size of Ariane Martell's nipples... Yet I give him a break since he is a human being and he has done pretty good by us.

I agree Lollys is a heartbreaking character.

I don't believe it was Martin's intention to make light of her, he just doesn't shy away from how cruel a world Westeros is as it parallels with our own reality.

Wounds fester and rot, heroes die and the innocent suffer.

If you're hurt by what Martin does to Lollys then he is doing his job.

The show would inevitably bring humanity to the character, we would feel for her because we see in how much anguish she is and wouldn't just be hearing it from nasty characters like Bronn or Littlefinger.

I'm not entirely sure whether I should be happy about the TV show infuencing the outcome of the books. I've heard Martin is normally very jealous of his characters, so hopefully he found inspiration in seeing these cast of actors breathe life into his work. I would prefer it would be the books who dictated the show and not the other way around, but let us see what this spin will bring.

I do hope Martin wont scale down his final books in consideration for HBO's budget.

He isn't going to erase the majority of Tullys because they aren't prominent in the show. He wont make a Ros pov for TWoW.

As for Ros,

I thought the whole Ros thing was mainly to channel the sex part away from the main actresses... especially since a few good characters end up whoring around anyway. So, well, my take with Ros is an identifiable whore among the many in the novels, and they'll basically use her to avoid having to cast a bunch of different ones, perhaps?

She's okay, there are a few scenes I consider pointless in the show that come to mind, but somehow they serve to "clear" things that were mildly open to interpretation (take Loras and Renly, for once).

Seems like they pretty much get anyone naked that they can.

Ros has been present for exposition that let us know characters from the books more.

I like the scene with Tywin skinning the stag, I like the one with Littlefinger and Ros the same. The former teaches me in importance of being a Lannister, the latter treats me to Littlefinger explaining why he is the way he is.

Loras and Renly sexposition felt like caricatures of gay people. The actor for Renly makes it worse because you expect him to be gay just by looking at him, and he is a whiny little princess type on top of it. Book Renly was formidable.

Poor Osha can hardly get a thread of her own without people speaking about everyone else. :frown5:

[sperry]

Well, if he's actually planning with the HBO series in mind, at least this means GRRM can't spend 5 years on TWOW. He's only got about 3 left lol.

[BlackTalon]

Well, if he's actually planning with the HBO series in mind, at least this means GRRM can't spend 5 years on TWOW. He's only got about 3 left lol.

Two more years for ASOS (if they stick with the two-season approach I have heard mentioned), one year for AFFC, maybe two years again for ADWD = at least four years, most likely five ... he has got plenty of time ...

[dreamcatcher]

Two more years for ASOS (if they stick with the two-season approach I have heard mentioned), one year for AFFC, maybe two years again for ADWD = at least four years, most likely five ... he has got plenty of time ...

There's no way ADWD could be split into two seasons. It's mostly just travelogue, Dany nibbing on grapes, and Jon being cold. :)

[Crown]

There's no way ADWD could be split into two seasons. It's mostly just travelogue, Dany nibbing on grapes, and Jon being cold. :)

No, but AFFC and ADWD combined into two seasons is possible.

[waaimasjien]

There's no way ADWD could be split into two seasons. It's mostly just travelogue, Dany nibbing on grapes, and Jon being cold. :)

No, but AFFC and ADWD combined into two seasons is possible.

I think it won't be that hard to cut a whole lot out of these two books and make them into one season. If they don't and stick to the books with all their travalogues, they're going to lose viewers.

[lostinwesteros]

Without reading all of the prior posts (got to get ready for work but can't wait to read the rest of the thread.....), I really, really liked Osha - from the books, before I even saw the HBO, and I really want to see more of her, to say nothing of Rickon - it almost seems they've both 'ridden off into the sunset', so to speak, and I want to know what's happening with them. So - actress or not (and I did like her on HBO, too), I'll be really happy to see more of her.