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[Book Spoilers] EP 206 Discussion

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By the way, am I the only one who thinks that Jon Snow (in the tv show) should not be given a sword ever again? The way he was "sharpening" Longclaw back at Craster's Keep made me cringe. And now hitting it to rock and flailing around with it while running... I know valyrian steel can take a lot, but damn, please have some mercy. :crying:

I was thinking the same thing. He hacked the rock and I found myself thinking "That's okay, it's Power-wrought, so it doesn't need shar...wait, wrong series. Wtf are you doing Jon, you're ruining your blade!"

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By the way, what was on that sheet of paper Arya took from Tywin's table?

Was it a letter directed from Littlefinger to Arya or something? I mean, Arya was pretty determined to take it.

I am sure the letter Talisa/Jeyne was writing and the letter on Tywin's table are linked. She is the spy in the camp and is communicating with Tywin. Seemed quite obvious to me. Don't know what anyone else thought?

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I am sure the letter Talisa/Jeyne was writing and the letter on Tywin's table are linked. She is the spy in the camp and is communicating with Tywin. Seemed quite obvious to me. Don't know what anyone else thought?

I don't think Arya grabbed a real piece of correspondence. Tywin knows she can read, knows she's northern, and knows she's highborn. He wouldn't leave actual messages of import lying around in front of her, even if she claims her imaginary father died of loyalty and that all men can die.

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Absolutely loved loved loved this episode!!! I watched it 3 times in a row, and I think the changes they make are OK, it keeps me not knowing exactly what is going to happen next and they always seem to bounce right back to the book after a little change so thats ok by me.

My favorite part was the look that Jaquen gives Arya after she says NOw, IT Has To be Now! He just looks at her like an annoying little sister but u knw that he will listen to her and get it done!!!

Like so many others have said, the Sansa and Shae friendship is not sitting well with me. In the books Sansa NEVER trusted a hansmaid, so how does she knw that Shae is not one of the wrong people.

Tyrion and the Hound were GREAT! As was all the KIngs Landing scenes.

But the best part was of course Winterfell. And I do feel more sorry for Theon than in the books. And Rodricks last line about Theon now being truly lost was epic!!! Oh and the guy playing Dagmer has an awesome scary voice. Cant wait till next week, but i hate how this series seasons are only 10 episodes long :(

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I don´t know if there´s a racial aspect to the decision, I´m more inclined to believe that Doreah was the only one who agreed to do nude-scenes

And I really agree with you about the actress doing a great job, I especially liked the scene where she yells at Jorah and Rakharo

That's a possible reason, though I'm not sure how essential it would have been to see Irri naked. But I'm actually surprised at how nude-free Dany's been this season. During the first one she spent a lot of time naked or in semi-transparent dresses and she's remained completely clothed so far this season while she spent the whole book with one breast out (HBO actually *removing* unnecessary nudity shock of shocks). In any case I don't actually think they consciously decided to get rid of all POC - ETA : People Of Colour (Xaro is now black after all), but it's still an unfortunate decision if they do keep Doreah while writing off Irri and Jhiqui.

That scene was especially impressive since she was speaking in a made-up language. And since she's actually Norwegian there's even a chance that she was actually acting in 2 languages that weren't her first. If so double kudos.

D&D have played games with all the hand maidens , as I remember Jhiqui did appear one episode, season one, then disappeared, or I think they say combined with Doreah? Now Irri , payroll getting that tight?

Yeah Doreah was supposed to die in the Red Wastes, well that was Rakharo , but that was because Elyes Gabel got a better contract deal, I heard. Have not heard that about Amrita Acharia.

Just a side note, supposedly some or few Khalasar warriors were killed in that scene? Or was it just one, I though in a place like Qarth that could not happen? Anyway she had so few seems a shame to lose any.

I think it'd be weird if they've combined Jhiqui and Doreah considering that they shared one scene.

I'm just sad that they're voluntarily getting rid of Amrita (unlike Elyes who just found a better role). Dany's chapters are pretty void of any well-developed side-charaters in the books after AGoT (only Jorah and later Barristan, but Jorah left in Storm and Barristan's role until Dance is basically to be an info-dump on the Targs and the Rebellion), and I felt the show had managed to improve a lot on that front. But now all that is pretty much wasted because all those good secondary characters are dead (Viserys, Drogo, MMD, Rakharo, Irri). At least it seems like they want to give Rakharo's replacement (Kovarro ?) the same attention.

Edited by Evamitchelle

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I don't think Arya grabbed a real piece of correspondence. Tywin knows she can read, knows she's northern, and knows she's highborn. He wouldn't leave actual messages of import lying around in front of her, even if she claims her imaginary father died of loyalty and that all men can die.

The letters may be linked but I can't believe that Talisa was writing her spy reports in plain sight as some have suggested. She was sat in the middle of the camp and making no effort to be secretive. Any nosey parker peering over her shoulder might spot a word or phrase that gave the game away.

I think reading, writing and messages were just one (I'm bundling them here) of the motifs used in this episode so you see examples all over.

I was much more intrigued by the suprisingly high quality of the paper/vellum that everyone had access to.

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Who are the new Dothraki warrior?

Or is he new?

In The Ghost of Harrenhal we see two guys , now one of them a bloodrider, I think, arguing on how to steal a golden peacock. Jorah calls them both by name, and then Dany's tells em how to be guests.

Then the guy shows up , very briefly, in The Old Gods and the New running across the courtyard. He has kind of trimmed beard.

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Who are the new Dothraki warrior?

Or is he new?

In The Ghost of Harrenhal we see two guys , now one of them a bloodrider, I think, arguing on how to steal a golden peacock. Jorah calls them both by name, and then Dany's tells em how to be guests.

Then the guy shows up , very briefly, in The Old Gods and the New running across the courtyard. He has kind of trimmed beard.

The young guy is Kovarro, one of Danys bloodriders, they changed his name for some reason. The old guy is probably some random extra

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Does anyone know if the hound has any connection with the Starks, Possibly Eddard when they were younger? I just seemed when he told Tyrion that he didn't do it for him(save sansa). In the books he also seems to actually like Arya even though he is pretty gruff with her.

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Does anyone know if the hound has any connection with the Starks, Possibly Eddard when they were younger? I just seemed when he told Tyrion that he didn't do it for him(save sansa). In the books he also seems to actually like Arya even though he is pretty gruff with her.

I am not aware of any connection between the Hound and the Starks and the Wiki doesn´t list anything

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I actually thought this episode was the best this season so far. I really liked bran and Theon's scene. It reignited the feelings I had towards Theon in the book. I hate that scumbag. By the time I got to the end of dragons I almost actually felt bad for him. But not quite. He is the total piece of trash I thought he was and deserved everything he gets. I loved the hound and Sansa interaction. Brilliantly done. I do not like that they made shae her handmaid. I also have a huge problem with how they r portraying Sansa. In the book she was naive but not so much that she would ever divulge her true feelings to any of her servants. She was slick enough to know that there were spies everywhere. I also think they are making tywin seem too like able and I do not think this is a good thing. I believe they are straying too far from the story in some cases. Fornmei think it is imoportant to stick to story because it is important for the development of the charecters. I understand they need to fit a lot in to just 10 episodes which in itself is ludicrous. Dany's story has been boring so far as it was in the book. But theybr changing that the most. If they are making changes to her story I wish they would make it less boring. I didn't like the Khalisar diminishing so much. I think they should have got another actor to play rhakaro instead of killing him. I wish no more Ros and les killing of of actual charecters no matter how small. I felt the blood of her blood was important, but what the hell do I know. All in all I enjoyed this weeks episode but just have problems with some stuff

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Does anyone know if the hound has any connection with the Starks, Possibly Eddard when they were younger? I just seemed when he told Tyrion that he didn't do it for him(save sansa). In the books he also seems to actually like Arya even though he is pretty gruff with her.

The Hound just doesn't like Tyrion (as mentioned in the first episode of this season), which is why he tells him off at the end of the riot. It's very unlikely that he has any prior connections to the Starks, being from the Westerlands.

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The young guy is Kovarro, one of Danys bloodriders, they changed his name for some reason. The old guy is probably some random extra

True he does not seem to have a speaking role, tho he has been in two episodes so far.

Anyway, to the very end of ADwD Dany still has the remnant of her Kalasar , tho lord knows were most of them are?

She only talks to the boodriders and her hand maidens.

Seems I remember when they take the three ships to Astapor George mentions there are between 70 and 100. (Tho on the show looks smaller than that.)

Seems like we even know the names of some of the 'extras'. Well they are window dressing , but I it's the kind of story continuity that I like as a dramatic narrative.

By the by without horses and the three blood riders DRACRYS is going seem diminished.

Anyway,

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By the way, is the word "grammar" a relatively modern word?

Indeed it is! Old English never had it. Grammar didn’t appear in the written record until around 1320, which by then of course is considered Middle English, not Old English at all. Here is its story from the OED:

  • Etymology: < Old French gramaire (French grammaire), an irregular semipopular adoption (for the form of which compare Old French mire repr. Latin medicum, artimaire repr. Latin artem magicam or mathematicam) of Latin grammatica, < Greek γραμματική (scil. τέχνη art), feminine of γραμματικός adj., of or pertaining to letters or literature, < γράμματα letters, literature, plural of γράμμα letter, written mark, < root of γράϕειν to write. Compare Provençal gramaira (probably from French). Old French had also a learned adoption of the Latin word, gramatique, parallel with Spanish gramática, Portuguese gramatica, Italian grammatica, German grammatik, Welsh gramadeg.
  • In classical Greek and Latin the word denoted the methodical study of literature (= ‘philology’ in the widest modern sense, including textual and æsthetic criticism, investigation of literary history and antiquities, explanation of allusions, etc., besides the study of the Greek and Latin languages. Post-classically, grammatica came to be restricted to the linguistic portion of this discipline, and eventually to ‘grammar’ in the mod. sense. In the Middle Ages, grammatica and its Romance forms chiefly meant the knowledge or study of Latin, and were hence often used as synonymous with learning in general, the knowledge peculiar to the learned class. As this was popularly supposed to include magic and astrology, the Old French gramaire was sometimes used as a name for these occult sciences. In these applications it still survives in certain corrupt forms, French grimoire, English glamour n., gramarye n.

By the way, you may also find it interesting that our word glamour derives from the same source.

Edited by CrypticWeirwood

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I am not aware of any connection between the Hound and the Starks and the Wiki doesn´t list anything

I have never been able to find anything either but have always wondered. He definitly doesn't like the Lannisters that much.

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In any case I don't actually think they consciously decided to get rid of all POC (Xaro is now black after all), but it's still an unfortunate decision if they do keep Doreah while writing off Irri and Jhiqui.

What is a “POC”, and why in the world didn’t you just write that?

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What is a “POC”, and why in the world didn’t you just write that?

People/Person of colour. And probably because I write it so often as "POC" that I don't think about it anymore.

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According to ancient astronaut theorists, Littlefinger must be an extraterrestrial who can make Einstein-Rosen bridges to travel Westeros.

At least if LF is travelling, we don't have to see him in the brothel

Clearly, LF is the Doctor, and the brothel is the TARDIS.

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People/Person of colour. And probably because I write it so often as "POC" that I don't think about it anymore.

Is a colored person like black, or brown, or yellow, or pink, or like what? This seems like a weaselly euphemism for something, but I can’t pin it down. Are you trying to avoid saying a dirty word of some sort?

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Considering how much people on this board FREAKED THE F OUT when they thought Ramsay was cut, has anyone considered that some of the plot changes might be motivated to throw off people familiar with the books and keep them on edge?

I don't know if they'd do much of that intentionally, but I bet it's on their mind.

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