Legalization of Marijuana Thread (Medicinal Possibilities, Business, Etc.)

[S John]

Man, I'm really going to come off like a huge stoner in this thread and I promise that really is not the case, but I feel compelled to try to frame my personal experience with it for those who have not tried it recreationally. And of course, I don't blame anyone for not having tried it, that is a very reasonable choice too.

And if you really want a case of the munchies, you can go beat yourself up on a WOD!

I just still find the irony that alcohol is legal, but controlled and smoking is legal, but controlled, and in a general sense marijuana is just a combination of the two. (disclaimer being never smoked, never will so actual impact of MJ v. alcohol may be distorted but is my perception)

I would put it this way: having drank plenty of alcohol in my time and also plenty of experience with MJ, if someone gave me an ultimatum that I could only use one of the two for the rest of my life, I would choose MJ easily. I'm sure there'd be plenty of times that I'd wish I could have a beer, but I have had enough experience with both substances to know very well which one is more destructive and it really isn't close. Not only to my physical body, but to other people in my life and society overall.

As we all unfortunately know, when someone is out of hand with alcohol - things tend to get bad. Getting out of hand with MJ... well, I don't know if I've ever seen that happen except maybe in cases where a kid gets to college, discovers weed, and decides to do that all day instead of going to class. I'd tell that person to tighten up and get their shit together, but I wouldn't be anywhere near as concerned for their well being and the well being of those around them as I would be if the same person was draining a pint of vodka a day. In reality everyone I have ever known who has problems that stemmed from using MJ had those problems simply because it is illegal. Meaning they got nailed with a possession charge or failed a drug test. The negative MJ-related thing that happened to them was inflicted by society and not the substance itself.

FTR, I don't smoke it because it gives me panic attacks and I'm really not interested in putting the time and effort in to build a tolerance. ;)

I have not had a full blown panic attack with MJ, but I have, a couple of times, experienced unpleasant anxiety from it and laid off for a little while when that happened. Everyone is different but over time I think I have figured out why that happened to me. MJ makes me really introspective and if it makes me anxious it is always because I thought about something that was bothering me in my life that I'm not equipped to deal with, or haven't been properly dealing with. Or it is because I feel like I am shirking some responsibility in favor smoking.

On the other hand, for me, it really changes how I think about things in a way that I can't adequately describe. Its like all the bullshit in the world that I go along with normally is suddenly exposed for what it is and that can be a little jarring. But I actually think it is an extremely positive thing for me overall. You're not going to lose your mind and go nuts under its influence and you will still be you when you return to normalcy, but some of those ideas and different ways of looking at the world stick with you. I would have to say that is has been an aid to me in forming the worldview that I hold today. Not the main thing, but a contributor. Getting into a deep conversation with someone you are close to, or watching a documentary, or listening to music... are all really kick ass experiences under the influence of MJ. You come at all of those things from a slightly different angle than you normally would and you sometimes find something in them that you didn't know was there before. People stereotype MJ as 'making you stupid', but that has not been my experience at all - the gears are definitely turning in there.

Probably why religious and political conservatives don't like it, it really has been a tool that I've used over the years in learning to think for myself.

[Fez]

It may be about to become de facto legal in DC. The District recently passed a law decriminalizing MJ, removing all previous possession penalties and instead putting a $25 fine on possession. But Congress controls DC's funding, and a GOPer in the House from Maryland objected to this law and put an amendment in the DC approps bill, which the House approved, saying the District couldn't fund the enforcement of this law. Since the Senate bill doesn't have this amendment, they'll need to go to conference (there's obviously other differences too though).

But the thing is, it doesn't take any funding to remove the previous penalties, that part already happened, so if the law is defunded like the House wants, all that happens is that the District can't enforce the $25 fine and all of a sudden there is absolutely no penalty for possession of MJ in DC. It still can't be bought or sold openly, but its a pretty big step that way.

The real lesson though is that the GOPer who crafted the amendment is an idiot, and the rest of his caucus probably didn't ever read what he actually wrote.

[Maltaran]

I hope that becomes the case. I'm all for legislation, obviously with the required regulations.

As far as I can tell, UK legislation of any kind is a long way off. Counties here don't have the same power of legislation that states do, so we couldn't have our own Colorado/Washington. I hope the legislation movement here gains more ground as the one in the USA progresses.

Good luck to you people starting your own grow/sell operation!

Scotland may be able to do it - I don't know if drugs legislation is a devolved power or not.

[Larry of the Lawn]

Man, I'm really going to come off like a huge stoner in this thread and I promise that really is not the case, but I feel compelled to try to frame my personal experience with it for those who have not tried it recreationally. And of course, I don't blame anyone for not having tried it, that is a very reasonable choice too.

I would put it this way: having drank plenty of alcohol in my time and also plenty of experience with MJ, if someone gave me an ultimatum that I could only use one of the two for the rest of my life, I would choose MJ easily. I'm sure there'd be plenty of times that I'd wish I could have a beer, but I have had enough experience with both substances to know very well which one is more destructive and it really isn't close. Not only to my physical body, but to other people in my life and society overall.

As we all unfortunately know, when someone is out of hand with alcohol - things tend to get bad. Getting out of hand with MJ... well, I don't know if I've ever seen that happen except maybe in cases where a kid gets to college, discovers weed, and decides to do that all day instead of going to class. I'd tell that person to tighten up and get their shit together, but I wouldn't be anywhere near as concerned for their well being and the well being of those around them as I would be if the same person was draining a pint of vodka a day. In reality everyone I have ever known who has problems that stemmed from using MJ had those problems simply because it is illegal. Meaning they got nailed with a possession charge or failed a drug test. The negative MJ-related thing that happened to them was inflicted by society and not the substance itself.

I have not had a full blown panic attack with MJ, but I have, a couple of times, experienced unpleasant anxiety from it and laid off for a little while when that happened. Everyone is different but over time I think I have figured out why that happened to me. MJ makes me really introspective and if it makes me anxious it is always because I thought about something that was bothering me in my life that I'm not equipped to deal with, or haven't been properly dealing with. Or it is because I feel like I am shirking some responsibility in favor smoking.

On the other hand, for me, it really changes how I think about things in a way that I can't adequately describe. Its like all the bullshit in the world that I go along with normally is suddenly exposed for what it is and that can be a little jarring. But I actually think it is an extremely positive thing for me overall. You're not going to lose your mind and go nuts under its influence and you will still be you when you return to normalcy, but some of those ideas and different ways of looking at the world stick with you. I would have to say that is has been an aid to me in forming the worldview that I hold today. Not the main thing, but a contributor. Getting into a deep conversation with someone you are close to, or watching a documentary, or listening to music... are all really kick ass experiences under the influence of MJ. You come at all of those things from a slightly different angle than you normally would and you sometimes find something in them that you didn't know was there before. People stereotype MJ as 'making you stupid', but that has not been my experience at all - the gears are definitely turning in there.

Probably why religious and political conservatives don't like it, it really has been a tool that I've used over the years in learning to think for myself.

So much all of this.

[awesome possum]

I would put it this way: having drank plenty of alcohol in my time and also plenty of experience with MJ, if someone gave me an ultimatum that I could only use one of the two for the rest of my life, I would choose MJ easily. I'm sure there'd be plenty of times that I'd wish I could have a beer, but I have had enough experience with both substances to know very well which one is more destructive and it really isn't close. Not only to my physical body, but to other people in my life and society overall.

Amen. I first started smoking weed toward the end of my sophomore year of high school and for a couple years there I was a full blown stoner. My GPA during that time rose from 3.1 to 3.8.

I went to college (at aged 21 for financial reasons) and spent a couple years drinking like my life depended on it and my GPA dropped from a 3.8 to a 2.7. I managed to come out of my alcohol-induced haze long enough to bring that back up to a 3.5 by graduation but that meant an extra year tacked on and a boatload of summer classes of redoing the classes I failed or did poorly in because I was too hungover to go to class/do well on tests.

As we all unfortunately know, when someone is out of hand with alcohol - things tend to get bad. Getting out of hand with MJ... well, I don't know if I've ever seen that happen except maybe in cases where a kid gets to college, discovers weed, and decides to do that all day instead of going to class.

Well there was one time I got so stoned I ate a whole box of Swiss Cake Rolls and ended up vomiting on a girl I liked.

I have not had a full blown panic attack with MJ, but I have, a couple of times, experienced unpleasant anxiety from it and laid off for a little while when that happened. Everyone is different but over time I think I have figured out why that happened to me. MJ makes me really introspective and if it makes me anxious it is always because I thought about something that was bothering me in my life that I'm not equipped to deal with, or haven't been properly dealing with. Or it is because I feel like I am shirking some responsibility in favor smoking.

The anxiety issue is why I still smoke. Not nearly as much as when I was a teenager but I have serious social anxiety to the point that I start to feel physically ill around groups of people - even groups of people I know. I have serious distrusts of most pharmaceuticals so its either marijuana or alcohol. While I don't drink anymore but maybe once a month at the max (usually once every two or three months) I have alcoholism running rampant through my family genes. When I drink, I drink. I don't stop, I can't stop until the alcohol is gone ... or until I pass out but I have never passed out from drinking too much. Which means I also spend probably two or three days hungover.

I've limited my drinking because of that and if the choice is presented between drink and smoke, I will choose smoke every single time.

[awesome possum]

/minor quibble

No gene for alcoholism has been discovered.

It's more accurate to say that there are some folks (typically but not always of East Asian ancestry) who have a genetic reason why they pretty much cannot abuse alcohol. So the rest of the world doesn't have that built-in protection against the possibility of alcoholism, but it doesn't mean that said alcholism is genetic.

/end minor quibble

Fair enough. I wasn't trying to be literal with the gene talk, not even sure why I added that on there as "alcoholism running rampant through my family" works just as well.

[Shryke]

It does, and I almost punched myself for even mentioning my minor quibble.

This is a whole other topic, but I have a pet theory that the notion of a genetic disposition towards alcholism or drug abuse is actually itself a cause of said things, so it's difficult for me to resist putting in my two cents whenever it comes up.

ETA: Somewhat relatedly, holy shit.

Holy misleading headline Batman!

Headline:

CDC: Alcohol Kills 10% of U.S. Adults

Body:

According to the study, 10 percent of deaths for people between 20 and 64 is alcohol-related.

Kinda different things you fucking hacks.

Anyway:

However, alcohol still remains behind tobacco use, poor nutrition, and sedentary lifestyle in terms of preventable causes of death in the U.S. The top three causes of alcohol-related deaths for those under 21 are automobile accidents, homicide, and suicide. The study defined excessive alcohol in terms of binge drinking (five or more drinks on a single occasion for men, four or more for women) or heavy weekly consumption (15 or more a week for men, eight for women).

[Shryke]

I thought the same thing reading the headline till I read the body and was just mad the fucking Daily Beast for being shit.

[Sci-2]

One thing is for sure, the that asshole head of the DEA has gots to go. She is crazy out of touch and totally still believes in the War on Drugs as a Necessary Thing.

But how else will private prisons turn a profit if we're not locking up young minorities?

=-=-=

Weed The People: A Talk with Abby Epstein

In Weed the People, filmmakers Abby Epstein and Ricki Lake take an unflinching look at the underground world of herbal medicine, where patients become experts on their own conditions and spend thousands of dollars on federally illegal medicines that are concocted in suburban kitchens. Nowhere is this phenomenon more compelling than in the treatment of children, who are ignorant of the stigma of medicinal marijuana and whose parents will stop at nothing to help them. Weed the People looks beyond pot-activist propaganda and politics to reveal the legitimate science behind cannabis medicine and the compelling stories of ordinary people whose lives are inescapably caught up in the controversy.

Given what you now know about medical marijuana, how would you most ideally see these treatments introduced and regulated?

There clearly needs to be more clinical trials, which won’t happen easily with marijuana’s absurd classification as a Schedule 1 drug with no medicinal benefits. But I think the key word is regulation, as currently it is very hard for patients to get access to the medicine, information on dosing or the purity and quality of the cannabis oils and extracts.

[awesome possum]

Um, HOORAY

After a historic House vote to defund the DEA's operating budget for marijuana enforcement in the states earlier in the month passed (with a similar one now in the Senate), the government agency has now asked the federal Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to consider removing marijuana from the list of Schedule I drugs as defined by the Controlled Substances Act .

[Sivin]

I've discussed starting a grow operation here in Indiana the second it becomes legal, but that hinges on a few things like: Indiana not being ass-backward, me staying in Indiana because its ass-backward.

I don't know if it will ever have its classification but I didn't think it would ever be legalized anywhere, seeing as how it's a cash crop for police and local governments via War on Drugs funding.

They'll legalize Meth before Marijuana, it's our shitty state's number 1 seller.

[Balefont]

Um, HOORAY

No fucking way!

[mgambino]

Not sure if there are any other law enforcement officers here, but I know I would love for weed to be legal. Not because I use it, but because I waste so much frigging time on dealing with pot related incidents that I could be using to deal with real problems.

As long as it's against the law, I'll do my job, but it doesn't stop me from realizing how stupid it is.

[Sturn]

Probably why religious and political conservatives don't like it, it really has been a tool that I've used over the years in learning to think for myself.

LOL. And the added effect of paranoia and belief of conspiracy theories is creeping in.

Not that I'm hear to moralize, but alcohol is so much more damaging than this plant.

As a popo, I would agree and have said so before here. Alcohol is a common factor in violent crimes, especially domestic one. Alcohol is a common factor in injury accidents. Marijuana isn't. Marijuana has its physical effects, but Alcohol is worse in my non-medical person opinion.

Not sure if there are any other law enforcement officers here, but I know I would love for weed to be legal. Not because I use it, but because I waste so much frigging time on dealing with pot related incidents that I could be using to deal with real problems.

As long as it's against the law, I'll do my job, but it doesn't stop me from realizing how stupid it is.

To repeat myself, please let the Federal government decriminalize it first. There ARE problems being caused in border states. If it's still the law, it must be enforced and it is spilling across the borders. I wouldn't personally love marijuana to be legalized (I don't hardly even drink anymore, don't really need a drug for fun or to get by), but can't say I'm against it and have said so many times here.

Yes there are plenty of more harsher drugs to be combatted. For those secretly hoping decriminalization of marijuana will stick a finger in the eye of police departments, don't worry there is enough crack/meth/pills to keep us busy and prisons full. Thinking of current drug investigations in my town, it's meth, pills, a little crack, and only the largest shipments of marijuana. And the investigators are overwhelmed already. The police in my department aren't scared for their jobs if marijuana is legalized. They might be relieved that one law they must enforce is removed from the table.

[E-Ro]

Do people really think they are going to get rich off of the legalization of weed? Dont get me wrong, im all for it, but unless you are already in a position to buy and move tons of product for cheap then you aren't getting wealthy off this. First of all a million other users have the same idea, competition will be fierce, large companies will run the small ones out of business, etc.

Not really referring to people in this thread, but there are a ton of people that think "lol imma get so rich selling weed hruuuur duuuur" even some real life friends of mine, I don't have the heart to tell them its idiotic.

[Ramsay B.]

Do people really think they are going to get rich off of the legalization of weed? Dont get me wrong, im all for it, but unless you are already in a position to buy and move tons of product for cheap then you aren't getting wealthy off this. First of all a million other users have the same idea, competition will be fierce, large companies will run the small ones out of business, etc.

Not really referring to people in this thread, but there are a ton of people that think "lol imma get so rich selling weed hruuuur duuuur" even some real life friends of mine, I don't have the heart to tell them its idiotic.

Get Rich or Die Tywin

[Balefont]

There are a lot of ancillary industries which will, if properly positioned, be able to make a lot of money. It's not just the selling of the actual product.

Plus, the way each state is rolling things out in their own way, it's actually hindering big corporations from legally getting into it at a critical time. So, a lot of individuals have the time to get good at this. The corps are going to need people who actually know what they are doing. Etc. etc.

And weed is not easy to grow - especially not if you want a consistent product and maximizing yield. There are so many things that can go wrong. There's tons of start up investment money needed. Not everyone is going all of a sudden jump into the business once they can.

I love delicious beer, but brewing takes a lot of time and knowledge. I'd rather be able to go to a store to buy it than take the time to make my own. Weed is no different for most people who use it.

[sperry]

There are a lot of ancillary industries which will, if properly positioned, be able to make a lot of money. It's not just the selling of the actual product.

Plus, the way each state is rolling things out in their own way, it's actually hindering big corporations from legally getting into it at a critical time. So, a lot of individuals have the time to get good at this. The corps are going to need people who actually know what they are doing. Etc. etc.

And weed is not easy to grow - especially not if you want a consistent product and maximizing yield. There are so many things that can go wrong. There's tons of start up investment money needed. Not everyone is going all of a sudden jump into the business once they can.

I love delicious beer, but brewing takes a lot of time and knowledge. I'd rather be able to go to a store to buy it than take the time to make my own. Weed is no different for most people who use it.

In 30 years, when ti's legal everywhere and the dust settles, there will be niche producers of high end weed, but big corporations will likely dominate the market, just like they do in the beer market.

For me, though, the interesting thing to me is whether weed becomes acceptable in the corporate world. Since weed is still the only drug that shows up in your system more than a few days after using it, will employers stop testing for the drug when it becomes legal nationwide? Or will many adults be unable to partake because they'll risk getting fired for failing a drug test.

[E-Ro]

There are a lot of ancillary industries which will, if properly positioned, be able to make a lot of money. It's not just the selling of the actual product.

Plus, the way each state is rolling things out in their own way, it's actually hindering big corporations from legally getting into it at a critical time. So, a lot of individuals have the time to get good at this. The corps are going to need people who actually know what they are doing. Etc. etc.

And weed is not easy to grow - especially not if you want a consistent product and maximizing yield. There are so many things that can go wrong. There's tons of start up investment money needed. Not everyone is going all of a sudden jump into the business once they can.

I love delicious beer, but brewing takes a lot of time and knowledge. I'd rather be able to go to a store to buy it than take the time to make my own. Weed is no different for most people who use it.

Funny you mention beer, as the poster above said, large corporations dominate the beer market. Anyway I will stop giving you a hard time with this. I admire your entrepreneurial spirit, and best of luck.

[The Mance]

I'm curious to see what happens with paraphernalia laws as pot gets decriminalized. I've been hand-carving stone pipes for years, but mostly I just give them away to friends. It would be cool to be able to sell them openly on etsy or at local craft retailers.