JonCon's Red Beard Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 You can't just make up or erase definitions for things you don't like or don't understand. What is to understand? I believe women and men should have the same rights and opportunities. But I don't believe that makes me a feminist or anything like it because there are many other things I don't agree with them, nor I would support. My point is that feminism DOES NOT have the exclusivity of social awareness, nor it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigima Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 What is to understand? I believe women and men should have the same rights and opportunities. But I don't believe that makes me a feminist or anything like it because there are many other things I don't agree with them, nor I would support. That is literally what the word means, I don't understand where you think your judgment enters into the equation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 What irony? Oh, were you *joking* when you insulted feminists? My badness, that's cool. In fairness to Muttering Bill, if that was a joke then I think the joke was actually the irony of MB using victim blaming on people for arguing with feminists. I actually do appreciate the irony, it's just...awfully difficult to differentiate that post from the sincere ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Well, from this thread alone, you have the fact that they are calling anyone who points out common-sensical stuff as "victim-blamer". That is an example of much larger feminist practice where when people disagree they are labeled in some way such as "rape-supporter" "victim-blamer" etc without rime or reason which is meant to "shut down" the opposite opinion because who is going to support something after it is labelled a "rape-supporter's opinion"? You also have the fact that the only reason the feminists in this thread consider this such a big deal and get so upset about it its because its an issue almost exclusive to women since men can't get shamed (usually) by posting their nude pics online. That is, if it was embarrassing for men but not women, they wouldn't really give a shit about it and they certainly wouldn't get upset about it. (or alternatively, if a similarly bad thing happened to some men). Even if it was embarrassing for both genders, you would still not see them going ballistics as they do now. More than enough reasons if you ask me, and you can find a lot more if you look around a bit. and words like ''ballistics'' are not somehow used to shut down others? accusations of illogical and irrational are not being used to shut down others in this thread? hot damn. were there any male photos leaked? i would be just as outraged if a man was made to feel anxious and shitty. if a boy and a girl are both being bullied, i, as a self identified feminist am not going to help the girl and turn a blind eye on the boy, your warped view of what feminists do and don't believe is ridiculous. fuuuuuck. so it's completely okay here to shame people for being passionate and to call them synonyms of crazy, illogical and irrational but it's NOT okay to be a self identified feminist and use the terminology of ''victim blaming'' when people are primarily putting the blame on...the victim?? What is to understand? I believe women and men should have the same rights and opportunities. But I don't believe that makes me a feminist or anything like it because there are many other things I don't agree with them, nor I would support. That's what feminism means though. You don't get to ignore the historical and academic and social values of feminism as being a movement for equality of the sexes because you don't completely understand it and have had a few bad run ins with some idiots you don't agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 In fairness to Muttering Bill, if that was a joke then I think the joke was actually the irony of MB using victim blaming on people for arguing with feminists. I actually do appreciate the irony, it's just...awfully difficult to differentiate that post from the sincere ones. I'm sorry to muttering bill if i'm being hostile with no reason, but after the shit in this thread (i don't think my hackles have quite lowered yet due to being told to ''calm down'' ) it's hard to tell who is and who isn't being an asshole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Crashing Waves Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 :lol: @ people getting all pissy over the SJW remark. The term is sarcastic because those people aren't 'social justice warriors' at all. Look to history for some of those. I'll quote the mighty urbandictionary heresocial justice warrior A pejorative term for an individual who repeatedly and vehemently engages in arguments on social justice on the Internet, often in a shallow or not well-thought-out way, for the purpose of raising their own personal reputation. A social justice warrior, or SJW, does not necessarily strongly believe all that they say, or even care about the groups they are fighting on behalf of. They typically repeat points from whoever is the most popular blogger or commenter of the moment, hoping that they will "get SJ points" and become popular in return. They are very sure to adopt stances that are "correct" in their social circle.The SJW's favorite activity of all is to dogpile. Their favorite websites to frequent are Livejournal and Tumblr. They do not have relevant favorite real-world places, because SJWs are primarily civil rights activists only online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 :lol: @ people getting all pissy over the SJW remark. The term is sarcastic because those people aren't 'social justice warriors' at all. Look to history for some of those. What are you even doing here, for real though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myshkin Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 You can't just make up or erase definitions for things you don't like or don't understand. That is literally what the word means, I don't understand where you think your judgment enters into the equation Many people define feminism in many different ways, there is no one universally accepted definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannisaurus2 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Also: The definition of "feminism" (and even the word itself) carries certain connotations, i.e. it implies that in order to reach equality people should focus on women's issues. That's on the word FEMinism right there. So no people can't claim that feminism encompass all opinions about equality (or even equality for women since it is linked with men's equality). If you believe in it fine but if you think it can include any version or opinion of equality then either you are missing something or you are just trying to enforce your opinion through semantics instead of arguments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Crashing Waves Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 What are you even doing here, for real though Why do you keep asking people that question? For real though. It's a public forum. We all have the right to be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lessthanluke Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Why do you keep asking people that question? For real though. It's a public forum. We all have the right to be here. You also have the right to not be an ass but you don't seem to be taking that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannisaurus2 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 and words like ''ballistics'' are not somehow used to shut down others? accusations of illogical and irrational are not being used to shut down others in this thread? hot damn. were there any male photos leaked? i would be just as outraged if a man was made to feel anxious and shitty. if a boy and a girl are both being bullied, i, as a self identified feminist am not going to help the girl and turn a blind eye on the boy, your warped view of what feminists do and don't believe is ridiculous. Yes I'm sure you would spend your whole day raging in a thread about an equivalent male issue (and by "equivalent" I don't mean "male nude pics" because due to how our society treats nude pics of the two genders that wouldn't be equivalent so your "were there any male photos leaked" is disingenuous). But hey I'm sure a male equivalent in seriousness issue has come in this forum before right? I mean you have almost 10000 so you are a member for a while. Do you mind pointing me towards that thread and how you spent your entire day posting in it? fuuuuuck. so it's completely okay here to shame people for being passionate and to call them synonyms of crazy, illogical and irrational but it's NOT okay to be a self identified feminist and use the terminology of ''victim blaming'' when people are primarily putting the blame on...the victim?? Where ofcourse "victim-blaming" is suitably defined by you and your feminist friends right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Crashing Waves Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 You also have the right to not be an ass but you don't seem to be taking that up. I got called 'human garbage' and 'scum' over a funny internet term, and I'm the ass. Okay then..... :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Ah; I dunno - I guess crazy Ol' me is just confused as to why someone is partaking in a thread they don't care about and where they have repeatedly mocked others. Yes I'm sure you would spend your whole day raging in a thread about an equivalent male issue (and by "equivalent" I don't mean "male nude pics" because due to our society that wouldn't be equivalent so your "were there any male photos leaked" is disingenuous). I would, yeah. Half of my friends are male, my awesome dad is a man, men not feeling shitty or anxious is just as important as women not feeling shitty and anxious about an ultimately harmless and private thing they did. No matter how many times you sarcastically tell me or insinuate I don't care about men, it won't be true. It's just the reality that there are more body shaming issues concerning women than there are men. What would be an equivalent issue for a man in your opinion? I got called 'human garbage' and 'scum' over a funny internet term, and I'm the ass. Okay then..... :lol:Except I never called you those things but you've been an ass to me all thread, but w/e. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Crashing Waves Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Except I never called you those things but you've been an ass to me all thread, but w/e. I told you several times I agreed with your main point, I just have a different view of it, but you just kept acting silly. I made a detailed post earlier as well relevant to the conversation and you just kept on with the WHY ARE YOU EVEN HERE IF YOU DON'T CARE type comments, which if you read my posts you'd see I had a stance on the subject, so obviously I do care. I mean c'mon, Theda. But whatever I think internet drama is dumb so I'll just drop that side of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempra Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 There ya go. Some boobs for you. https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10475591_10154275961065123_172372801209710374_n.jpg?oh=f8f1d0612aebe5747d88f1d34ceedb02&oe=545E5966&__gda__=1416227596_78cf60bde4771e8405af32f90df40d51Nice traps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lessthanluke Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Nice traps. I am glad someone FINALLY appreciated me putting out for this thead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veltigar Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 It's not as inane as the hate of "Social Justice Warriors" though, who are fast taking over from feminists as the internets most hated group. Because clearly social justice is bad and we should hate everyone fighting for it. At least feminism you can delude yourself into it being a bad thing with straw men and sexism. Ugh, I live in a typical European country (you know free healthcare, affordable tuitions, that stuff) and the last couple of years a neoliberal nationalist party has managed to brainwash the people here. It's shocking to see how people keep repeating mantra's and voting for parties that work against there interest. I used to think that was an American thing (sorry, to any and all US citizens. Just my impression of regular people voting for the republicans), but now it's here to. And not even the internet is a refuge anymore. Because apparently anger is not an acceptable emotion for women in particular to have, and because feminists are often highlighting things certain people just don't want to hear. It troubles me too, that in a topic like this, I have been repeatedly targeted for my emotions on the subject and that anti-feminism spew up there is just the cherry on the cake of festering shit that is this thread. These guys clearly need to spent more time around women then. Seriously though, this doesn't mather much being on the internet and all, but I have to say it. I think you were perfectly justified in being outraged. At least being angry means that you care. Glib answer - because they can't get laid. Heck, I have that problem to and you don't see me blaming women for it :p Because they are colossal assholes. More detailed answer: because misogyny is basically societally accepted and normalized, and people don't like to be told they're doing something wrong. The sad thing is that I think you are right. There is still quite a large paygap in my country and I never really see anyone getting upset by it. It's one of those facts that get tossed out every year and people just raise their shoulders. If something as concrete and measurable as a paygap doesn't even provoke a strong response, than I don't really want to know how many more intangible expressions of misogyny slip by unnoticed. Because they misunderstand what feminism actually is. It's not entirely their fault, there's been a concerted effort to mislabel feminism for decades. For the most part it's work; even some people who identify as feminists have no idea what it means. That's one the reasons why I'm always so surprised by the rants against feminism. If you don't know what you're talking about, then why rag on it so much? There are feminists and there are hyper sensitive social justice warriors that find all sorts of discrimination and unfairness where it doesn't exist and won't hesitate to SCREAM it at you. The latter give the former a bad name, and that's where most of the bashing comes from. I say 'most' because there are still plenty of sexist fucks out there. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question. I think I'll pass on your interpretation though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Kilimaro Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Threads like this make me realize just how far we have to go still to stamp out all of the repulsive behavior that is accepted as normal by so many people in so many places online. Good grief. It's depressing to me how much this venom towards so-called "social justice warriors" has taken root on the board. If you're so against the prevailing mindset here, please do us a favor and leave. Sooner or later you will just end up getting banned for being a disgusting human being anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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