Grayce Hornwood Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I find comments like this unproductive. Yes, some people really are dead. Yes, some people are exactly who they appear to be. That does not mean we know who. So, until we read "A Dream of Spring", there are going to be alot of theories. Sure, most of them will be wrong; but some may be right. Sorry. That's just the way it is. I realize that's the way it is, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it. I was under the impression that this was a thread where we could vent about things that annoy us without fear of being reprimanded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anythingatall Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 There are countless threads about AA,you have just to find it. I think you should look to Heresy threads on the matter too. I've looked at the Heresy ones and although I have often heard about AA being bad I have never actually come across the evidence, to be honest until I read it above I thought it was a fringe theory. Also I am the worst person ever at using search... unless you want to search for "Please wait 23 more seconds before searching again"... then I am awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgottenKnight Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Jon Snow and Tyrion must be dragon riders because EVERYONE LIKES THEM. Littlefinger is evil because he manipulates people or Littlefinger shouldn't sleep with Sansa even though it's the most epic pay back to a girl who rejected you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I've looked at the Heresy ones and although I have often heard about AA being bad I have never actually come across the evidence, to be honest until I read it above I thought it was a fringe theory. I'll give you one as a tease. :) ' When your dragons were small they were a wonder. Grown, they are death and devastation. A flaming sword above the world." Spoken by Xaro Xhoan Daxos in aDwD to Daenerys, who also happens to have woken dragons from stone like AAR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anythingatall Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'll give you one as a tease. :) Spoken by Xaro Xhoan Daxos in aDwD to Daenerys, who also happens to have woken dragons from stone like AAR. SIGH. I JUST finished a re-read, thank Christ I have most of them on Kindle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChillyPolly Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I realize that's the way it is, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it. I was under the impression that this was a thread where we could vent about things that annoy us without fear of being reprimanded. Listing specific theories you dislike, like Daario = Euron, would be more in keeping with the spirit of the thread. Saying everyone can't be someone else, therefore nobody can be someone else, is silly. Sorry. And it's one of my pet peeves as well. And I'm venting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 SIGH. I JUST finished a re-read, thank Christ I have most of them on Kindle. Well, to be honest it's mostly conjecture based on Mel and the red religion looking really shady despite their devotion to "light." GRRM said that both ice and fire can kill, and many of the characters repeat that exact sentiment. Basically, AA in that sense is just The Great Other. But light usually has a good connotation so people look to AA as a hero figure when in reality they probably would want nothing to do with the "champion of fire." I believe that Dany is AAR and the extreme of fire in the series with the dragons, and unless its Jon or Bran, we haven't seen the extreme personification of the Others' ice yet. Jon isn't AAR. He's not the champion of fire. He's of ice and fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfgangII Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I have a popular opinion that annoys me the most: the Meereenese knot is boring and Dany should go immediate to Westeros. How could you not want to expand this world and know what happens in the other side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 And it's not an accident that in the times when he's trying to get them to cooperate, he let's "his anger flare/flash." And even then, they still ultimately try to kill him. He also pushes away his friends, rather than really lead them. He's a great a battlefield commander, and a hero overall, but not a man who's been trained to deal with lords, and as a result really doesn't do that well in the job. Okay, that's just BS. And ignoring obvious textual evidence to the contrary. Jon WAS trained to deal with Lords...he was the son of the Lord of Winterfell. Let's look at the Lords/other political leaders he successfully deals with: 1. Stannis 2. The Clan Leaders 3. Mance 4. Tormund 5. Tycho Nestoris 6. Alys Karstark/The Thenns Jon seems to do an excellent, even unbelievably good job of dealing with everyone except for Marsh and a few 'institutionalized' men under him who are more scared of Tywin Lannister's ghost than the army of undead coming their way- which is utterly stupid, imo. If Jon had taken their advice, the NW would have almost certainly ceased to exist at that point...not only that, but they would have also probably doomed Westeros and humanity along with them. So yeah...this is a ridiculous argument to make. You could say that Jon made some mistakes, because he did, but he sure as hell wasn't a 'bad' leader. He was the best LC the NW had seen in a very long time, and did everything in his power to rebuild the strength of the Wall despite the opposition surrounding him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 JON SNOW GETTING DROGON!!! This, a thousand times this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0LordCommanderSnow0 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 People who think Mance is Rhaegar blow my mind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Of Winter Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Sandor/Sansa. It's not annoying, but I find it creepy to ship teenage girl with a fully grown man in his twenties. Yeah, I know how much hints are foreshadowing GRRM put into this, but it just rubs me the wrong way. Same goes for Sansa-Tyrion or LF and Dany-Drogo. What am I annoyed with are occasional moral relativist wannabes theories like Tywin/Cersei/Walder Frey/Littlefinger aren't evil, usually followed by they're just able competent in a ruthless world around them or they're no worse than the others. Oh, and all of Cat's children were not fathered by Ned theories as well. Seriously, I've seen suggestions that one of them (usually Bran) was fathered by Littlefinger, Hodor, Benjen, Bloodraven and Maester Luwin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anythingatall Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Well, to be honest it's mostly conjecture based on Mel and the red religion looking really shady despite their devotion to "light." GRRM said that both ice and fire can kill, and many of the characters repeat that exact sentiment. Basically, AA in that sense is just The Great Other. But light usually has a good connotation so people look to AA as a hero figure when in reality they probably would want nothing to do with the "champion of fire." I believe that Dany is AAR and the extreme of fire in the series with the dragons, and unless its Jon or Bran, we haven't seen the extreme personification of the Others' ice yet. Jon isn't AAR. He's not the champion of fire. He's of ice and fire. Yep, I never even considered questioning it (even with the horrifying Nisa Nisa story) especially as I just conflated it with the other chosen one stories. I am really intrigued now. I am going to give it a look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Visenya Stark Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Jon is the son of Ned and Ashara/Wylla/fisherman's daughterJon is the son of Brandon and AsharaJon is the son of Aerys and LyannaJon is secretly AegonDany is the daughter of Rhaegar and Lyanna/Rhaella/Elia/AsharaRhaegar survived and is secretly ManceBenjen is Daario is Euron is Dusky Woman is Darkstar is Jaqen And thisThe sheer thought that Litttlefinger will ever actually sit the Iron Throne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SacredOrderOfGreenMen Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 <snip> Most of those weren't under Jon's command (to make a comparison to vassalage); he dealt well enough with prospective military allies, but ultimately GRRM made the authorial choice to show him failing as a ruler of his own men. And Jon does fail. Because he didn't create a coalition amongst in the Nights Watch, by pushing away his allies and not succesfully cow the likes of Bowen Marsh, the Night's Watch will now likely be squaring off with the wildlings in an internecine conflict no one can afford. GRRM chose to write that, just as he chose to write Jon as successfully rallying a haggard and ill-trained band of misfits to unlikely victory, whatever the circumstances. By doing so, he frames Jon clearly as a gallant hero warrior. But not a king, and in ASOIAF great warriors are never shown to be truly successful rulers. Look at Prince Aegon, Quentyn Martell, Daemon Blackfyre and Robert Baratheon. Don't get me wrong; I like Jon well enough. I think he's Azor Ahai (or at least, essential to defeating the Others); he's just not good king material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hangover of the Morning Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 HS = HR (High Sparrow is Howland read): utter nonsense and complete garbage. Anyone who believes it should take a lesson in critical thinking. Walls of text presenting that twice mentioned character that nobody remembers from the books is secretly a character that only appears in a companion book. And yeah, both are dead now. Most of all, I get irked by theories that remove character's agency: character X was warged when doing so and so; super detailed masterplans and conspiracies that rely on everything going exactly as planned and nothing to be left to chance (HS=HR); prophecies said it; magic caused it; the gods did it... Theories that are in an extremely convoluted way trying to "explain" things that are blatantly clear from the books: e.g. Jon Arryn conspired with Tywin to murder Elia/Rhaenys/Aegon; Mance Ryder sent the catspaw that tried to kill Bran; Rhaegar lost to Robert because he was weakened by magic, LF is secretly a Reyne or Tarbeck, Lemon Trees in Braavos... Jon being anything but Rhaegar's son: if you except that, you also have to believe that Ned was a cruel and horrible person for needlessly torturing Cat and Jon by hiding the truth from them Any obviously dead character (Ned, Robb, Rhaegar, Lyanna...) being alive: but I don't think anyone really take those seriously. A + J =T: I understand why people think that it's possible, and I guess it is, but I feel that it goes against George's literary style and what he is trying to convey in the books. Ashara and Arthur living happily ever after in the swamps of Neck with Howland Reed: there's nothing to disprove it but it'd be so lame if it was true Theories that bring no answers and only further complicate an already convoluted story. Edit: Anything with special blood and people being superior to others because of their origins: e.g. Rhaegar and Lyanna somehow engineering a saviour of humanity by combing the Fist Men and Valyrian blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lyman Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Littlefinger sent the assassin to Bran.Littlefinger being behind most of the events of the book.Wintefell library being burned for what it contained and not as a distraction for assassin.Bllodraven warging into people/animals to cause certain events to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
239JMFL34109 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Jon Snow and Tyrion must be dragon riders because EVERYONE LIKES THEM. Littlefinger is evil because he manipulates people or Littlefinger shouldn't sleep with Sansa even though it's the most epic pay back to a girl who rejected you. the last two are not theories is just fact he is evil i think he would agree to that with a smile on his face and he should not sleep with an underage girl for any reason but because you were hung up on her mom doesn't help. I am a big LF fan too i do agree the jon and tyrion MUST ride dragons gets brought up in conversation about who is the best sword fighter. same with the tyrion MUST be targ stuff. Jon is the son of Ned and Ashara/Wylla/fisherman's daughter Jon is the son of Brandon and Ashara Jon is the son of Aerys and Lyanna Jon is secretly Aegon Dany is the daughter of Rhaegar and Lyanna/Rhaella/Elia/Ashara Rhaegar survived and is secretly Mance Benjen is Daario is Euron is Dusky Woman is Darkstar is Jaqen And this YES TO ALL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 That the Tyrells are somehow sneakier or more opportunistic than other Houses and that they are turncloaks who keep changing kings like they change underwear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nictarion Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I have a popular opinion that annoys me the most: the Meereenese knot is boring and Dany should go immediate to Westeros. How could you not want to expand this world and know what happens in the other side?I love Dany's story so far, but I'd also like her to spend more than just the last book in Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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