(Spoilers) So what's Littlefinger up to?

[Nerevanin]

16 hours ago, Vanessa16 said:

It is actually quite reasonable to assume that Ramsay's exploits aren't well known. In the books various people talk about his deeds but the show makes no mention of it. It's likely that Ramsay pre war of the five things wasn't as bad as his book counterpart. For instance, before Roose dies, he calls Ramsay his first born, so obviously domeric didn't exist, andwasn't killed by Ramsay. Also, the show makes it seem as if Ramsay came up with the name reek for Theon on the spot, and again makes no mention of the first reek, nor do they indicate a previous marriage to lady donella hornwood. Ramsay also implies that he didn't know his mother well ("she had me, she died") which implies he didn't spend much time with her, and talks about how he met myranda when he was just over 12 years old), and since she was the kennel masters daughter, he must of met her at the dreadfort. In the books, Ramsay only came to live at the dreadfort because Roose had no more heirs. In the show, since he was Roose's first born, it makes sense that Roose took him in much earlier due to him having no other sons at the time. I guess the point I'm trying to make is if the writers can change Ramsay's history, they could also made it so his exploits were not well known. 

Yeah, the show eliminated pretty much everything that would take quite a lot of time to explain and include. What I didn't think of before reading your post was that maybe Ramsay's pre-season 3 activities aren't much well known because he was more careful. When he meets Roose in the show, it seems to me that he Ramsay is well aware of situation of being bastard and has much respect of Roose. It was only after he became Bolton instead of Snow that he became bolder and bolder. So maybe Ramsay's hobbies weren't well known because he was careful not to make Roose angry. Roose probably knew about them but let Ramsay do what he wanted as long as it was in private. It's just a speculation of course.

[Vanessa16]

2 hours ago, Nerevanin said:

Yeah, the show eliminated pretty much everything that would take quite a lot of time to explain and include. What I didn't think of before reading your post was that maybe Ramsay's pre-season 3 activities aren't much well known because he was more careful. When he meets Roose in the show, it seems to me that he Ramsay is well aware of situation of being bastard and has much respect of Roose. It was only after he became Bolton instead of Snow that he became bolder and bolder. So maybe Ramsay's hobbies weren't well known because he was careful not to make Roose angry. Roose probably knew about them but let Ramsay do what he wanted as long as it was in private. It's just a speculation of course.

Yeah. I honestly think that's the case. To understand the show sometimes you have to let go of your book knowledge. The show sometimes provides a reasonable explanation for a plot point, but people use book logic (events and characteristics that aren't even relevant in the show) to explain a show arc, which then causes the plot to seemingly not make sense when from the shows perspective, it really does make sense.

[Bran Snow]

Aidan Gillen gave an interview to EW and said that LF didn't have any knowledge of Ramsay so he is now trying to atone for his mistake. 

[WhoYouCallingPeasant]

In the show, When Rob was still alive, and word came down about Theon taking WF, Bolton was part of the convo. He mentioned that Ramsey might be of some use and that if he was successful that here might be some "pardon" for his previous crimes - so Ramsey and his cruelties were not an unknown. At that point Rob really had no choice since he couldn't leave his army and march back north.

[Lady Sansa's Direwolf]

My first issue with LF marrying Sansa is, she's already married. Twice! Although everyone thinks Tyrion is dragon meat, he is still the one she was married to first. So even if Jon kills Ramsey, once Tyrion returns to Westeros with Dany, she's committed again. While Tyrion might be willing to annul their union since it was never consummated (do they even have annulment with the 7?), she still wouldn't be free to marry LF, although I'm not sure that's where they are heading with Sansa. 

Oh a thought. Jon will be the Warden of the North, Dany gets the Iron Throne, Littlefinger gets killed by the NK, Bran will be used to rebuild the Wall (that's why he needs to know 'everything'), Sansa and Tyrion will take over Dorne from the Sand Snake coup. Dragons will rule the skies again...

[Colonel Green]

23 minutes ago, Lady Sansa's Direwolf said:

My first issue with LF marrying Sansa is, she's already married. Twice! Although everyone thinks Tyrion is dragon meat, he is still the one she was married to first. So even if Jon kills Ramsey, once Tyrion returns to Westeros with Dany, she's committed again. While Tyrion might be willing to annul their union since it was never consummated (do they even have annulment with the 7?), she still wouldn't be free to marry LF, although I'm not sure that's where they are heading with Sansa. 

No, in the show the Tyrion/Sansa marriage is dissolved because it was unconsummated.  They aren't married.

Also, why would she not be free to marry Littlefinger if they needed an annulment and Tyrion gave it? Not that she's going to marry him, mind you.

[Colonel Green]

On 5/12/2016 at 11:03 PM, WhoYouCallingPeasant said:

There is NO WAY he did not know anything about Ramsey.

Except, again, the writers have said he didn't know.

[TheKitttenGuard]

4 hours ago, WhoYouCallingPeasant said:

In the show, When Rob was still alive, and word came down about Theon taking WF, Bolton was part of the convo. He mentioned that Ramsey might be of some use and that if he was successful that here might be some "pardon" for his previous crimes - so Ramsey and his cruelties were not an unknown. At that point Rob really had no choice since he couldn't leave his army and march back north.

Robb was offering a pardon to the Iron born, except for Theon, not to Ramsey. Roose refer to Ramsey as his "Bastard at Dreadfort". 

[TheLastLibrarian]

Aidan Gillen discusses Littlefinger in S6

http://watchersonthewall.com/aidan-gillen-discusses-littlefingers-need-atonement-natalie-dormer-brainstorms-hypothetical-cell-mates-margaery/

He said about LittleFinger 'really trying to align myself the right people', an alliance with the starks?

[hallam]

On May 9, 2016 at 5:23 PM, DJE said:

I think he is for sure bring the army of the Vale North. I doubt he will bring SR or marry him to Sansa. I also think that he will join with Jon and I am starting to think that LF will be th eone who reveals R+L=J to Jon. I don't know how he could possibly know, just that little smirk he gave Sansa in the Crypts.

The idea we find out who Jon is till the last season is very silly.

littlefinger doesn't know anyway. So anything he says will turn out wrong.

[Back in Black-Snow]

I think Little Finger will bring the Vale's army to help root out Ramsey Bolton and win back Winterfell for Sansa.

[Nerevanin]

1 hour ago, TheLastLibrarian said:

Aidan Gillen discusses Littlefinger in S6

http://watchersonthewall.com/aidan-gillen-discusses-littlefingers-need-atonement-natalie-dormer-brainstorms-hypothetical-cell-mates-margaery/

He said about LittleFinger 'really trying to align myself the right people', an alliance with the starks?

Yeah, I do think that that means that LF would form an alliance with the Starks. It's gonna be pretty interesting, I think!

[Fexyr]

On 09/05/2016 at 8:48 PM, bb1180 said:

That's generally how I think its going to go down.  LF has been manipulating Sansa all along,  both in the books and the show,  in order to exploit and co-opt her claim on Winterfell and the North.  No doubt he's going to bring his armies north and play a role in the Boltons' defeat,  after which,  I expect he'll try to manipulate Sansa (who will now effectively be Lady/Queen Sansa of the North) into marrying him to further his own power and greed,  which probably isn't going to go over quite so well for him this time around.   

After all she's been through, I just hope Sansa isn't stupid enough to trust him again. 

[Back in Black-Snow]

I don't think she will trust him, but she will use him.

[the tower of albion]

On 5/9/2016 at 10:23 PM, DJE said:

I think he is for sure bring the army of the Vale North. I doubt he will bring SR or marry him to Sansa. I also think that he will join with Jon and I am starting to think that LF will be th eone who reveals R+L=J to Jon. I don't know how he could possibly know, just that little smirk he gave Sansa in the Crypts.

The show merges the Aegon Blackfyre / Jon Snow stories? If Jon is a bastard Targ. Littlefinger / Jon Connington. That would be some crazy shit.

In the books I'm beginning to think Littlefinger is also a Blackfyre sympathizer. 5th column cells are always oblivious to each others existence, Varys and Baelish working towards the same ends with out knowing of the others plans. Why would Illyrio Mopatis  put all his eggs in one basket so to speak?

[DJE]

5 hours ago, hallam said:

The idea we find out who Jon is till the last season is very silly.

littlefinger doesn't know anyway. So anything he says will turn out wrong.

I don't think it's rationale at all, but with D&D, you never know.

[Hol Horse]

On 5/9/2016 at 6:16 PM, Darren Allen said:

The spoiler picture showing someone flayed and burning on a cross? My guess is that is LF.

As dumb as show-LF is, I don't think he's that dumb.

[Epyon]

If I was trying to predict LF's behavior:

He wants a two major things:

1. Become King.

2. Screw over/get revenge on the specific houses who wronged him

a) The Tully's

b. ) The Starks

c. ) The families of the Vale who looked down upon him

 

He already technically controls the Vale, and owns the Riverlands.... and both the Stark and Tully Houses are basically destroyed.... All he needs is to OWN the North, OWN Sansa, and OWN the Vale (That Sweet Robin Kid is technically the ruler, and many Vale houses don't like LF)

So here's what I think his plan shakedown is:

1. Find out Ramsey is a psycho

2. Give Sansa to Ramsey

3. Tell Cersei about Sansa in Winterfell

4. Get cause to sack Winterfell and control North without raising suspicion in the South.

5. Use the war to get Sweet Robin and any non Loyal Vale Lords killed, so he can control the Vale uncontested.

6. Ride in to WF as Sansa's liberator/rescuer and win her too.

7. Meanwhile, he's set it up so that the Tyrell/Lannister alliance is crumbling, and without a strong or capable ruler in King's Landing, the South is falling apart on its own. All he really needs to do is get one of Loras/ Margery killed by the faith, and then let the Tyrell army/Faith massacre one another.... before he intends to march south with the combined might of Riverlands/North/Vale. As an added bonus, if he treated with Euron, the Ironborn attacking the Reach

Spoiler

(like they do in the books via going for Oldtown)

could further diminish the Tyrell/Lannister armies....as well as diminish the Ironborn from being a threat to LF's plans

This plan would work in its entirety if not for: the giant wrench in his plans will be Jon "Star-garyan" riding South to Winterfell with his own army, and likely winning WF for Sansa.... who then won't have LF as her "rescuer", and may kill him this season. 

[Nerevanin]

10 hours ago, Epyon said:

IHe already technically controls the Vale, and owns the Riverlands.... and both the Stark and Tully Houses are basically destroyed.... All he needs is to OWN the North, OWN Sansa, and OWN the Vale (That Sweet Robin Kid is technically the ruler, and many Vale houses don't like LF)

So here's what I think his plan shakedown is:

1. Find out Ramsey is a psycho

2. Give Sansa to Ramsey

These two particular steps of the plan are just stupid imo. Sansa is way too valuable to be given to a known psycho (in case LF knew this about Ramsay, Aidan Gillen said that he didn't and I honestly think that it is the only thing that can semi-explain LF's actions) and left there without any guards. She is the only heir to Winterfell and the North after all, because everyone thinks that Bran, Rickon and Arya are dead. While LF would go down to KL and go to the North again, Sansa might be well dead by then because Ramsay is totally unpredictable.

To be honest, I think that this whole thing of LF giving Sansa to the Boltons is just another episode of D&D making an idiot out of LF. After that totally unrealistic thing in the Vale when LF tried to convince the lords to Lysa committed suicide without even thinking about the possibilty that the lords would like to ask Sansa about it as well and so LF'S life depended on whatever Sansa would say, they did this. I get that LF wanted to take control of the North and eliminate the Boltons but why like this? Why would he give them his precious Sansa who he can lose because of it forever? Ramsay's never seen Sansa. Roose probably saw her sometime pre-Season 1 when she was a small child. LF probably didn't know that Ramsay had Theon but he could find a auburn haired girl and present her as Sansa, similarly to the fArya thing in the books. LF would give them fSansa and then he would hurry to KL to tell Cersei that the Boltons have Sansa, while the real Sansa would stay somewhere safe. It would also be a good way how to convince Sansa that he is on her side - he would destroy the Boltons who killed Sansa's mother and brother. There is of course an unpredictable element of the scheme which is Theon. It's hard to say whether Theon would inform Ramsay that it is not Sansa or if he would remain silent because he would be afraid of Ramsay's anger that he could target well on Theon and on the innocent girl.

But no, D&D had to make LF act as an idiot whose action have little to no sense.

[Darksky]

On 11/05/2016 at 5:08 PM, Nerevanin said:

I agree with those who said that LF might appeared with his army during the Bastard Bowl just in time for the losing Starks to eventually defeat the Boltons. It would quite cliché but it's exactly the kind of cliché that D&D like. 

Much like George then. Stannis at the battle of Castle Black and Tywin at Blackwater anyone? He's the one who came up with those events. Arriving just in time to save the day. I like how the accepted source material tends to be ignored when it gets in the way of show rants.

What's your view on Helm's Deep and Minas Tirith?