Lost Melnibonean Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: Which he does nothing with though. Too busy eating peaches? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 1 minute ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Too busy eating peaches? If I had a choice between eating peaches and riding a dragon, peaches win every time. Sorry not sorry overgrown mutant lizard. Lost Melnibonean 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 19 minutes ago, Mourning Star said: In a kind of shallow sense, Daeron Targaryen. Which one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard of Banefort Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 Oh, Renly definitely does appear in the histories. Daemon Blackfyre II is clearly a parallel character to him: - Both handsome and charming - Both third-born sons - Both heavily implied to be homosexual - Both love chivalry, pageantry, and fine things - Both are introduced in their early-20s - Both had lovers from boyhood who want to be in their kingsguard - Both love playing dress-up (Daemon pretends to be a hedge knight, Cressen compares Renly’s kingship to a costume) - Both flame out spectacularly quickly LongRider and Aldarion 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 5 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said: - Both flame out spectacularly quickly Quote "When the sun has set, no candle can replace it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 34 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said: Oh, Renly definitely does appear in the histories. Daemon Blackfyre II is clearly a parallel character to him: - Both handsome and charming - Both third-born sons - Both heavily implied to be homosexual - Both love chivalry, pageantry, and fine things - Both are introduced in their early-20s - Both had lovers from boyhood who want to be in their kingsguard - Both love playing dress-up (Daemon pretends to be a hedge knight, Cressen compares Renly’s kingship to a costume) - Both flame out spectacularly quickly I never really got the gayness to John the Fiddler. I know GRRM confirmed it but I haven't really picked up on any of the hints. What's the implication that his childhood friend was his lover? I think Johns more like Young Griff, with their stupid nick names and Clark Kent disguises. Although everything you said is true, and I never had faith in John or Aegon, they seem to have at least somewhat concrete plans for how to get to their endgame where as Renly I feel just takes every fork in the road because it's there. So imo Renlys more similar to one of the pretend kings that were so prevalent and useless in the Dance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourning Star Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Which one? Aegon V's son... in retrospect that was extremely unclear, lol Edited July 5, 2023 by Mourning Star Hugorfonics 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 2 minutes ago, Mourning Star said: Aegon V's son... in retrospect that was extremely unclear, lol These fucking names lol. Yea that's not bad. And I love Daemon (the true king!) And have nothing but loath for Renly. But honestly, yea! A usurper who managed to get a ridiculous following only to lose spectacularly. Although I would say that Daemon left a cause thats been followed for now 100 years where as Renlys campaign assuredly died with him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 8 minutes ago, Mourning Star said: Aegon V's son... in retrospect that was extremely unclear, lol Explains why Olenna doesn't like him much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 3 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: And have nothing but loath for Renly. Good Sir, I beg you to reconsider. 3 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: Renlys campaign assuredly died with him I'm here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 2 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Good Sir, I beg you to reconsider. I found his plan to arrest Joff and them as evil, fleeing when Ned asked for help as cowardly, usurping Stannis as selfish, and worst of all, letting Robb fight his war as foolish. He makes me laugh though, even if it is just by body shaming his niece so I put him above Ned Tywin and Robert whom I also find atrocious. 6 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: I'm here... Lol Aejohn the Conqueroo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourning Star Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Craving Peaches said: Explains why Olenna doesn't like him much... Olenna's comment is certainly what inspired my comparison. "Gallant, yes, and charming, and very clean. He knew how to dress and he knew how to smile and he knew how to bathe, and somehow he got the notion that this made him fit to be king. The Baratheons have always had some queer notions, to be sure. It comes from their Targaryen blood, I should think." She sniffed. "They tried to marry me to a Targaryen once, but I soon put an end to that." Edited July 5, 2023 by Mourning Star Hugorfonics 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard of Banefort Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 27 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: I never really got the gayness to John the Fiddler. I know GRRM confirmed it but I haven't really picked up on any of the hints. What's the implication that his childhood friend was his lover? I think Johns more like Young Griff, with their stupid nick names and Clark Kent disguises. Although everything you said is true, and I never had faith in John or Aegon, they seem to have at least somewhat concrete plans for how to get to their endgame where as Renly I feel just takes every fork in the road because it's there. So imo Renlys more similar to one of the pretend kings that were so prevalent and useless in the Dance He’s constantly telling Dunk that he wants to “try my lance on you” and “teach you how to fiddle.” When Dunk tells John he’s drunk as a dog, he asks Dunk to be his dog, and that they can howl all night until they “wake the very gods.” Alyn tells Dunk that “Daemon’s mine” when he tries to kill him. Plus the world book mentions that Bittersteel disapproved of their “close relationship.” Hugorfonics 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 12 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said: He’s constantly telling Dunk that he wants to “try my lance on you” and “teach you how to fiddle.” When Dunk tells John he’s drunk as a dog, he asks Dunk to be his dog, and that they can howl all night until they “wake the very gods.” Lol ok. So he's just like, sexually harassing the hell outta Dunk? Lol I could see it. But like, idk, the first two I can definitely see the double meaning. But the third, so like no doubt if a dude tells a dude Ive been dreaming of you, that's kinda gay, but was that what Eggs brother meant too? I think John really thought that Duncan was destined to be his friend and protector, so imo waking the very gods was more code for let's get drunk then let's have gay sex. 18 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said: Alyn tells Dunk that “Daemon’s mine” when he tries to kill him. Yea Alyns mad paranoy. I could totally see his jealousy being a romantic thing. In fact I agree it definitely is. (That's the dude who stabs him by the well?) But that could also be like a Jon Conn thing who was totally in love with his Prince but I don't think the consensus around here is Rhaegar was gay. I think Alyn and Griff just had an infatuation not a relationship 21 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said: Plus the world book mentions that Bittersteel disapproved of their “close relationship.” Ahh. Ok cool, so maybe not. Ty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: I found his plan to arrest Joff and them as evil It was a good plan though. 42 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: fleeing when Ned asked for help as cowardly, He didn't flee, he offered Ned help, Ned rejected his offer, then he left to avoid being killed/ taken hostage. 42 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: usurping Stannis as selfish That would be more of a point if Stannis bothered to make his intentions clear from the start. At the time Renly crowned himself he had no idea that Stannis wanted the Throne because Stannis said nothing. Unless of course he had psychic powers and so did realise but just did not care. 42 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: letting Robb fight his war as foolish. It was smart, letting Robb do all the work whilst conserving his strength and above all eating peaches. 42 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: Lol I think there are two(?) more of us... You have to look at it from Renly's perspective: how can he best survive to eat another peach? Edited July 5, 2023 by Craving Peaches Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: It was a good plan though. I mean, by the definition of kidnapping three children with serious plans to kill one of them, it's not really a "good" thing to do. But yea for a dishonorable man who wants to live in KL it might be a good short term political move. 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: He didn't flee, he offered Ned help, Ned rejected his offer, then he left to avoid being killed/ taken hostage. If he had stood beside Ned, Janos and Littlefinger wouldn't have gotten close 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: That would be more of a point if Stannis bothered to make his intentions clear from the start. At the time Renly crowned himself he had no idea that Stannis wanted the Throne because Stannis said nothing. Unless of course he had psychic powers and so did realise but just did not care. You don't need psychic powers to realize what a prince on Dragonstone hiring sellswords is planning to do. 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: It was smart, letting Robb do all the work whilst conserving his strength and above all eating peaches. Kings are supposed to work though, and eat nectarines 1 hour ago, Craving Peaches said: I think there are two(?) more of us... You have to look at it from Renly's perspective: how can he best survive to eat another peach? Nah you guys are endless. Even the mods like Renly. Um, not go to war? Lots of peaches during peacetime, I mean peachtime. Edited July 5, 2023 by Hugorfonics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 There's probably decade old topics about it and what foreshadowing can be drawn from it. The characters in the series exist to explore themes and prove a point. The historic characters explore these same themes but mostly with a telling difference. For example, Arya exists to explore the importance of a high lady in this society sacrificing her personal desires to do her duty, in the end Arya will make her sacrifice and everything will work out for the best. In contrast Rhaenyra exists to explore the same theme, difference being she didn't sacrifice her personal desires for duty and the result was cataclysmic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaffronLady Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 2 hours ago, chrisdaw said: Arya exists to explore the importance of a high lady in this society sacrificing her personal desires to do her duty, in the end Arya will make her sacrifice and everything will work out for the best. Seems kind of a cruel sacrifice to make for a girl who is yet to be 20. And come to think of it, Rhaenyra was almost 2 decades older than Aegon2, yet she seemed so immature they might just be about the same age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevets Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 20 minutes ago, SaffronLady said: Seems kind of a cruel sacrifice to make for a girl who is yet to be 20. And come to think of it, Rhaenyra was almost 2 decades older than Aegon2, yet she seemed so immature they might just be about the same age. At this point, I'm not sure what Arya's personal desires are likely to be. Presently, she's focused on revenge and training to be an assassin. Yet that is clearly not her future. She's said she doesn't want to be a lady, so knowing George, that seems a likely fate for her. Of course it comes with two whole packs to be in charge of, family and castle, so she might like it after all. In any event, I'm not sure I see much of her in Rhaenyra, from what little I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisdaw Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 27 minutes ago, SaffronLady said: Seems kind of a cruel Perhaps, bitter sweet others may say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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