Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Once she finally arrives in Westeros with her followers and armies, and openly presses her claim to be queen of the Seven Kingdoms, which region/kingdom do you think will be the biggest obstacle or source of opposition to Daenerys and her proclaimed title of queen of the Seven Kingdoms ? Which region should give her the most difficulties and headaches ? I am not taking in account the Long Night and War with the Others for obvious reasons. I do think that Dorne will become a real thorn in her side, much like for her ancestor Aegon, once the news of Quentyn's death by dragon fire reach Westeros, and after Arianne ties herself and Dorne with Aegon. I don't think the result is going to be pretty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astarkchoice Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 The vale Fully intact armed forces, fully stocked larders of food! The gate would be a nightmare to force at the best of times and pure hell in winter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Dorne, North, Vale, Stormlands, possibly Westerlands. Reach does not have good terrain and probably wants to side with Daenerys, Riverlands are too divided, Crownlands are too small, Iron Islands are too vulnerable to Dragon attack on fleet plus they are so poor why would Daenerys even bother. Aldarion 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRANDON GREYSTARK Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 10 hours ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said: Once she finally arrives in Westeros with her followers and armies, and openly presses her claim to be queen of the Seven Kingdoms, which region/kingdom do you think will be the biggest obstacle or source of opposition to Daenerys and her proclaimed title of queen of the Seven Kingdoms ? Which region should give her the most difficulties and headaches ? I am not taking in account the Long Night and War with the Others for obvious reasons. I do think that Dorne will become a real thorn in her side, much like for her ancestor Aegon, once the news of Quentyn's death by dragon fire reach Westeros, and after Arianne ties herself and Dorne with Aegon. I don't think the result is going to be pretty. All , Dany will be seen as a foreign invader . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eli Cross Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 I would guess the most stubborn will be the north because the Starks and their followers are savages who are not known for thinking straight. Daenerys is very smart and she will go about it to teach them a lesson. The Starks will betray the north like they betray everybody they ally with. The northmen will become wights and they will be the host of ice that Daenerys will burn later on. Aejohn the Conqueroo, Jaenara Belarys, Craving Peaches and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarkTullies Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 (edited) A simpler question would be which region will be Dany's allies, and the answer will probably be: nobody but maybe the Iron Islands. Of course none of the Ironborn are really allying with Dany, but with her dragons. And perhaps the Westerlands will be so sick of their Lannister overlords that they will do what the Tullys did during Aegon's Conquest and betray the Lannisters for a new ruler they hope will be slightly less tyrannical. Dany's "easy ally" (Dorne) will have sided with Aegon. When the message gets back to Doran from Gerris Drinkwater that Quentyn died because Dany publicly laughed at his proposal (only half-true, but it's the story that Gerris will tell), Dany will forever be Doran's enemy. Even without that blood feud, Arianne can marry Aegon, while Quentyn can no longer marry Dany. The entire purpose of Quentyn's storyline was to flip Dorne into strong allies of Aegon against Dany. The Reach probably wouldn't have a strong preference for Dany vs Aegon, just whoever arrives first to topple the Lannisters, and that will be Aegon. Would they turn cloaks for Dany if the situation benefits them? Possibly. The Tyrells are as opportunistic as the Lannisters and the Freys, just a lot less evil about it. But a region disliking Dany does not mean they will give her difficulty. The Riverlands and the North are so drained and isolated that they probably don't care who is playing musical thrones in Kings Landing as long as she leaves them alone. It won't be specific regions that give Dany difficulty, but King Aegon and Queen Arianne. Even if Aegon and Arianne unite half of Westeros under them, I don't know how long they could withstand a united Dothraki khalasar and if Dany maintains control over three dragons. I doubt Dany's three dragons will remain hers, however, so Dany's biggest adversaries will be those who claim a dragon or two to fight against her. But those are Dany's "enemies". She won't be able to stop her Dothraki from raping and murdering and enslaving everyone they encounter, so unless Dany becomes the ultra-villain of this story and simply doesn't care about the chaos she unleashed on Westeros, Dany's biggest problem will be her own khalasar. I don't think Dany's story is about her difficulty in conquering Westeros (I think it will be quite easy), it will be how she does it and what type of person she becomes because of it. Edited March 5 by StarkTullies Aldarion and Kal-L 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 My own view is that the Dornish hardliners, and Jon Connington, will put Tommen, Myrcella, and Margaery to death, along with anyone else associated with the a regime. So, the Tyrells and some other Reach and Western lords will switch to Daenerys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willam Stark Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Dorne and Stormlands I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldarion Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 At minimum, Dorne, Stormlands, Crownlands and portions of Reach will join Aegon while Ironborn may join Daenerys. Basically what I wrote here: https://warfantasy.wordpress.com/2023/11/09/clash-of-empires-daenerys-vs-westeros-conventional-forces/ If you expand beyond it: 1) portions of Riverlands may join Aegon 2) portions of Reach may join Daenerys though both are equally unlikely I think. 3 hours ago, StarkTullies said: I don't know how long they could withstand a united Dothraki khalasar Quite easily, in fact. Craving Peaches 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astarkchoice Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Resist with what is the question though? The norths fighting strength will be spent from w0t5k losses(red wedding included) , remaining ironborn removal fights and the upcomming stannis vs bolton battle. The westerlands has had it stremgth broken by robb and the riverlands by jamie add in the upcomming red wedding 2.0 and whatever the blackfish can do. The stormlamds rose up anđ lost with stanis and lost castles to the incomming faegonn gold company. The pro stannis marcher lords are bottled up by the fact the dornish army is in the passes(as per tyrions pact) and they cant risk moving. The reachs strength is huge and largely unbroken but a siege of dragonstone , the florents keep on top of a possible tarly led purging of kl of faith militant and eurons possible sneak attacks on hightower etc may suck away a lot of their manpower as may loyalties to the targs and ex golden company members! The vale and dorne remain untouched but the vale is until discovered/exposed littefingers fiefdom and dorne may not be too happy to see dany based on whst drinkwater etc tells them. The crownlands some robert/joff loyalists fought at blackwater and some (as we saw with brienne) secretly await a targ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 9 hours ago, Eli Cross said: I would guess the most stubborn will be the north because the Starks and their followers are savages who are not known for thinking straight. Daenerys is very smart and she will go about it to teach them a lesson. The Starks will betray the north like they betray everybody they ally with. The northmen will become wights and they will be the host of ice that Daenerys will burn later on. Good to know the version of the books available in this universe is better than whatever you're reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldarion Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 13 hours ago, astarkchoice said: Resist with what is the question though? The norths fighting strength will be spent from w0t5k losses(red wedding included) , remaining ironborn removal fights and the upcomming stannis vs bolton battle. The westerlands has had it stremgth broken by robb and the riverlands by jamie add in the upcomming red wedding 2.0 and whatever the blackfish can do. The stormlamds rose up anđ lost with stanis and lost castles to the incomming faegonn gold company. The pro stannis marcher lords are bottled up by the fact the dornish army is in the passes(as per tyrions pact) and they cant risk moving. The reachs strength is huge and largely unbroken but a siege of dragonstone , the florents keep on top of a possible tarly led purging of kl of faith militant and eurons possible sneak attacks on hightower etc may suck away a lot of their manpower as may loyalties to the targs and ex golden company members! The vale and dorne remain untouched but the vale is until discovered/exposed littefingers fiefdom and dorne may not be too happy to see dany based on whst drinkwater etc tells them. The crownlands some robert/joff loyalists fought at blackwater and some (as we saw with brienne) secretly await a targ. Most of kingdoms are far from spent. Generally speaking, a winning army suffers 5% losses while losing one suffers 20-40% losses. But these are numbers for Roman battles, which are unusually bloody by medieval standards. At Agincourt, French suffered 24% losses, which would be more typical of medieval battles. North didn't really suffer that many defeats. In fact, if I look at ALL battles in the War of the Five Kings, we have: Golden Tooth Riverlands army: unknown but less than 8 000 men, casualties unknown - estimated 1 600 - 3 200 dead Lannister army: 15 000, casualties unknown - estimated 250 Mummer's Ford Beric Dondarrion's company (Stormlands): 80 dead Mountain's company: unknown Riverrun #1 Lannister army: 15 000 men, estimated 750 dead Tully army: unknown, est. 10 000 men, estimated 2 000 - 4 000 dead Conquest of Riverlands: unknown Battle of the Green Fork Lannister army: 20 000 men, around 1 000 dead Stark army: 17 800 men, 5 000 dead Battle in the Whispering Wood: Lannister army: 2 250 men at maximum, 2 000 dead Stark-Tully army: 6 000 men, 200 dead Battle of the Camps: Lannister army: 12 750 men, 8 000 dead Stark-Tully army: 6 000 men, estimated 300 dead Sack of Darry: unknown Fall of Moat Cailin: Greyjoy army: unknown Stark army: 200 archers, estimated 40 - 80 dead Fall of Deepwood Motte: Stark army: est 100 - 200 men, est 20 - 80 dead Greyjoy army: 1 000 men, est 50 dead Harrying of the Stony Shore: Stark army: unknown, all dead (perhaps 200?) Greyjoy army: 200 - 250 men, est 0 dead Torrhen Square: Stark army: 900 men, est 45 dead Greyjoy army: est 150 men, est 30 - 60 dead Capture of Winterfell: Stark garrison: est 10 men, all dead Greyjoy force: 30 men, est 2 dead Battle at Winterfell: Stark force: 2 000 men, est 400 - 800 dead Bolton force: 600 men, est 30 dead Sack of Winterfell: Bolton force: 570 - 580 men, no dead Greyjoy force: 18 men, 16 dead Capture of Torrhen Square: Stark force: est 20 men, 2 dead Greyjoy force: 200 men, 10 dead Attempt to free Jaime: Tully force: unknown, 4 dead Lannister force: 100 guards, est 40 dead Battle of Oxcross: Lannister force: est 20 000 men, 10 000 dead Stark force: 6 000 men, est 300 dead Siege of Storm's End: no casualties Bitterbridge: unknown, minor Fords: Lannister force: 20 000 men, est 2 000 - 4 000 dead (not defeated) Tully force: 11 000 men, est 550 dead Harrenhall: Lannister force: 100 men, 97 dead North force: 200 men, est 10 dead Storming of the Crag: Lannister garrison: unknown, weak (est. 100, 10 dead) Stark force: 6 000 cavalry, est 300 dead Blackwater: Lannister force: 7 000 - 8 000 garrison (Royal House); 20 000 Lannister, 50 000 - 70 000 Tyrell; est 1 000 dead Baratheon force: 16 400 mostly Reach cavalry, 4 600 Crownland+Stormland infantry; est ~4 000 - 6 000 dead Siege of Darry: unknown Battle of Duskendale: Tyrell - Lannister force: unknown, unknown casualties (est. 6 000 men, 1 000 dead) Stark force: 3 000 men, 1 000 casualties Capture of Harrenhall: unknown Taking of Maidenpool: unknown Fighting at Fords of Trident: Lannister army: unknown, at least 6 000, est 300 dead Stark army: 6 000 men, 2 000 casualties (dead, captured) Red Wedding: Traitors: "thousands" of Freys, 3 500 Boltons and Karstarks - est. 6 500 at least, est 300 casualties Loyalists: 3 500, est. 3 000 casualties Taking of the Shields: Tyrell force: 50 longships, 38 ships captured - est 5 000 men, 3 800 captured Greyjoy fleet: >94 longships (est 200), 6 longships lost - est 20 000 men, 600 dead Second Siege of Storm's End: unknown Siege of Dragonstone: Royal force: 2 000 men (Tyrell + Lannister), 1 000 dead - mostly Lannister Baratheon force: unknown, unknown dead Siege of Riverrun: unknown casualties, likely minimal Siege of Raventree: unknwon casualties, likely minimal Battle Beneath the Wall: Wildlings: 30 000 - 40 000 fighting men, 1 200 wildlings dead Stannis: 1 500 cavalry, light losses - est. 50 dead Siege of Moat Cailin: Northern force: 400, likely no casualties Ironborn force: 67, all killed Fight by Deepwood Mottle: Greyjoy force: 200, all killed or captured Northern force: 3 900 men, est 100 casualties Landing of the Golden Company: unknown casualties So total losses are: Riverlands: 6 000 - 9 600 1 600 - 3 200 2 000 - 4 000 ~150 4 550 150 1 500 Westerlands: 26 500 - 28 500 (unknown number mercenaries) 250 750 1 000 2 000 8 000 40 10 000 2 000 - 4 000 100 10 500 500 300 1 000 Stormlands: 1 100 80 1 000 Crownlands: 1 000 1 000 North: 11 000 5 000 200 ~150 40 - 80 20 - 80 200 45 300 10 300 1 000 2 000 150 1 500 100 Iron Islands: 1 150 - 1 180 50 200 - 250 30 - 60 600 67 200 Reach: 6 800 500 2 000 500 3 800 And keep in mind that my estimates are based on Roman battles. So real losses will have been much lower than the above. Compare this to starting strengths: North: 30 000 19 000 left Riverlands: 20 000 10 000 - 14 000 left Westerlands: 35 000 10 000 left at least + 32 500 navy Crownlands: 20 000 + 42 000 navy 19 000 left + ~20 000 navy? Iron Islands: 42 000 40 000 left Stormlands: 25 000 24 000 left Reach: 65 000 + 35 000 navy 65 000 + 28 200 navy left Vale: 25 000 Dorne: 25 000 Overall, Westeros still has 280 000 - 290 000 troops left (197 - 201 000 ground troops, 87 500 navy) at least. Edited March 6 by Aldarion astarkchoice, Jaenara Belarys, Vaegon the dragonless and 1 other 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Cambodia Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 I suspect her invasion will closely parallel Aegon's, with three dragons proving really quite persuasive. Maybe a single Field of Fire event (frying Tarlys even?), will put to rest any objections. And like with the first Conquest, Dorne will be the thorn in her side due to t'other Aegon as already discussed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astarkchoice Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 4 hours ago, Aldarion said: Most of kingdoms are far from spent. Generally speaking, a winning army suffers 5% losses while losing one suffers 20-40% losses. But these are numbers for Roman battles, which are unusually bloody by medieval standards. At Agincourt, French suffered 24% losses, which would be more typical of medieval battles. North didn't really suffer that many defeats. In fact, if I look at ALL battles in the War of the Five Kings, we have: Golden Tooth Riverlands army: unknown but less than 8 000 men, casualties unknown - estimated 1 600 - 3 200 dead Lannister army: 15 000, casualties unknown - estimated 250 Mummer's Ford Beric Dondarrion's company (Stormlands): 80 dead Mountain's company: unknown Riverrun #1 Lannister army: 15 000 men, estimated 750 dead Tully army: unknown, est. 10 000 men, estimated 2 000 - 4 000 dead Conquest of Riverlands: unknown Battle of the Green Fork Lannister army: 20 000 men, around 1 000 dead Stark army: 17 800 men, 5 000 dead Battle in the Whispering Wood: Lannister army: 2 250 men at maximum, 2 000 dead Stark-Tully army: 6 000 men, 200 dead Battle of the Camps: Lannister army: 12 750 men, 8 000 dead Stark-Tully army: 6 000 men, estimated 300 dead Sack of Darry: unknown Fall of Moat Cailin: Greyjoy army: unknown Stark army: 200 archers, estimated 40 - 80 dead Fall of Deepwood Motte: Stark army: est 100 - 200 men, est 20 - 80 dead Greyjoy army: 1 000 men, est 50 dead Harrying of the Stony Shore: Stark army: unknown, all dead (perhaps 200?) Greyjoy army: 200 - 250 men, est 0 dead Torrhen Square: Stark army: 900 men, est 45 dead Greyjoy army: est 150 men, est 30 - 60 dead Capture of Winterfell: Stark garrison: est 10 men, all dead Greyjoy force: 30 men, est 2 dead Battle at Winterfell: Stark force: 2 000 men, est 400 - 800 dead Bolton force: 600 men, est 30 dead Sack of Winterfell: Bolton force: 570 - 580 men, no dead Greyjoy force: 18 men, 16 dead Capture of Torrhen Square: Stark force: est 20 men, 2 dead Greyjoy force: 200 men, 10 dead Attempt to free Jaime: Tully force: unknown, 4 dead Lannister force: 100 guards, est 40 dead Battle of Oxcross: Lannister force: est 20 000 men, 10 000 dead Stark force: 6 000 men, est 300 dead Siege of Storm's End: no casualties Bitterbridge: unknown, minor Fords: Lannister force: 20 000 men, est 2 000 - 4 000 dead (not defeated) Tully force: 11 000 men, est 550 dead Harrenhall: Lannister force: 100 men, 97 dead North force: 200 men, est 10 dead Storming of the Crag: Lannister garrison: unknown, weak (est. 100, 10 dead) Stark force: 6 000 cavalry, est 300 dead Blackwater: Lannister force: 7 000 - 8 000 garrison (Royal House); 20 000 Lannister, 50 000 - 70 000 Tyrell; est 1 000 dead Baratheon force: 16 400 mostly Reach cavalry, 4 600 Crownland+Stormland infantry; est ~4 000 - 6 000 dead Siege of Darry: unknown Battle of Duskendale: Tyrell - Lannister force: unknown, unknown casualties (est. 6 000 men, 1 000 dead) Stark force: 3 000 men, 1 000 casualties Capture of Harrenhall: unknown Taking of Maidenpool: unknown Fighting at Fords of Trident: Lannister army: unknown, at least 6 000, est 300 dead Stark army: 6 000 men, 2 000 casualties (dead, captured) Red Wedding: Traitors: "thousands" of Freys, 3 500 Boltons and Karstarks - est. 6 500 at least, est 300 casualties Loyalists: 3 500, est. 3 000 casualties Taking of the Shields: Tyrell force: 50 longships, 38 ships captured - est 5 000 men, 3 800 captured Greyjoy fleet: >94 longships (est 200), 6 longships lost - est 20 000 men, 600 dead Second Siege of Storm's End: unknown Siege of Dragonstone: Royal force: 2 000 men (Tyrell + Lannister), 1 000 dead - mostly Lannister Baratheon force: unknown, unknown dead Siege of Riverrun: unknown casualties, likely minimal Siege of Raventree: unknwon casualties, likely minimal Battle Beneath the Wall: Wildlings: 30 000 - 40 000 fighting men, 1 200 wildlings dead Stannis: 1 500 cavalry, light losses - est. 50 dead Siege of Moat Cailin: Northern force: 400, likely no casualties Ironborn force: 67, all killed Fight by Deepwood Mottle: Greyjoy force: 200, all killed or captured Northern force: 3 900 men, est 100 casualties Landing of the Golden Company: unknown casualties So total losses are: Riverlands: 6 000 - 9 600 1 600 - 3 200 2 000 - 4 000 ~150 4 550 150 1 500 Westerlands: 26 500 - 28 500 (unknown number mercenaries) 250 750 1 000 2 000 8 000 40 10 000 2 000 - 4 000 100 10 500 500 300 1 000 Stormlands: 1 100 80 1 000 Crownlands: 1 000 1 000 North: 11 000 5 000 200 ~150 40 - 80 20 - 80 200 45 300 10 300 1 000 2 000 150 1 500 100 Iron Islands: 1 150 - 1 180 50 200 - 250 30 - 60 600 67 200 Reach: 6 800 500 2 000 500 3 800 And keep in mind that my estimates are based on Roman battles. So real losses will have been much lower than the above. Compare this to starting strengths: North: 30 000 19 000 left Riverlands: 20 000 10 000 - 14 000 left Westerlands: 35 000 10 000 left at least + 32 500 navy Crownlands: 20 000 + 42 000 navy 19 000 left + ~20 000 navy? Iron Islands: 42 000 40 000 left Stormlands: 25 000 24 000 left Reach: 65 000 + 35 000 navy 65 000 + 28 200 navy left Vale: 25 000 Dorne: 25 000 Overall, Westeros still has 280 000 - 290 000 troops left (197 - 201 000 ground troops, 87 500 navy) at least. Good point but we dont hear much about injured which will be larger than dead and then theres the ? quality of what remains...they seem to suggest for example a lot of the norths remaining manpower isnt great ( a lot of green boys and old men) and the other regions could be the same. Also some bloody battles have yet to come! up north and multiple ones to bleed the reach +ironborn. The riverlands will soon have another huge massacre as we know too. The golden company will keep fighting too and they seem to be hinting they draw off some stormlamd and reach forces because their allegeinces to men in the GC officer corps! Add in i suspect before the snows kick in the elephants (which jon commington was excited to use in westeros) will be a chekovs gun...allowing the GC to have a victory vs a larger force. The crownlands as brienes chapter hinted is a lot of targ loyalism (and one hilariously pro tyrion patch of mercs under bronn) The vale and dorne are the 2 untouched regions..the real trouble spots left. The rest have been battered and will be spread out engaged in fighting and divided. Add in the damage cerseis weaponized stupidity is probably about to do to the regime due to the hugely sensitive situation at kl (which varys and the comming sand snakes will stir further) Edited March 6 by astarkchoice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldarion Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 6 hours ago, astarkchoice said: Good point but we dont hear much about injured which will be larger than dead and then theres the ? quality of what remains...they seem to suggest for example a lot of the norths remaining manpower isnt great ( a lot of green boys and old men) and the other regions could be the same. North is not necessarily a good example because it is geographically massive, and Robb left in a hurry. He basically scoured the nearby lands of troops... for all we know they could have ten thousand men left at the arse end of nowhere that nobody bothered to call up. 6 hours ago, astarkchoice said: Also some bloody battles have yet to come! up north and multiple ones to bleed the reach +ironborn. The riverlands will soon have another huge massacre as we know too. The golden company will keep fighting too and they seem to be hinting they draw off some stormlamd and reach forces because their allegeinces to men in the GC officer corps! Add in i suspect before the snows kick in the elephants (which jon commington was excited to use in westeros) will be a chekovs gun...allowing the GC to have a victory vs a larger force. The crownlands as brienes chapter hinted is a lot of targ loyalism (and one hilariously pro tyrion patch of mercs under bronn) The vale and dorne are the 2 untouched regions..the real trouble spots left. The rest have been battered and will be spread out engaged in fighting and divided. Add in the damage cerseis weaponized stupidity is probably about to do to the regime due to the hugely sensitive situation at kl (which varys and the comming sand snakes will stir further) Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astarkchoice Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 56 minutes ago, Aldarion said: North is not necessarily a good example because it is geographically massive, and Robb left in a hurry. He basically scoured the nearby lands of troops... for all we know they could have ten thousand men left at the arse end of nowhere that nobody bothered to call up. Agreed. Based on the wiki/rpg the north has about 40-45k troops so theres about 25k he left behind! We know stannis took his time and found himself an extra 3k clansmen and bolton, manderly and even poor old rodrik found a few thousand men. Theres probably more in skagos and in the cranngogs too. Obviously even of that number is true its a max as wed expect a certain number will never leave their owm forts etc unguarded All that said i think most of the norths remaining manpower will be forced to deal with the white walkers Edited March 6 by astarkchoice Aldarion 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-L Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Firstly, in my opinion it's important to point out that the Tyrells doesn't represent the Reach as a whole. I do think that Mace Tyrell will be defeated by Aegon and (mostly) Jon Connington in his second attempt at taking Storm's End. From that point onward, I wouldn't be surprised if Randyll Tarly (the best soldier of the reach) betrayed the Tyrells and joined Aegon. I would be very surprised If Varys hadn't at least counted on that when he chose to deal with the skilled members of Tommen's council that could represent a danger to Aegon... The Starks are doing their own thing so in the first stage of Daenerys's conquest, I don't see any interaction happening between them. Still I don't see the North ever getting back to a place fealty to the Targaryens so I guess there will be problems if it comes to that. The Martells will become Dany long lasting ennemies. She will most likely destroy Sunspear and it residents but not without having taken the kind of wounds that hurt long after the battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaenara Belarys Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Probably the Vale or the North. The Vale has a lot of troops and relatively full larders, along with the ports to try and bring in more. It's also a pretty hard land to invade, since the mountain route is blocked by the Gates and the landing areas are probably also populated or garrisoned. The North because it's big and empty, full of stubborn folks that are hard to rule. They do have a food and numbers problem, though. In general, Dany's troops will have a hard time keeping supplied with food, boots and all the other knickknacks you need to run an army. The winter will probably be hard for her troops accustomed to warm lands, but I think that the Dothraki might actually fare better in this sector. Given that they live in the steppe without a bunch of big bodies of water to moderate the temperature, their winters are probably pretty hard. From that, they'd likely have the clothes or the capability to make the clothes in order to stay warm. Everywhere else is either terrain that's not too defensible or is war torn and hungry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted March 8 Share Posted March 8 (edited) On 3/6/2024 at 11:21 AM, Aldarion said: North is not necessarily a good example because it is geographically massive, and Robb left in a hurry. He basically scoured the nearby lands of troops... for all we know they could have ten thousand men left at the arse end of nowhere that nobody bothered to call up. Agreed. 3,000 returned North, out of 20,000. Albeit, many of those losses will have been to desertion, rather than death. Overall losses in the Riverlands, are probably running well into the hundreds of thousands, due to extensive pillage and foraging. The vast majority of those are obviously civilians, but young men who might otherwise be available to fight, will be needed to get in the harvest. Losses in the Westerlands are likely as you state. Robb’s chevauchee probably did not last long enough to seriously impact food supplies, but losses of soldiers were severe. The rest of the Seven Kingdoms will be relatively unscathed, but fighting between the Tyrells, Euron, and fAegon/the Dornish, may prove bloody. Edited March 8 by SeanF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YeniAy_Ottoman Posted March 8 Share Posted March 8 (edited) If Dorne were to wage war against Dany, that's right... Like their ancestors, they would be a great trouble to Dany. Dorne could only be occupied for a very short period of two weeks, and that too at the cost of huge losses. The people of Dorne cannot be invaded by Dany as long as it defends its own home, because they are waging guerrilla warfare and the geography is too harsh. Reach, Vale, West-Crown Lands and River lands can be occupied, as long as there are dragons, the resources and number of armies of these kingdoms do not matter. The Rock is actually hard to get because it is carved into the mountain and it seems unlikely that it will be burned by a dragon, but I think they will get it with help Tyrion's hand, Meereen style. The thing that will challenge Dany the most after Dorne is the North. Dorne and the North have harsh geography and are seasonally opposites. You can see Yin-Yang here, a very nice detail. Jon is the son of ice and fire... He was born in the hottest part of Westeros and raised in the coldest part. Anyway. The North has never been invaded in its history either, it has been tried but failed, not even the Andals could succeed. The Kneeling Stark King could probably have forced Aegon out if he had decided to fight on his own land instead of fighting on the riverlands. Although I don't remember now, was it winter then? The hardest part for Dany's dragon and her soldiers is the cold and snowy north. It's especially worse now that winter is here. Even the southerners of Westeros cannot move as fast as the northerners there, they are not used to it. Cold, snow, etc. are kryptonite for dragons. They even seem difficult to fly, especially when snowstorms begin. The situation is worse for the eunuchs and Dothraki, these people have never seen snow or cold. They cannot fight there, they freeze to death, their horses die. Of course, if they can get to land, this will happen to them, I don't think they can get in from land easly. Manderly's building of naval power will also make the north's job easier; there will probably be a war at sea before they can move to land. In the past, I remember, the Andals managed to land, but were killed on the shore. In short, Dorne and the North will not surrender to Dany and these lands will turn into a swamp for her, like Iraq and Afghanistan. Edited March 8 by YeniAy_Ottoman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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