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Football: Let's All Laugh at Chelsea


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United are so atrocious and yet they're sitting on 7th. Performance wise they should be 4 spots lower on the table. With all the justified laughing at Chelsea, they are 6 points behind them with 2 games in hand. If they win those, they could overtake United, and it wouldn't be entirely undeserved.

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Yeah, I think Ten Hag is gone at the end of the season. Last season he implemented a more compact setup but the chaos element showed up from time-to-time. Judging by this season and the fact he's persisted with a tactical setup that leaves the midfield and defence exposed, it does suggest that the chaotic setup is what Ten Hag is actually going for which is clearly not sustainable.

Also think that the setup is at least partially responsible for all of the injuries we've had. United players spend a lot of time chasing the ball and because we're so open the team has to be constantly running all the way up and down the pitch.

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1 hour ago, Consigliere said:

Yeah, I think Ten Hag is gone at the end of the season. Last season he implemented a more compact setup but the chaos element showed up from time-to-time. Judging by this season and the fact he's persisted with a tactical setup that leaves the midfield and defence exposed, it does suggest that the chaotic setup is what Ten Hag is actually going for which is clearly not sustainable.

To be fair to Ten Hag he seems to have decided that United's attacking players don't really fit into a more measured attacking build up and they're a lot more effective when there's space in behind the opposition. I don't think he's wrong about that. In talking about tactics at the moment there's a lot of focus on control because that's basically the point of Guardiola and Arteta's tactical philosophies but that doesn't have to be your primary goal. Klopp on the other hand is really more about winning in transitions.

I don't watch United that much but my issue with Ten Hag would be not that he's going for a transitional style it's more that I don't really see what the plan is for tilting the odds in United's favour beyond 'create a back and forth game and hope it goes our way'.

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Just now, ljkeane said:

To be fair to Ten Hag he seems to have decided that United's attacking players don't really fit into a more measured attacking build up and they're a lot more effective when there's space in behind the opposition. I don't think he's wrong about that. In talking about tactics at the moment there's a lot of focus on control because that's basically the point of Guardiola and Arteta's tactical philosophies but that doesn't have to be your primary goal. Klopp on the other hand is really more about winning in transitions.

I don't watch United that much but my issue with Ten Hag would be not that he's going for a transitional style it's more that I don't really see what the plan is for tilting the odds in United's favour beyond 'create a back and forth game and hope it goes our way'.

The best description I've seen of Ten Hag's tactics this season said that he wants the team to press high but with a low block. Basically, he's sending the front 3 + Bruno and usually one midfielder to push up to press but the rest hold a deeper line. This has resulted in big gaps in the midfield and whoever plays as the #6 (Casemiro mostly but McTominay, Amrabat and Mainoo have all filled that position at times) getting torched.

The whole point of a high press is to compress the pitch to win back possession in the opponent's half so you have to fully commit to it and not just be half in like Ten Hag has been doing - that just makes the press easy to play through because of the big gaps in midfield while also exposing your midfield and defence. If Ten Hag is not confident that his defenders can play a high line then he should be pulling the lines back. It's pretty amateurish to be setting up the team with such a big gap between the lines.

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It’s just so strange that after all these years the United squad is still not capable of playing any other football other than the one Ole was getting lambasted for. 
 

I understand that Ten Hag wants United to be the best transitional side on the planet but it’s really not clear where he wants the transition to occur? High low or medium? Or everywhere.

Ten Hag is also a pretty pragmatic coach so it’s just odd the way he’s setting his team up. So either his ideas are just mad, or something is breaking down in training. 

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Eze and Olise both fit for Palace. That’s not ideal, Palace are a significantly more dangerous side with both of them in the team.

On the plus side Liverpool are finally approaching a fully fit squad except for Thiago and Matip who won’t be back.

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So I thought Thursday was in large part down to Atalanta being really good but this has been very poor from Liverpool. Endo and Mac Allister in midfield in particular have not been good.

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The team looks badly out of form.  Several individual players are struggling and now it’s too many for the collective to be effective.  We carried ourselves through a difficult period of absences with kids, emotion and belief, but the returning players haven’t clicked back into form yet.

Klopp has been an amazing manager for this club who made us serious consistent contenders again, produced some great football to watch, instilled a great culture, and won a few trophies.  But we’ve also had to endure a lot more fading into second place than actual winning of trophies over the seasons.

I think City heavily outspent us domestically (unfairly and should retroactively lose those titles) and Madrid (annd Sevilla) outfoxed us in Europe.  It’s been a great era, and we may struggle to be this competitive without Klopp, but it has mostly been an era of brave but one-dimensional runners-up.

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This might be a bit an overinterpretation of events tbh.

Liverpool's undoing in the league were really their forwards missing chances left and right.

They could (and should) have put United out of its misery in the first half. Instead they walk away with a 2-2 instead, after coming back from behind.

Today they should've scored 2-3 goals (fill in Liverpool forward of your choice today, all of them had at least one good or at least semi-good chance to score) and could've scored up to 5, if they were really clinical and had lady luck smile upon them (Endo).

If your forwards are unable to hit the proverbial broad side of a barn, you won't win the league. If it were tiredness, the issue would be more down to creating chances, or conceding too many.

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4 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Today they should've scored 2-3 goals (fill in Liverpool forward of your choice today, all of them had at least one good or at least semi-good chance to score) and could've scored up to 5, if they were really clinical and had lady luck smile upon them (Endo).

Yeah, strongly disagree on that one. The problem today was the midfield was terrible with both Endo and Mac Allister in particular looking very fatigued. The thing about chances is that everyone misses more than they score. Yeah, we could have scored a couple of goals (Nunez and Salah didn't really do anything wrong with their chances, Jones and Jota could have done better) but, honestly, Palace missed two better chances.

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  • polishgenius changed the title to Football: Let's All Laugh at Chelsea

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