DanteGabriel Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I'm not saying that much about the Pats' defense, aside from my joy that the DBs turn and look for the ball now, because I don't want to jynx it.But count me among those who are extremely happy that the Pats have a good running game and an improved defense so that Brady doesn't have to do it all himself.ETA: Kal: No, I don't want to get carried away with just one good Monday night game against a somewhat bushwacked Texans team. When I talk about MVP handicapping, I am mostly referring to the horse race aspect. That Brady's shredding of a highly-rated defense will resonate in voters' minds, as will the fact that Brady's team beat Manning's. And like I said, if Brady can play well against the 49ers, who I think have a much more legit defense than the Texans, that ought to seal the MVP for him in the minds of voters.As to Miami: Brady always wilts a little in Miami, so I'm not that surprised. The difference in that Miami game was that the Pats were able to kill the clock with a long running-game drive at the end, which they haven't been able to do since... the 2006 AFC Championship Game. And Kal... of course the Pats, the way they're playing right now, with or without Gronk, would beat the current Cardinals. Come on man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Independent George Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Agreed - I think the Broncos are good enough to have gone 10-6 or 9-7 with Jason Campbell at QB. Of course, I think the Pats would do about the same, for different reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I don't. We saw what the Broncos were like with a replacement level QB - they had Orton last year, and he's basically the definition of that QB. They went 8-8, and had 4.1 expected wins. While their defense was decent it wasn't incredible.I think that this defense is better than last year's, but they're also not playing with a QB that turns it over at an obscene pace and gets no field position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 ETA: Which I guess is why I lean Brady for MVP. And especially the head to head matchup we saw. But I think if we saw post week 5 Peyton Manning from week 1, it'd be neck and neck.I see what you did there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 I don't. We saw what the Broncos were like with a replacement level QB - they had Orton last year, and he's basically the definition of that QB. They went 8-8, and had 4.1 expected wins. While their defense was decent it wasn't incredible.I think that this defense is better than last year's, but they're also not playing with a QB that turns it over at an obscene pace and gets no field position.They went 8-8 last year, and this year the defense is better, the non-qb related offense may be better, and the division is noticeably worse. Last year the Chiefs, Raiders and Chargers combined to go 23-25. This year they are currently 10-29. The Broncos would be a playoff team with any quarterback this side of Blaine Gabbert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebla Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Damn, Bears fans....reports are popping up on Twitter that Chicago has placed PK Robbie Gould on IR and have signed Olindo Mare. Gould has been money for a long time and points have become a premium for the Bears offense. This has to really hurt.ETA: Oh and former commish Paul Tagliabue has vacated all the player suspensions in bounty gate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 ETA: Oh and former commish Paul Tagliabue has vacated all the player suspensions in bounty gate!Wow. Really surprised that he'd shut down Goodell like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balefired-ed Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Damn, Bears fans....reports are popping up on Twitter that Chicago has placed PK Robbie Gould on IR and have signed Olindo Mare. Gould has been money for a long time and points have become a premium for the Bears offense. This has to really hurt.ETA: Oh and former commish Paul Tagliabue has vacated all the player suspensions in bounty gate!As to your first point, kickers and the kicking game in general are way overvalued, maybe they will try to go for it on fourth down more.Your second point confirms what I have been saying for a long while, Roger Goodell is a hypocrite and a liar, and needs to be removed as commissioner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Pretty stunning reversal by Tagliabue. And the more I think about it, the way Goodell has been running things, the more I think it's a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Independent George Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Chase Stewart has a nice article on the defensive stars from the draft class of 2011 - J.J. Watt, Aldon Smith, and Von Miller.Considering that Julio Jones, A.J. Green, Patrick Peterson, Nick Fairley, and Nate Solder were also picked in the first round that year, 2011 looks like an incredibly strong draft class overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awesome possum Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 As to your first point, kickers and the kicking game in general are way overvalued, maybe they will try to go for it on fourth down more.Maybe. Still hurts, though. Gould has been aces from 50+ yards the last few years, and the Bears had 3 opportunities of 50-55 yards against the Vikings that they had to skip. Those potential 9 points were (like the two dropped touchdown passe) the difference between a win and a loss in that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Nick FairleyWhy is he in there? So far, as far as I can tell he's basically a giant bust for the Lions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Pretty stunning reversal by Tagliabue. And the more I think about it, the way Goodell has been running things, the more I think it's a good thing.I'm still wrapping my mind around the whole thing and don't know what to think of it just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockroi Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Yeah, I'm kind of surprised how the residents Pats fans and Rockroi aren't going on and on about that - that the Patriot's defense is actually looking decent. And against Houston, they looked great. That should be a lot scarier of a thing for the teams of the league. If the Pats can have even an average defense they're going to be very, very hard to deal with.Well, I did say that "I thought that the D looked amazing. Foster, Johnson, Shaub all had big problems. This was the #2 offense in the league and it collapsed. I thought Wilfork and Love played super hard and I thought the Defensive Backfield looked great. Dennard and McCourty and EVEN KYLE ARRIGNTON looked great. But the guy who looked especially keyed in was Mayo who seemed to be in on every single tackle the whole game."But a reason we are not all over this is because we are not certain just how legit the D is or if its ethereal- just a combination of schemes and plays that did well against Houston but cannot do a thing against a team with more than 1 legit WR. And the lack of a D and their struggles, I think, were far more indicative of the Pats' record being 10-3 (not 12-1) than the new refs or some crappy calls. The Pats' D was HORRIBLE until right after the bye (and even then- they played great against the Colts but their overall D rating... went DOWN after that game). Can I get my brain around this and say "their problems are solved?" Can't bring myself to say that yet.Talk to me about 6 hours after the Superbowl and you may get a cognitive answer out of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sivin Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 is there any chance brady gets a close thing against manning just because 4-3 in MVP's would be fairer based on their respective careers than 5-2?Don't forget that the Associated Press loves Peyton Manning. If it's close, that could be a factor. Why is he in there? So far, as far as I can tell he's basically a giant bust for the Lions. Actually, every time I've seen him recently he's been playing some ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Why is he in there? So far, as far as I can tell he's basically a giant bust for the Lions. He has turned out to be the best DT on that team. Not sure where you're getting bust from. PFF has him ranked 4th in the league, ahead of Suh (5th). He'd be even higher if he hadn't had a ridiculous amount of penalties against him but he'll grow out of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Independent George Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 He has turned out to be the best DT on that team. Not sure where you're getting bust from. PFF has him ranked 4th in the league, ahead of Suh (5th). He'd be even higher if he hadn't had a ridiculous amount of penalties against him but he'll grow out of that.This, pretty much. Every time I've seen him play, he's either been shoving bodies backwards or plugging up the line. There are no good stats for interior linemen, but he's looked great to me. He's not quite the physical monster Suh is, but he's a lot more disciplined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 This, pretty much. Every time I've seen him play, he's either been shoving bodies backwards or plugging up the line. There are no good stats for interior linemen, but he's looked great to me. He's not quite the physical monster Suh is, but he's a lot more disciplined.Nonetheless, after teh dominance Fairley showed in college and Suh showed in his rookie year, I expected the two of them to be like Seymour and Wilfork, but with slightly better pass rush. Fairley/Suh are good, but it's nothing like that kind of dominance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Nonetheless, after teh dominance Fairley showed in college and Suh showed in his rookie year, I expected the two of them to be like Seymour and Wilfork, but with slightly better pass rush. Fairley/Suh are good, but it's nothing like that kind of dominance.Well, they're both young and Suh is a terrible run defender. Add that with bad play from their DEs and it's hard for them to do much more than they're doing (well except Suh who can learn how to defend the run). Not to mention their DBs and LBs blow. Hard to be too dominate when the rest of the defense is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Independent George Posted December 11, 2012 Share Posted December 11, 2012 Well, they're both young and Suh is a terrible run defender. Add that with bad play from their DEs and it's hard for them to do much more than they're doing (well except Suh who can learn how to defend the run). Not to mention their DBs and LBs blow. Hard to be too dominate when the rest of the defense is terrible.Avril's not that bad, but Vanden Bosch looks done to me. Still, there's no question in my mind that the defense as a whole is under-performing given the strength in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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