Are Cat and UnCat considered the same character to you?

[Michael Snow]

It's a good question, because we didn't know Beric - aside from a few brief mentions, references, and appearances - but Cat was one of the series' driving POVs. This also makes me wonder about Jon Snow. If Jon is brought back by Mel, will people still think of him as good ol' Jon Snow, or UnJon? Will his fanbase turn on him, or will they decide UnJon is still Jon? So many questions!

As to Cat, though, I think she's more a ghost than anything else - an echo of Cat the Character after being twisted by grief, trauma, and a very understandable desire for revenge. Oh, and dying, of course. There's that.

[bent branch]

Until very, very recently I thought of Catelyn & Un-Cat as two different characters. Recently, however, I have begun to question that assumption. I now am wondering if the reason we don't have any Un-Cat POVs is that we would see that her personally is remarkably intact. This would have implications for an Un-Jon, I think. Anyhow, I don't really know what I think right now. I have to rethink the whole Catelyn/Un-Cat thing.

[Buckwheat]

I consider them different characters. There is very little left of Cat in Uncat.

[The Storm Queen]

I think that UnCat is Cat´s id in the moment before her death, if that makes any sense. UnCat is an echo of the strongest feelings Cat felt before she died: Desperation and a thrist for revenge. Add to this Cat´s beginning insanity¹ and the fact that she was dead for a rather long time before being given the kiss of life and you get an convincing UnCat.

¹ I am not sure if Cat´s insanity was only temporary or permanent. If she had survived, maybe she would have gotten better eventually? She is a very strong woman but also faced incredible losses. It is hard to tell.

[Ingelheim]

No. UnCat is a monster full of revenge and pain, and Cat was just a mother who tried to protect her children. To me they are different characters.

[Shane the Llama]

I think some people are forgetting the differing cirumstances of UnCat's resurrection. While Beric was revived shortly after his deahs, Catelyn was killed three days before Beric found her. This may have resulted in a more drastic personality change in her case.

[Booknerd2]

I am more concerned though at the breakdown she apparently had when Robb died. Will that affect any judgements she makes or her actions too.

She might have gone mad right before she died, and that combined with her revenge plans...

Beric was revived several times and it seemed to be memory loss was an issue. Not personality changes.

I am also curious as to how she would act if she does encounter a loved one. Blackfish is on the loose, if her kids get to her, Edmure, somebody, besides just the BWB and the Freys she has been killing.

[Blood of the Trout]

It's difficult to tell how much Catelyn has changed based on the little textual evidence we've had so far. Most of the things we know about Lady Stoneheart comes from third parties and she has been present for five/six pages so far. I consider Uncat to be a Catelyn who experienced two major traumas: witnessing the death of her oldest son and undergoing death and resurrection.

[Lord Warhammer]

Very different characters indeed. Cat had too much heart. Uncat has no heart just a lot of pain and bad memories.

[Silverin]

I think that UnCat is Cat´s id in the moment before her death, if that makes any sense. UnCat is an echo of the strongest feelings Cat felt before she died: Desperation and a thrist for revenge. Add to this Cat´s beginning insanity¹ and the fact that she was dead for a rather long time before being given the kiss of life and you get an convincing UnCat.

¹ I am not sure if Cat´s insanity was only temporary or permanent. If she had survived, maybe she would have gotten better eventually? She is a very strong woman but also faced incredible losses. It is hard to tell.

I think this as well. She is a shadow of the person she was pefore she died.

But I think it brings out an another question. Cat if she lived, could have overcome the trauma, but I somehow don't think UnCat can.

Can resurrected people change? Or will their driving force forever will be the one they died with?

Like in Berics case serving King Robert, and capturing the Mountain?

[Scipio Africanus]

I don't consider Beric and unBeric the same characters either.

Death changes a person, and the longer the undeath status continues the less the person would remember.

Would be mercy for someone to just finish unCat off. But not before she kills some more Freys...

[Ser Duncan of Flea Bottom]

Cat and UnCat are the same person but with different personalities, Uncat is Cat's vengancy side, there's just hate and despise in UnCat, she's a zombie

[David Selig]

Cat and UnCat are the same person but with different personalities, Uncat is Cat's vengancy side, there's just hate and despise in UnCat

Why is she supporting and guarding the orhanage at the Crossroads Inn then?

[Ser Duncan of Flea Bottom]

Why is she supporting and guarding the orhanage at the Crossroads Inn then?

I think she's adopting everyone, because of the loss of her children

[Quentyn the Blazed]

Brothers without borders got pretty screwed over trading Beric for uncat as their leader. I would have a hard time listening to her gurgle orders at me

Edit: as for the OP, uncat is cat, except she acts only on impulse and has a hankering thirst for revenge

[The Mother of The Others]

She's the same character, drastically changed. Like when in highschool this guy I knew suddenly started wearing Raiders gear and trying to hang out with the latino crowd. He may have always been Mexican, but only in secret, you know? Until that day when he unveiled the new hairstyle and openly declared himself part of the Raider Nation. It was a drastic change. Cat too has undergone a transformation. I think there might still be things capable of melting her heart; she just currently thinks all that she ever loved is lost. So she acts accordingly icy. But didn't Dondarrion have sparks of warmth in his personality even after being zombified? So we might see more hints of the old Catelyn surfacing, when those qualities have cause to surface.

[Quiet Isle]

Gosh we could certainly argue this point forever. I'm the mother of three now adult kids, but I can't imagine how i would feel if i saw the destruction of my line like this.

I'll say one thing. She has two potential things to accomplish imho that are karmic insofar as concluding her story arc. She needs to kill Littlefinger. and She needs to make amends to Jon. maybe she'll give him that last bit of her to resurrect him (if indeed he needs resurrection). If that last bit doesn't occur, she needs to find out about Jon and somehow make amends.

[ServantOnIce]

Same person. With some obvious physical and psychological changes after the trauma she witnessed at out favorite event.

I'm done message boarding for the nonce. :eek:

[Bright Blue Eyes]

I think she's adopting everyone, because of the loss of her children

Meshes quite well with "just hate and despise", doesn't it?

[Lady Lea]

I am honestly surprised by the fact that the great majority of posters in this thread completely (or almost) separate Cat from UnCat, although it's nice to see that David Selig has a similar opinion.

I see UnCat as a natural progression from Catelyn. She was always a fierce woman and a fighter, ruthless when she had to be and very capable (it's not her fault people didn't listen to her or events beyond her control happened). In a very short while, her son becomes paraplegic, someone tries to assassinate him, she loses her husband, her two young sons, her home, her youngest daughter, her father, and sees her 12-year-old daughter married off to Tyrion Lannister. She then sees the last of her sons killed right in front of her, and is killed herself. She is thrown naked in the river where she spends days dead.

I mean, that is rough. Considering Catelyn's former traits and everything that's happened to her, I just think it's to be expected that she becomes fixated on revenge.

She still has the skills she did in life, and IMO she is actually doing a better job of escaping the authorities than Beric, who was killed, like, 9 times on the job. She is running a tight ship with the BWB. I know people think the BWB has fallen with her but they were always about revenge. They just had fake trials ("ok dude if you beat me in a duel you are free to go. psych! I have a flaming sword! also we still get to steal all your stuff") and fake knighting and religious ceremonies so it was a bit more pallatable to some. I, while still not supporting the BWB, prefer them to be upfront about their revenge. Anyway, I digress. If she wants to kill Lannisters and Freys, I think that is pretty understandable from her POV, and from there it's natural that she'd include in the bunch Tyrion Lannister's own squire and her former sworn shield who is now running around doing stuff for Jaime Lannister.

I always had a high opinion of Cat's character and skills, so I'm not surprised that when she loses everything and channels all her grief and hate into a pursuit of vengeance she becomes the feared Lady Stoneheart, who is at the very least, a force to be reckoned.