Werthead Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 or why exactly the rule that I believed was in place that he couldn't cross his own timeline wasn't in effect The different incarnations of a Time Lord appear to be different beings (because they are different consciousnesses; when the Doctor regenerates he dies, and a new man walks away with his memories as the Tenth said) so can interact with one another in a limited fashion. I assume the blanking of the memories and the timeline withstanding them being around is a Time Lord safety mechanism. Much more serious is one incarnation of the Doctor crossing the timeline of the same one, which supposedly causes all hell to break loose (as we see in Father's Day with Eccleston) but Smith's done it several times without serious consequences, somehow. It was definitely Capaldi's voice. After reviewing the scene on iPlayer several times, I'm pretty sure it was another one of the Time Lords in the war room. "I didn't know when I was well off. All twelve of them!" "No sir, all thirteen!" Unless the TuckerDoctor is extremely polite, the 'sir' makes it sound like one of the subordinate officers. It also really doesn't sound like either Capaldi's Scottish voice or the English accent he's used several times on different shows. Given in my estimation the episode is in 2021 Clara spent years in further education to become a teacher. Isn't that based on the Rory/Amy timeline? Now they're not around, I've been assuming Moffat has reset the 'present day' in Who back to 2013 and that's where Clara is from and is based. You also don't need to spend years in FE to become a teacher. Assuming you've already been to university, you can do it in less than two years and could get teaching roles in the meantime as a classroom assistant etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mosi Wanostracht Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 After reviewing the scene on iPlayer several times, I'm pretty sure it was another one of the Time Lords in the war room. "I didn't know when I was well off. All twelve of them!" "No sir, all thirteen!" Unless the TuckerDoctor is extremely polite, the 'sir' makes it sound like one of the subordinate officers. It also really doesn't sound like either Capaldi's Scottish voice or the English accent he's used several times on different shows. I've just rewatched it - and it's not completely clear. The initial "No sir" does sound a bit like Capaldi (and it doesn't sound like someone addressing a superior), but the "all thirteen" could be someone else. But they are spoken by the same person. When I first watched it I thought it was one of the Time Lords in the room. Then other people were talking about the Twelfth/Thirteenth Doctor's first line. I would like to know how/why the Thirteenth Doctor was listening in to the Time Lord War Rooms, where he came from, and if he'll mention this when we see him in the new year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicked Woodpecker of West Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 If that ever did happen, the show would simply come back as a reboot or remake a few years later. Doctor Who is never going to permanantly end as it makes the BBC too much money. I'm all into remake after Trenzalore ;)This time without 20 years of break or Wedding of River Song ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazydog7 Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 I wouldn't get to hung up on the regenerations and this being the last. They will find some mystical something something that will increase the number or just make the process infinite no way in hell they would let the show die because they ran out of space. Another thing I've wondered if the title of the painting is true and they did succeed what does that mean exactly? We say the timelords before in End of Time not nice guys. What does that mean for the rest of the universe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Just to clear up the "Capaldi's Voice!" dilemma for you all. It's not. If you watch it with the subtitle's it's labelled as Androgar (or something), the subordinate Time Lord dude. Also, you know, it doesn't sound like him. :P Isn't that based on the Rory/Amy timeline? Now they're not around, I've been assuming Moffat has reset the 'present day' in Who back to 2013 and that's where Clara is from and is based. You also don't need to spend years in FE to become a teacher. Assuming you've already been to university, you can do it in less than two years and could get teaching roles in the meantime as a classroom assistant etc. He based it on the previous episode where Kate Stewart appeared. Rory tells the Doctor that they've been travelling with him for ten years, which would make it 2020. It's totally logical but almost certainly not what Moffat intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
protar Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Just to clear up the "Capaldi's Voice!" dilemma for you all. It's not. If you watch it with the subtitle's it's labelled as Androgar (or something), the subordinate Time Lord dude. Also, you know, it doesn't sound like him. :P He based it on the previous episode where Kate Stewart appeared. Rory tells the Doctor that they've been travelling with him for ten years, which would make it 2020. It's totally logical but almost certainly not what Moffat intended. But logically it must be surely? Kate met the Doctor for the first time during the Power of Three and she's perfectly familiar with him in this episode. Then again...wibbley wobbly, timey wimey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 yeah, the other way to look at is that Rory and Amy spent ten years with him subjectively but since they kept being dropped off when they were picked up, only 2 years passed. But then, Rory also points out in Power of Three that it hasn't been 10 years for the Doctor because he doesn't have to wait between adventures, so clearly time is passing. It doesn't quite make sense but nor does Power of Three being set in 2020 and Day of the Doctor in 2021. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveSumm Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Rory tells the Doctor that they've been travelling with him for ten years, which would make it 2020. It's totally logical but almost certainly not what Moffat intended.But is that 10 years from their perspective, with the Doctor taking them away for weeks on end and returning them to the same time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Just to clear up the "Capaldi's Voice!" dilemma for you all. It's not. If you watch it with the subtitle's it's labelled as Androgar (or something), the subordinate Time Lord dude. Also, you know, it doesn't sound like him. :P It may not be his regular accent but it's defo his voice, giving it a bit of a flourish to announce himself.I wouldn't set too much stock by the subtitles in this - they're done by a separate company and probably had the same debate we're having to decide. I except someone will ask Moffat soon enough... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 It may not be his regular accent but it's defo his voice, giving it a bit of a flourish to announce himself.I wouldn't set too much stock by the subtitles in this - they're done by a separate company and probably had the same debate we're having to decide. I except someone will ask Moffat soon enough... It's odd as on the first watch I simply accepted it was Capaldi but then after the confusion here I watched the scene again and agree with Wert that it was actually some other soldier reporting to the war coumcil. It's amazing how things can be interpreted depending on context though. Bleeding Cool/a british tabloid are claiming that Moffat has stated Capaldi is the 14th doctor and thereby the generation limit has to be addressed in the xmas special. This doesn't make sense to me (as the show has just said "all 13 of them" but many seem to think the "human" Tennant counts as a regeneration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Bleeding Cool/a british tabloid are claiming that Moffat has stated Capaldi is the 14th doctor and thereby the generation limit has to be addressed in the xmas special. This doesn't make sense to me (as the show has just said "all 13 of them" but many seem to think the "human" Tennant counts as a regeneration. They think this because Moffat has pretty much confirmed it. It does make sense, tbh. I'm beginning to strongly suspect that the regeneration limit is why Trenzelor is his 'final resting place' yet he still carries on - perhaps he gets the Master treatment and his original body dies, with him in a new one, or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 They think this because Moffat has pretty much confirmed it. It does make sense, tbh. I'm beginning to strongly suspect that the regeneration limit is why Trenzelor is his 'final resting place' yet he still carries on - perhaps he gets the Master treatment and his original body dies, with him in a new one, or something like that. If you cloned a Timelord and stuck his memories in the clone - would he get more lives? eg a Clone of Tom Baker would mean he still had 8 regenerations left? I'm sure there will be some kind of cheat but otherwise I'm fine with them continuing as it would be mad to cancel it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 They think this because Moffat has pretty much confirmed it. It does make sense, tbh. I'm beginning to strongly suspect that the regeneration limit is why Trenzelor is his 'final resting place' yet he still carries on - perhaps he gets the Master treatment and his original body dies, with him in a new one, or something like that. Yeah, Tennant did regenerate, just apparently chucked the excess energy that would have made him change into his own extra hand, so fair enough. Good luck explaining that during a christmas special though, although knowing Moffat he just won't bother. I like the Trenzalore being the death of his first body idea but I don't think it really fits with the whole "fall of the eleventh" prophecy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
protar Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 I'd say that Tennant's first regeneration definitely counts as if he hadn't done it he would have died. So even though he didn't change faces/personality it still should have taken up a whole regeneration. McGann's regeneration into Hurt gives them a fair amount of wiggle room as it was artificially induced and not via Timelord tech. If they want the last life thing to be part of Capaldi's story arc they can discount Hurt's regen, or if they want to address the issue in the Christmas Special they can count it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveSumm Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 It seems hard to believe they'd mention 13 Doctors so prominently in the 50th, plus Moffat's quote someone posted a few pages back about how careful they've been numbering them, only to reveal a random throw back to a Tennant episode throws the whole thing out of whack. If they want to give Capaldi more regenerations in the Christmas special they still can, it doesn't have to be an urgent matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 If you cloned a Timelord and stuck his memories in the clone - would he get more lives? This is an interesting one and falls squarely into the 'writer can make up whatever he wants' answer :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted November 25, 2013 Author Share Posted November 25, 2013 At first I assumed the 10 years was from their perspective, but at times they return and time has passed, plus in the Dinosaur episode Rory reminds his father he's 31, and the Ponds were born in 1989. So unless Kate knew the Doctor was meeting her out of order and pretended it was their first time, it's an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 This is an interesting one and falls squarely into the 'writer can make up whatever he wants' answer :) It's an easy fix but I guess they'd all be doing it if it were that easy. Maybe Tim Baker Doctor was cloned during the 70s by UNIT and that's why we saw an ancient one in the gallery? Although you have to be careful with clones - it took a decade for Spider-man to recover from the damage his caused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felice Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 Rory tells the Doctor that they've been travelling with him for ten years, which would make it 2020. It's totally logical but almost certainly not what Moffat intended. But then, UNIT dating has always been a bit complicated, as referenced in the special - "in the Seventies or Eighties, depending on the dating protocol used". Though acknowledging the discrepancies is a long way from explaining them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Visenya Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 I just watched a Sylvester Mcoy episode on Netflix, God the old ones are awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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