Valens Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Is it simply because they are neighbours and not of the same race and because Dorne has always been autonomous? Or is there something more to it perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minsc Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 They are neighbors thus it would be there lands that came under attack from Dornish raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The hairy bear Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 1) Cultural differences 2) Dorne is the last reign to be incorporated to the Iron Throne, so there is a shorter common history (or a longer story of warring) 3) The failed conquest of Dorne of Daeron I is just 140 ago. it had everything to consolidate mutual loathing on both sides: unprovoked aggressions, betrayals, deceptions, deaths of charismatic leaders,... 4) Daeron II's favouritism towards Dorne is seen by many (specially in the Reach) as one of the main factors that lead to the Blackfyre Rebellions, with terrible effects to the realm. 5) In the last war the Reach and Dorne were on the same side, but only the Reach fully committed to it. Even though the Princess consort of Dragonstone was a Martell, the reachmen fought at Ashford and besieged Storm's End, while the Dornishmen didn't appear until the Trident (and only because Aerys was blackmailing them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fossoway Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 5 minutes ago, The hairy bear said: 1) Cultural differences 2) Dorne is the last reign to be incorporated to the Iron Throne, so there is a shorter common history (or a longer story of warring) 3) The failed conquest of Dorne of Daeron I is just 140 ago. it had everything to consolidate mutual loathing on both sides: unprovoked aggressions, betrayals, deceptions, deaths of charismatic leaders,... 4) Daeron II's favouritism towards Dorne is seen by many (specially in the Reach) as one of the main factors that lead to the Blackfyre Rebellions, with terrible effects to the realm. 5) In the last war the Reach and Dorne were on the same side, but only the Reach fully committed to it. Even though the Princess consort of Dragonstone was a Martell, the reachmen fought at Ashford and besieged Storm's End, while the Dornishmen didn't appear until the Trident (and only because Aerys was blackmailing them). Well, put it that way and now I too hate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valens Posted April 30, 2016 Author Share Posted April 30, 2016 9 minutes ago, King Merrett I Frey said: Well, put it that way and now I too hate them. Yeah...I used to like them because they are different, but now. They are quite vile, aren't they? I hate the fact they use poisons, that's so unworthy, so villainish. And the series didn't help me like them more recently, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fossoway Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 8 minutes ago, Valens said: Yeah...I used to like them because they are different, but now. They are quite vile, aren't they? I hate the fact they use poisons, that's so unworthy, so villainish. And the series didn't help me like them more recently, lol. I do like them. They are, apart from the North, the most culturally diverse region in the kingdoms. And as for poisons, it's good too, since to attack with poison requires poisons, which means either the ability to make them (subversive knowledge), to acquire them (subversive influences) and to employ it (stealth and a damn fine sense of alert), which makes them the poison use all good for me. I think that the simplistic view the stormlanders and reachmen have on the dornish is that the one you have on the weird kid in class, which makes you feel uncomfortable but yet strangely interested. Dornish rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Redwyne Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Dornishmen also: - sacked highgarden and destroyed oakenseat, ancestral throne of gardener kings. - produced wyl of wyl who was famous from his cruelty during first dornish war and chopping right hands of his prisoners. - killed lyonel tyrell via scorpion trap. - murdered king daeron i under peace panner and stole his crown. - and many more things during both first dornish war and conquest of dorne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Frasier of House Crane Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 They watched the show, I guess. Seriously, though, there are skirmishes along their borders all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minstral Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Kind of like asking why the English and French hated each other prior to the 21st century. They were at war with each other more times than they were at peace throughout their history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 1 hour ago, Minstral said: Kind of like asking why the English and French hated each other prior to the 21st century. They were at war with each other more times than they were at peace throughout their history. I'm sure many still do. Some feelings are hard to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Martell Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 3 hours ago, JCRB's Honeypot said: I'm sure many still do. Some feelings are hard to die. There are people in the middle east who are still butthurt about the crusades Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
239JMFL34109 Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 It is a generational conflict going back thousands of years for resources. Things like those people dying in targ wars trying to take dorne probably didn't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtree Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 8 hours ago, Valens said: Yeah...I used to like them because they are different, but now. They are quite vile, aren't they? I hate the fact they use poisons, that's so unworthy, so villainish. And the series didn't help me like them more recently, lol. Olenna used poison, do you hate the Reach too? Dorne in the past had always been relatively quiet unless the other roused them up, a stark king who invaded andalos was a lot worse and more cruel by miles compared to what the Dornish did. I can't help but wonder if the Reacg hate comes from "we have more than them but they kept beating us" mentality, i mean truly, Reach is richer and more powerful by million miles but Dorne had always beat them. Unreasonable hate is bound to happen, it's their ego talking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of the West Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 8 hours ago, Minstral said: Kind of like asking why the English and French hated each other prior to the 21st century. They were at war with each other more times than they were at peace throughout their history. Exactly Or why Swedes and Danes used to hate each other, or Germans and French, Russians and Poles (I think...). They've been at each other many times and as such they build up long rivalries that goes deep into their cultures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Jeffrey Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Men from the Reach and Dornishmen are natural enemies. Like Englishmen and Scots! Or Welshmen and Scots! Or Japanese and Scots! Or Scots and other Scots! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paxter Redwyne Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 2 hours ago, redtree said: Olenna used poison, do you hate the Reach too? Dorne in the past had always been relatively quiet unless the other roused them up, a stark king who invaded andalos was a lot worse and more cruel by miles compared to what the Dornish did. I can't help but wonder if the Reacg hate comes from "we have more than them but they kept beating us" mentality, i mean truly, Reach is richer and more powerful by million miles but Dorne had always beat them. Unreasonable hate is bound to happen, it's their ego talking Using one person for entire country is bad example. And i doubt that people hate dornishmen just because they use poisons. Dornishmen can also be cruel. they raided reach during garth greybeard reign, destroyed ancestral throne of gardener kings, killed him (or mercy killed him as they say), and sacked it from all its wealth,while other dornish force have did same thing with oldtown. They also were noted to organise raids on dornish marches even during peacetime (when they have been independent). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lal Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 14 hours ago, Valens said: Is it simply because they are neighbours and not of the same race and because Dorne has always been autonomous? Or is there something more to it perhaps? Dorne should have sent them some of their wine and lemons, sorted it all out by establishing trade but where's the fun in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lal Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 In AFOC Arys Oakheart thinks about killing Dornishmen when he is in Sunspear. The Oakhearts are descendants of the gardener kings. It is not just the north that remembers and the mistrust must be deeply entrenched!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valens Posted May 1, 2016 Author Share Posted May 1, 2016 3 hours ago, Paxter Redwyne said: Using one person for entire country is bad example. And i doubt that people hate dornishmen just because they use poisons. Dornishmen can also be cruel. they raided reach during garth greybeard reign, destroyed ancestral throne of gardener kings, killed him (or mercy killed him as they say), and sacked it from all its wealth,while other dornish force have did same thing with oldtown. They also were noted to organise raids on dornish marches even during peacetime (when they have been independent). Thank you! I wanted to reply to that, but it's better I didn't have to. It might have been unpleasant, lol. I mean, that's just a dumb dumb thing to say. ONE person in The Reach doesn't represent the entire kingdom, which is otherwise known for breeding chivalrous and brave and honourable men. And the Dornishmen are cruel, yes. They are "colorful" but that doesn't excuse their wrongdoings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtree Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 4 hours ago, Paxter Redwyne said: Using one person for entire country is bad example. And i doubt that people hate dornishmen just because they use poisons. Dornishmen can also be cruel. they raided reach during garth greybeard reign, destroyed ancestral throne of gardener kings, killed him (or mercy killed him as they say), and sacked it from all its wealth,while other dornish force have did same thing with oldtown. They also were noted to organise raids on dornish marches even during peacetime (when they have been independent). Exactly, using only 1 person is a bad example. Oberyn used poison on his enemy who raped and killed his sister and her children, and then who else ? That specific statement is made for the poster i replied to btw Was it terrible to raid ? Yes, but almost every single region has that occurance as a part of their history. North=Theon Stark, cooking children and stuff Westerland=Tywin Lannister Iron Island=possibly every single of their ruler because raiding is their tradition Riverland=Hoster Tully Vale=Rape of Sistermen Reach=Siege of Tumbleton 1 and 2, Siege of Spicetown Stormland= no recorded history 16 minutes ago, Valens said: Thank you! I wanted to reply to that, but it's better I didn't have to. It might have been unpleasant, lol. I mean, that's just a dumb dumb thing to say. ONE person in The Reach doesn't represent the entire kingdom, which is otherwise known for breeding chivalrous and brave and honourable men. And the Dornishmen are cruel, yes. They are "colorful" but that doesn't excuse their wrongdoings. Yes those honorable and brave men also committed siege of Tumbleton twice (to the point that prince Daeron was so disgusted by the cruelty he ordered them to stop but apparently those honorable men told him to chillax because it was how war is supposed to be), and Siege of Spicetown. Spicetown was noted to be a bigger trading port compared to KL yet the green killed EVERYONE. They also burnt almost every single building including High Tide, the seat of Velaryon. The damage was so devastating that it couldn't be rebuilt You're right this is unpleasant, using reason to hate Dornish because they raid (even though almost everyone have raided) and because they use poison (um, only Oberyn used poison so far) is a clear double standard and a dumb dumb thing to say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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