[Spoilers] Rant and Rave without Reprecussions - Season 6 Edition

[TepidHands]

36 minutes ago, Valetudo said:

s05e03, Roose and LF discussion:

"A message for you from Cersei Lannister.
A rider arrived from the Eyrie shortly before dawn.
Apparently she thinks you're still in the Vale."

So people in the Vale knew that he was at Winterfell, but this season they just forgot about it.

Another error to add into the mix, lol.

Thanks... I knew something  was awry with that Royce thing, since a message to the Vale somehow wound up in the North. 

And yeah, what happened  to the Vale knights (the ones that escaped Brienne). They were with LF and Sansa when they arrived at Winterfell and left with LF, IIRC (and I may not; I was self medicating to get through S5). Where'd they go? 

[Le Cygne]

LF made them an offer they couldn't refuse? Off screen, of course. 

Backed by... what? He will taunt them in front of Sweetrobin?

[Cas Stark]

5 minutes ago, Valetudo said:

About Cersei's message to LF, this only shows us once again that they really don't plan anything in advance.

They had this goal of getting Sansa in Winterfell,so they decided that LF should take her on a trip.

Since LF could not tell to Royce what he was going to do without risking some sort of rebellion, he told him he was going to the Fingers.

But then they needed a reason for LF to quit Winterfell, so they invented this "message from Cersei"

 Problem: Cersei can't know that he is at Winterfell, so her message must go to the Eyrie, because that's where she thinks he is. OK, logic. But the rest of the explanation doesn't make sense, so they handwaved it with the "a rider came from the Eyrie" line, hoping that the audience wouldn't think about it. Lets look at the problems about that explanation:

-The message goes to the Eyrie (by Raven, I presume). But they've already quit the Eyrie. Does a Maester and some riders stay there during Winter to receive messages and transmit them? We could believe that Roose said the rider came from the Eyrie instead of saying that it came from the Vale, but that's just sloppy writing then.

-The message reaches the Vale, and a rider is sent to transmit it. But people at the Vale believe that LF is at the Fingers. How did this rider know that he is at Winterfell? At that time, we could honeypot that Royce discovered that LF was not going to the fingers because he passed through the gates of the Moon or something. Not really believable, but not impossible

-It's now Season 6, and they need a reason for Royce to send his troops to Winterfell with LF. Here comes the "Boltons kidnapped her" plan!

For this, we need to forget everything about last season. Either Royce knew that he was going to Winterfell, and so sent the rider there, or he didn't, and so the rider arriving at Winterfell is impossible. Or do we have to believe that LF bribed the Maesters, the riders,... in order to receive hypothetical messages that could arrive at the Vale???? Same thing with the Knights that went with him, are they corrupt too? But since this happened last season, they assume that everybody forgot about it.

And, as if by magic, no critic remembers about that kind of stuff! lol

They don't plan anything in advance and worse, they NEVER remember what they did before. They've done this over and over again.  They change something [black haired beauty], and then forget [3 children you shall have].  LF gets a message from the Vale last year, where this year, nobody knows he was there in WF

But then that whole thing is nuts anyway.  Where the fuck has LF been since Sansa was kidnapped?  It's been MONTHS.  Yet, he rolls up, months later, oh yeah, she was kidnapped, my bad, I forgot to send a raven....and that isn't even getting into the nonsenical concept that a huge Bolton squad of Ramsay ninjas could get all the way to the Fingers and back out w/no witnesses.  

It only works if you watch the scene as if whatever they're saying is true.  And you, like the characters, must forget everything until the next scene, it's like everyone wakes up in a new Westeros every time we see them, there is no telling if what we saw last week or season is still part of the universe or if that was a parallel universe and now it's different.

 

[Morvius]

4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

They don't plan anything in advance and worse, they NEVER remember what they did before. They've done this over and over again.  They change something [black haired beauty], and then forget [3 children you shall have].  LF gets a message from the Vale last year, where this year, nobody knows he was there in WF

But then that whole thing is nuts anyway.  Where the fuck has LF been since Sansa was kidnapped?  It's been MONTHS.  Yet, he rolls up, months later, oh yeah, she was kidnapped, my bad, I forgot to send a raven....and that isn't even getting into the nonsenical concept that a huge Bolton squad of Ramsay ninjas could get all the way to the Fingers and back out w/no witnesses.  

It only works if you watch the scene as if whatever they're saying is true.  And you, like the characters, must forget everything until the next scene, it's like everyone wakes up in a new Westeros every time we see them, there is no telling if what we saw last week or season is still part of the universe or if that was a parallel universe and now it's different.

 

Hey. Those Ramsay ninjas destroyed an army's entire supply of food!

Anyway on that point. Another thing that I found annoying. Melisandre proclaiming Jon to be the Prince that was Promised because he was resurrected. Erm...why not Beric then? Or why not TRY reviving Stannis first?

[kissdbyfire]

1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

This is amazing and he gets 1000 points from me with the Archer reference.

I love his recaps, it's one thing to look forward to every week! Also, love his nicknames for Jorah and Daario: Stonehenge and Fuckboy!

[Valetudo]

29 minutes ago, Morvius said:

Hey. Those Ramsay ninjas destroyed an army's entire supply of food!

Anyway on that point. Another thing that I found annoying. Melisandre proclaiming Jon to be the Prince that was Promised because he was resurrected. Erm...why not Beric then? Or why not TRY reviving Stannis first?

Because she didn't had a man explaining her what to do when Stannis died, lol. (And lets not forget that she had already abandoned him before the battle, showing us how much she believed in him in the first place.)

Women on top!

[Chebyshov]

52 minutes ago, Valetudo said:

About Cersei's message to LF, this only shows us once again that they really don't plan anything in advance.

They had this goal of getting Sansa in Winterfell,so they decided that LF should take her on a trip.

Since LF could not tell to Royce what he was going to do without risking some sort of rebellion, he told him he was going to the Fingers.

But then they needed a reason for LF to quit Winterfell, so they invented this "message from Cersei"

 Problem: Cersei can't know that he is at Winterfell, so her message must go to the Eyrie, because that's where she thinks he is. OK, logic. But the rest of the explanation doesn't make sense, so they handwaved it with the "a rider came from the Eyrie" line, hoping that the audience wouldn't think about it. Lets look at the problems about that explanation:

-The message goes to the Eyrie (by Raven, I presume). But they've already quit the Eyrie. Does a Maester and some riders stay there during Winter to receive messages and transmit them? We could believe that Roose said the rider came from the Eyrie instead of saying that it came from the Vale, but that's just sloppy writing then.

-The message reaches the Vale, and a rider is sent to transmit it. But people at the Vale believe that LF is at the Fingers. How did this rider know that he is at Winterfell? At that time, we could honeypot that Royce discovered that LF was not going to the fingers because he passed through the gates of the Moon or something. Not really believable, but not impossible

-It's now Season 6, and they need a reason for Royce to send his troops to Winterfell with LF. Here comes the "Boltons kidnapped her" plan!

For this, we need to forget everything about last season. Either Royce knew that he was going to Winterfell, and so sent the rider there, or he didn't, and so the rider arriving at Winterfell is impossible. Or do we have to believe that LF bribed the Maesters, the riders,... in order to receive hypothetical messages that could arrive at the Vale???? Same thing with the Knights that went with him, are they corrupt too? But since this happened last season, they assume that everybody forgot about it.

And, as if by magic, no critic remembers about that kind of stuff! lol

This is really a perfect microcosm of how the show is planned. Their writing betrays an utter lack of care.

[A Ghost of Someone]

5 hours ago, Le Cygne said:

See, but that's a dumb question, because she knew about Ramsay. The whole world knew about Ramsay.

LF pimped her out then left her with the Boltons, they killed her family, and wanted to rape her for an heir, then kill her, too.

They even had Myranda spell it out... Only an insane person would have thought it would end any differently.

It was a terrible, nonsense thing for the show runners to do. it has now also carried over and ruined Rickon's story. It takes some messed up thoughts to think that putting Sansa through that was a good creative idea.

[sweetsunray]

30 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

I love his recaps, it's one thing to look forward to every week! Also, love his nicknames for Jorah and Daario: Stonehenge and Fuckboy!

Stonehenge made me laugh too when I read his recap. It was a hilarious read as a whole.

[Cas Stark]

Just now, sweetsunray said:

Stonehenge made me laugh too when I read his recap. It was a hilarious read as a whole.

Those recaps are fantastic.  Bobcut is my favorite nickname, for the 'not waif' who beats Arya with a stick when she lies or some shit.  LOL.

After someone posted one of his recaps I went back and read every single one, for every season.  Time well spent.

[Prince of the North]

1 hour ago, Morvius said:

I need your help! After watching episode 3, I was telling my friend that the High Sparrow and Tommen speech is emblematic of the nonversations the characters have in this show. Because Tommen goes in to demand that his mother be free, and the High Sparrow doesn't answer him and instead talks about mother's love. And then they randomly jump to quotes on how a wise ruler needs wise counsellors. However, he claims that the High Sparrow is being devious and this shows that Tommen is naive.
But at the moment, for the life of me, I can't remember any other specific instances of nonversations throughout the series (though I know there were quite a few).

Hmm...I can't think of a lot right now either but...would "Beetles" qualify?

[SuperMario]

54 minutes ago, Morvius said:

Hey. Those Ramsay ninjas destroyed an army's entire supply of food!

Anyway on that point. Another thing that I found annoying. Melisandre proclaiming Jon to be the Prince that was Promised because he was resurrected. Erm...why not Beric then? Or why not TRY reviving Stannis first?

The first rule of Stannis Club is don't talk about Stannis club. Davos enacted that rule. And if anyone attempts to break said rule....BRIENNE SMASH!

[sweetsunray]

6 minutes ago, Prince of the North said:

Hmm...I can't think of a lot right now either but...would "Beetles" qualify?

Yup, Beetles, Ladder, Power is power, nothing is nothing. Word salad - words thrown together that sound incromprehensibly intellectual but mean nothing. For personal reasons I've grown allergic to such speeches and exposes and explanations. I just can't make any effort to try and understand it, because I know it's just words jumbled together with no meaning at all really. And I know it's not because I cannot comprehend English or even intellectual mumbo-jumbo. I just know it means zilch.

 

[kissdbyfire]

1 minute ago, sweetsunray said:

Yup, Beetles, Ladder, Power is power, nothing is nothing. Word salad - words thrown together that sound incromprehensibly intellectual but mean nothing. For personal reasons I've grown allergic to such speeches and exposes and explanations. I just can't make any effort to try and understand it, because I know it's just words jumbled together with no meaning at all really. And I know it's not because I cannot comprehend English or even intellectual mumbo-jumbo. I just know it means zilch.

 

Yeah, and these "speeches" are all boring and annoying as hell on top of being faux philosophical. I suppose it's all part of the oh so necessary streamlining process!

 

[Prince of the North]

59 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

They don't plan anything in advance and worse, they NEVER remember what they did before. They've done this over and over again.  They change something [black haired beauty], and then forget [3 children you shall have].  LF gets a message from the Vale last year, where this year, nobody knows he was there in WF

But then that whole thing is nuts anyway.  Where the fuck has LF been since Sansa was kidnapped?  It's been MONTHS.  Yet, he rolls up, months later, oh yeah, she was kidnapped, my bad, I forgot to send a raven....and that isn't even getting into the nonsenical concept that a huge Bolton squad of Ramsay ninjas could get all the way to the Fingers and back out w/no witnesses.  

It only works if you watch the scene as if whatever they're saying is true.  And you, like the characters, must forget everything until the next scene, it's like everyone wakes up in a new Westeros every time we see them, there is no telling if what we saw last week or season is still part of the universe or if that was a parallel universe and now it's different.

 

Spot on!  Also, how did Ramsay's 20 Good Men receive intel from their Royce Spy and travel wherever they needed to be to intercept Sansa in such a short time?!  It's mindboggling! 

52 minutes ago, Morvius said:

Hey. Those Ramsay ninjas destroyed an army's entire supply of food!

Anyway on that point. Another thing that I found annoying. Melisandre proclaiming Jon to be the Prince that was Promised because he was resurrected. Erm...why not Beric then? Or why not TRY reviving Stannis first?

Also, wouldn't Mel be far more likely to call Jon "Azhor Ahai Reborn" or something rather than "The Prince that was Promised"?  Why is she using dead Rhaegar Targaryen's phrasing that we only saw in one of Dany's visions now rather than, you know, the phrasing she's always been using up until now?

[Prince of the North]

6 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Yup, Beetles, Ladder, Power is power, nothing is nothing. Word salad - words thrown together that sound incromprehensibly intellectual but mean nothing. For personal reasons I've grown allergic to such speeches and exposes and explanations. I just can't make any effort to try and understand it, because I know it's just words jumbled together with no meaning at all really. And I know it's not because I cannot comprehend English or even intellectual mumbo-jumbo. I just know it means zilch.

 

Unfortunately, it's all coming back to me now.  Thanks a lot!  Yes, the High Sparrow's recent blatherings are really top-of-mind right now.  One of my personal favorites was how Cercei's love for Tommen is so incredibly "real" in this world precisely because it doesn't even come from this world at all but from the Mother above!  Let me think about that for a minute...  lolwut?!! 

3 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Yeah, and these "speeches" are all boring and annoying as hell on top of being faux philosophical. I suppose it's all part of the oh so necessary streamlining process!

 

Yep, "streamlining" by expanding the roles of actors they like and making up a bunch of stuff out of whole cloth (Karl Fookin' Tanner and Craster's Keep anyone?  ...anyone?) 

[SuperMario]

6 minutes ago, Prince of the North said:

Spot on!  Also, how did Ramsay's 20 Good Men receive intel from their Royce Spy and travel wherever they needed to be to intercept Sansa in such a short time?!  It's mindboggling! 

Also, wouldn't Mel be far more likely to call Jon "Azhor Ahai Reborn" or something rather than "The Prince that was Promised"?  Why is she using dead Rhaegar Targaryen's phrasing that we only saw in one of Dany's visions now rather than, you know, the phrasing she's always been using up until now?

For the same reason of Willas instead of Walder, Yara instead of Asha, Dorne being the only thing in Dorne instead of Sunspear, and many others I can't think of. The showrunners think their average show watcher is too dumb to remember similar or confusing names. I'm surprised they didn't start giving everyone common English names.

Tyrion = Bill

Euron = Mike

Davos = Steve

Dany = Emma

 

[Ruhail]

18 minutes ago, SuperMario said:

The first rule of Stannis Club is don't talk about Stannis club. Davos enacted that rule. And if anyone attempts to break said rule....BRIENNE SMASH!

[Cas Stark]

Will Mel meet Arya again?  It feels about 50/50.  They could forget she said that, or Mel stays alive until Arya comes back...but that would be keeping Red Dress alive for a long time since it seems like she's going to be in the riverlands where she will meet up with our friend the Hound...and then, I guess they go North?  It would also mean Davos would continue his descent into stupidity, because he won't kill her after he eventually figures out she burned Shireen, whenever that may be....

But who knows really, in a world were Castle Black and Winterfell are two days slow ride, anything is possible.  She could drop in from a balloon with Dorothy's slippers on for all I know.

[kissdbyfire]

11 minutes ago, SuperMario said:

For the same reason of Willas instead of Walder, Yara instead of Asha, Dorne being the only thing in Dorne instead of Sunspear, and many others I can't think of. The showrunners think their average show watcher is too dumb to remember similar or confusing names. I'm surprised they didn't start giving everyone common English names.

Tyrion = Bill

Euron = Mike

Davos = Steve

Dany = Emma

 

LOL

But at the same time, they invent two characters and name them Olly and Olyvar!