Sparrowyn Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 x2 I think a lot of women readers would get frustrated by lack of action girls and overflow of damsels in distress who "reward" Conan for their rescue in non PG rated ways. That being said, I still like the series. I just have to remember that it was written in the 1930s by a not very progressive man. It's pretty much like that across the board for the classic stuff... even worse for the "pulp" era Science Fiction. Short list of SF that has aged well... 1984 - Orwell Dune - Herbert 2001, A Space Odyssey - Clarke The Andromeda Strain - Crichton Downbelow Station - Cherryh Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep - Dick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 How has Nineteen Eighty Four aged well? It's in large part a thinly veiled rant about Stalinism, which (outside North Korea) isn't really applicable any more. The boot stamping on the human face has become an endless series of bread and circuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felice Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 How has Nineteen Eighty Four aged well? It's in large part a thinly veiled rant about Stalinism, which (outside North Korea) isn't really applicable any more. The boot stamping on the human face has become an endless series of bread and circuses. The total surveillance aspect certainly remains relevant today. While the boot might not be coming down too hard right now, Big Brother is most definitely watching us. And bread & circuses for the proles was part of the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparrowyn Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 How has Nineteen Eighty Four aged well? It's in large part a thinly veiled rant about Stalinism, which (outside North Korea) isn't really applicable any more. The boot stamping on the human face has become an endless series of bread and circuses. There is so much more to be gained in the pages of Nineteen Eighty-Four than Orwell simply beating on Comrade Stalin. It's Science Fiction at its very best, as a cautionary tale that was as relevant in 1948 as it was in 1984, and will be in 2084. I don't know of any SF story that was more prophetic than Nineteen Eighty-Four. Julia - "Sometimes," she said, "they threaten you with something – something you can't stand up to, can't even think about. And then you say, 'Don't do it to me, do it to somebody else, do it to so-and-so.' And perhaps you might pretend, afterwards, that it was only a trick and that you just said it to make them stop and didn't really mean it. But that isn't true. At the time when it happens you do mean it. You think there's no other way of saving yourself and you're quite ready to save yourself that way. You want it to happen to the other person. You don't give a damn what they suffer. All you care about is yourself." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datepalm Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Not to mention the uses and control of language and history for political ends. Still utterly relevant. I don't know that "holds up well" as a criterion for a novel necessarily means "could have been written in 2014," wrt to technology, political developments, etc. I know that a book was written in 1957 or whenever when I'm reading it, that's part and parcel. I know I have to keep out a particularly critical eye for gender/race/etc issues. I know it's coming from a certain, now foreign, politics. I know it's technological and scientific assumptions are decades behind. That's all fine. The question is whether, with all this, it's still a good read. Like with any novel, does it manage to transcend it's time and place and go on being a good novel. Novels that don't hold up are ones where the race/gender/stuff is so offensive or ridiculous that it's impossible to see anything else. Or ones that are terribly written and were only readable in their own time by belonging to some relevant trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Oh, there is certainly the surveillance element. Except that Orwell never imagined that it'd be used for entertainment as much as political oppression (can you imagine youtube and the internet in the world of Nineteen Eighty Four? Easily accessible information and instant gratification? Today's world doesn't rely on keeping the population stupid and uninformed; it relies on keeping them distracted and overloaded with trivia). Thought crime isn't punished via "correction", it's punished via being ignored/drowned out by more easily digestible fare. That's why I think Huxley's Brave New World is a much better fit: a world centred around mindless consumption for the sake of consumption, rather than Orwell's gloves-off tyranny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unJon Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Oh definitely agree about Clarke. Not only was he the best writer of the Big Three, he's held up far better than Asimov and Heinlein (at least if you pretend that Clarke stopped writing some time in the 1980s...). And Verne is good for adventure if nothing else. generally agree but I think Heinlein's The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress has held up very well and should be rec'ed in this thread. Surprised it hasn't been mentioned yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serious Callers Only Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 1984 is a bad good book. It's bad reading (animal farm is better imo) but still mostly relevant. Speaking of brave new world, the intro by Huxley from the 1946 edition is interesting reading. Perennialism eh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrienneofQarth Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Ha, I agree. I suppose that from the political correctness point of view Conan hasn't, indeed 'aged well', but I think that some of the original stories are still immensely enjoyable reading. Of the many contributors to Conan after Howard's death, I am not a great fan of the Sprague de Camp/Carter sequels, I do find the portrayal of women in some of Robert Jordan's offerings pretty awful (see esp Conan the Magnificent, think of female characters screaming, think of them naked, think of them screaming, naked, running from monsters.... :frown5:), but I still think that Howard's early stories, especially 'Red Nails', and 'Queen of the Black Coast' definitely worth reading. I suppose this boils down to what 'aging well' really means; as a female reader, I have found unpleasant assumptions about sex and race in a lot of classic fantasy from Howard to Tolkien onwards . Are they still worth reading? I can't say no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerArthurHeath Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 I struggle to see how anyone can think 1984 has aged badly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicked Woodpecker of West Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Except of some really out-dated scientific ideas I wouldn't even count gender/race/class ideas as part of "aging".Last time I was checking leftist liberalism weren't only living social idea. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicked Woodpecker of West Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 I struggle to see how anyone can think 1984 has aged badly I get Leech problems with it but it's still quite living idea. And who knows when masters of the world will decide that mindless consumption isn't the best possible solution ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlingzen Bill Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Alas Babylon by Pat Frank Read Phillip K. Dick's short fiction, a lot of it has held up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seli Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Yeah, am struggling to think of something SF clsssic about the future/space travel/&c. that isn't dicked up by lack of internet. Olaf Stapledon, but that is just because it his works are so weird and that is about it. eta: Atwood's The Handmaid's Tale seems to be surviving well (is it too early to call it classic?) and is staying relevant. Although it perhaps best read as an alternate/divergent universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hielo y Fuego Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 I struggle to see how anyone can think 1984 has aged badly Agreed. Like Huxley's A Brave New World, 1984 was also eerily accurate in some ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anatúrinbor Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Robot series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 This may be just very personal due to the perspective pool out of which it was composed, but to me Samuel R. Delany's Dhalgren feels more pertinent all the time -- minus the two moons. But as climate change kicks into second and even third gear, from here, surrounded by water, from over there, drought and wildfires, series of extreme storms that knock out the power and communications grids, the vast population of homeless, trafficked and abused outside of any support system or recourse -- while still attempting to create beauty, using images and language in ways that seem alien to previous generations, well, these constantly bring back to my mind Dhalgren. It seems prescient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alia Atreides Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 eta: Atwood's The Handmaid's Tale seems to be surviving well (is it too early to call it classic?) and is staying relevant. Although it perhaps best read as an alternate/divergent universe. I was thinking the same on that it might be too early to call a classic just yet by some I would say oh yea; I've read that book several times. The movie adaptation stunk though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 generally agree but I think Heinlein's The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress has held up very well and should be rec'ed in this thread. Surprised it hasn't been mentioned yet. Right, unless your part of the crazy part of the population that's female. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdyphillip Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Here are some of my favorites. They are also not as heralded as some of the "Bigger" works in the genre Stainless Steele Rat - Harry Harrison Gateway - Fredrick Pohl Myth Adventures - Robin Lynn Aspirin Riverworld - Phillip Jose Farmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.