Rhom Posted July 14, 2014 Author Share Posted July 14, 2014 Yeah, I never understood the confusion TBH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Buck Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 TSACast #2 is up, the topic being "Hearts and/or Moenghus", with Madness, myself, and now mrganondorf from the TSA forums. Yeah, I never understood the confusion TBH. I think the confusion stems from there being two seemingly separate entities that were both pretty quickly introduced into the story, and seem similar/the same but with a slight difference. We have the White-Luck Warrior, and the narindari. It seems to me that a White-Luck warrir is by definition also a narindar, but not all (or most) narindar are White-Luck Warriors themselves. They're just assassins that apparently worship Ajokli (though they do have limited future-telling, like the folkish thing with the dove, the narindar are not bestowed with the White-Luck. I don't know, I think I have a working mental system of how this all fits together but it's tough to actually put into words, and I definitely didn't get it on the first go-around (and, really, I'm not positive I even "get" it now). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Yeah, I never understood the confusion TBH. Yeah, I thought it felt like a ripoff of the Dr. Manhattan chapter of Watchmen. Presenting a view of the past and future in an equally omniscient and unemotional tone, complete with a mixture of important facts and irrelevant details as equally important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Not all wlw are narindar, and really none are except when they pretend. The narindar are a religious sect similar to faceless men. Wlw is the will of the gods in walking form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sci-2 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Yeah, I thought it felt like a ripoff of the Dr. Manhattan chapter of Watchmen. Presenting a view of the past and future in an equally omniscient and unemotional tone, complete with a mixture of important facts and irrelevant details as equally important. I really hope this time stuff plays a miniscule role in TUC. The desire [to] offer elaborations on the nature of Time seems to be the bane of SFF authors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I think that's going to be one of the big reveals. We've had more hints about the nature of time and the world than we have about almost anything so far. Between Mimara's present tense, WLW, the gods and how they perceive time and events, Akka's prophecy stuff and views going into Seswatha and Nau-Cayuti, the prophecy hints by the Consult - all of it points to some deterministic future oddities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unJon Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I really hope this time stuff plays a miniscule role in TUC. The desire [to] offer elaborations on the nature of Time seems to be the bane of SFF authors. Don't take this the wrong way, but when did you turn sour on Bakker, Sci? Feel like you didn't post for a long time then you cam back very anti on certain parts of the series. I'm more curious whether there was a tipping point for you, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Man, this next book is either going to be the best book ever or make me burn all my previous Bakker books. (nah I don't burn books) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callan S. Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I didn't read it as a trade of youth to Psatma? I assumed the whole thing showed the return to youth was a big ass miracle - that were seeing the biggies at play, because sorcery cannot heal - and here we don't just have healing, but rejuvination! Yatwers all 'you need to be young to do this thing I want - so bang, you're young!' What did I miss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wise Fool Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I thought it was basically just a divine-sorcery enabled glamour, and that Psatma is still an old crone, while also being an agent of Yatwer. Very much like Kellhhus's haloes being divine-sorcery, that is to say, "cleric spells" as opposed to Mark-requiring mage spells. So yeah, the Fanim warlord dude is banging an old woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sci-2 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Don't take this the wrong way, but when did you turn sour on Bakker, Sci? Feel like you didn't post for a long time then you cam back very anti on certain parts of the series. I'm more curious whether there was a tipping point for you, etc. Huh? I've always been critical of the time stuff. And I've only got three five posts since my return - one telling a dude not to be down on himself, one pretending to be Cnauir logging into 4chan, one saying the Dunyain are trying to achieve Nagel's View From Nowere, one complimenting artwork, and that last one worried about TUC having too much time shenanigans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I read it as an age/strength transfer from Psatma to the WLW, it's her giving the gift of the strength and wisdom of age rather than receiving a gift. She's the high priestess of Yatwer, giving is what she does not receiving.Read her thoughts from that passage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Yeah, it explicitly talks about him getting the aged wisdom and strength. About calluses and muscle and lines. Her getting younger was not the reason she did it - it was to make him older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diziet Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Did this clear it up for you? Yeah, thanks. Yeah, I never understood the confusion TBH. I guess I was just not reading carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diziet Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 TSACast #2 is up, the topic being "Hearts and/or Moenghus", with Madness, myself, and now mrganondorf from the TSA forums. Regarding Cishaurim dispensing sorcery from their brow and Moenghus's eyes lighting up. He was burning from the Chorae, which is different from regular sorcery? If his eyesockets are empty and his body is burning from the inside out it seem natural for his eyes to shine. If he did fake his death I think it had something to do with Cnaiur. "I need your strength" seems like a very strange line for him to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madness Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 You might want to check out my post about the episode at SA, SBH. But on Cishaurim - I've maintained many times in these very threads (as have others) that there is no instance of Cishaurim salting (hence my Rapture commentary in the episode). EDIT: Zadok also makes similar commentary to yours below mine in that thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anatúrinbor Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I don't know if he faked his death or not (I hope not,) but I thought the "I need your strength" and what followed had something to do with Cnaiur's Swazond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anatúrinbor Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 You might want to check out my post about the episode at SA, SBH.those two really helped me fall into my previous tracks of thinking, most of which are just wrong ;)So I take it he didn't fake his death? Thank god. Also, you saying "Moe II is obviously not Kellhus's child", I took that as confirmation that he is his son. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madness Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Lol, the beauty of my position is that I can lie outright :). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I'm stalking all of you! OOGEY BOOGEY BOOGEY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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