joint bank accounts, any negatives i should be aware of?

[DreamSongs]

The only thing that I would recommend to the OP is a thorough examination of what goes out every month and make it as equal as possible. Both parties then contribute to the joint fund and maintain their own private accounts. One party may want something that is not an absolute necessity (for example: an apartment two blocks from work vs. an apartment 5 miles away on mass transit) and should be willing to pay the additional expense. Once there is a child involved, the accounts change. The person most likely to be providing childcare is the mother and everything ('fun' money, personal checking accounts) should be equal because a stay-at-home parent is equally entitled to the same benefits a full-time worker is...except the working partner needs to provide those benefits.

[A wilding]

I can understand how people with very different financial habits might like different accounts to reduce tension between spendthrifts and penny-pinching, check-book balancers, but that difference actually exists in your actual marriage, which is a lot bigger than a monthly bank statement. The bank account doesn't change that, it only becomes a way for the OCD partner to keep score, if they are so inclined. If you've married them and accepted them for who they are, it shouldn't be a source of friction, it should just make you shake your head and chuckle at their fiscally irresponsible cuteness.

As this does feel a little aimed at me, I will say as an anecdotal counter example that while I might be OCD, Mrs W is definitely not a spendthrift! I do indeed quite happlly shake my head and chuckle at her fiscally irresponsible cuteness, from the safe distance of knowing that my account still has cash in it, whatever she does.

It is certainly not a matter of trust - for complex tax reasons relating to who she works for, a lot of "my" money is in her name.

Of course it helps that we are not particualry financially squeezed, and her misjudgments are merely a matter of cash flow. I imagine that if things were tighter I would take more of a grip on our joint finances, Mrs W always says she would be happy for me to do so, but I would feel I was being a bit controlling.

[Ice Queen]

As this does feel a little aimed at me, I will say as an anecdotal counter example that while I might be OCD, Mrs W is definitely not a spendthrift! I do indeed quite happlly shake my head and chuckle at her fiscally irresponsible cuteness, from the safe distance of knowing that my account still has cash in it, whatever she does.

It is certainly not a matter of trust - for complex tax reasons relating to who she works for, a lot of "my" money is in her name.

Of course it helps that we are not particualry financially squeezed, and her misjudgments are merely a matter of cash flow. I imagine that if things were tighter I would take more of a grip on our joint finances, Mrs W always says she would be happy for me to do so, but I would feel I was being a bit controlling.

Don't feel controlling! After my ex overdrafted our brand new joint account, I took control of the checkbook because I ended up dishing out a lot of money from my savings to cover HIS mistake. Which wasn't really a mistake, it was pure laziness. I asked him where all the receipts were for his purchases and he went to his car and handed me a stack about 2 inches thick...that were never recorded in the checkbook. Which he knew was in the top drawer of the desk.

And then I took his bank card and shredded it. The way I saw it, if I'm the one dishing out money to cover you and my name is on that account, you don't get to spend money the way you want.

Of course, this was before internet banking. Nowadays, there is absolutely no reason to overdraft your account. None whatsoever.

When my almost 18 year old started working when she was 16, we got her a bank account that didn't include checks. That would have been a disaster. Because she's a minor, it's in my name with her as the secondary. I've spent the last 2 years trying to teach her to use a checkbook register. She's overdrafted twice--the first one was for $70 plus fees. I covered it, but the minute she got paid I hit "transfer funds" right out of her account into mine. She nearly had a fit. The second time was for $1.99. She checked her balance at a non-approved ATM and the transaction fee put her into overdraft. I sat her down and explained to her how that worked and how it could spiral out of control very quickly. And then on payday took the money out of her account to cover what I spent.

She hasn't overdrafted since.

It's our responsibility as parents to teach our kids financial responsibility. It's even more important when you're on a tight budget because you can't afford to over by a penny.

[Chaldanya]

Iskaral et al, do me a favour and take your befuddlement and condescension about other people's financial arrangements elsewhere.

I'm married and have been with himself for 7 years. We do not have a joint account. Due to the way the bills fall they all come out of my account and they when he gets paid he gives me his half. We take it in turns for grocery shopping and getting petrol. We have a savings target and then beyond that what he does with his money is entirely his business and what I do with mine is my business. All a joint account would do is mean that we would have to change all bill payments and transfer money between accounts and that's just another level of admin for the sake of it and has nothing to do with whether either one of us trusts the other financially.

N

[Cuellar]

Unlike joint bank accounts, I see no upside to both spouses being jointly liable for a credit card (or something like an auto loan) when an authorized user card can allows access to the credit. Specifically, in states where a married couple can hold their house in tenants by the entireties, a creditor could attach the family house to satisfy a judgment for joint debt but not necessarily a debt held only in one spouse's name.

I'd agree on this. Credit scores are usually based on 1 person too, and 1 fuck up can destroy both people's credit. Unless your spouse has bad credit, generally you can easily maintain separate credit cards. I'd VERY HIGHLY RECOMMEND everyone sit down and run a credit report on your spouse every year so you know what each other's real debt is.

The other thing with CCs are that you both are eligible for sign up bonuses, but that's a tale for another thread.

For those married couples without joint accounts, how do you make decisions around who pays what? What if one person isn't saving for retirement? Who's paying for health insurance? What are you going to do if you lose your job? What if one person makes a shit load more money? What if one of you needs to pay for an MBA or something that will help make more money in the future but costs money now? What if one person's 401k contribution is better than the other?

I guess it's hard for me to understand other couples since my wife and I are both CPAs, so we do all over financial planning as 1 unit. For me marrying someone who wasn't financially responsible was not even a consideration.

[Chaldanya]

For those married couples without joint accounts, how do you make decisions around who pays what? What if one person isn't saving for retirement? Who's paying for health insurance? What are you going to do if you lose your job? What if one person makes a shit load more money? What if one of you needs to pay for an MBA or something that will help make more money in the future but costs money now? What if one person's 401k contribution is better than the othe

This. This is going to blow your mind! Hold on.

We. Communicate. With. Each. Other. That's it, that's all there is to it.

If I were to lose my job tomorrow, we'd tuck in our belts use our savings and be fine. I don't understand how that is materially different from having a joint account. By the end of the year, me, himself and Squidgey will have been on eight trips from short to long - we planned and budgeted for them and not once was having a joint account an issue.

Here's what I don't understand; why some people who do have joint accounts think it's the holy grail of being in a couple.

Also, I'm not wild about the implication that if you don't have a joint account you're not financially responsible - you probably didn't mean it but you may want to watch your phrasing.

By Odin's Holy Beard you'd think we were aliens from another planet or something...

N

[Shryke]

This. This is going to blow your mind! Hold on.

We. Communicate. With. Each. Other. That's it, that's all there is to it.

If I were to lose my job tomorrow, we'd tuck in our belts use our savings and be fine. I don't understand how that is materially different from having a joint account. By the end of the year, me, himself and Squidgey will have been on eight trips from short to long - we planned and budgeted for them and not once was having a joint account an issue.

Here's what I don't understand; why some people who do have joint accounts think it's the holy grail of being in a couple.

Also, I'm not wild about the implication that if you don't have a joint account you're not financially responsible - you probably didn't mean it but you may want to watch your phrasing.

By Odin's Holy Beard you'd think we were aliens from another planet or something...

N

Considering like 99% of the reasons people stated in this thread for why they don't have one amount to a lack of trust in the other person's ability to handle money or something similar, I'm not sure why you find the comments from the joint-account people so strange.

[Chaldanya]

Considering like 99% of the reasons people stated in this thread for why they don't have one amount to a lack of trust in the other person's ability to handle money or something similar, I'm not sure why you find the comments from the joint-account people so strange.

Not once in my post did I mention trust.

And if you'd read my post you would have seen precisely why I find some of the attitudes to those of use in relationships that don't have joint bank accounts distasteful and odd. But just in case I'll distill it down for you:

1) In a couple I would expect communication around finance regardless of bank account status.

2) Just because one doesn't have a joint bank account doesn't make one fiscally irresponsible

and

3) Why is having a joint bank account so damned important that it seems that people don't understand how one can operate with separate accounts

Does that help?

And not for nothing but this level of 'not-understanding' just feels like another way to audit someone else's relationship.

N

[A wilding]

Considering like 99% of the reasons people stated in this thread for why they don't have one amount to a lack of trust in the other person's ability to handle money or something similar, I'm not sure why you find the comments from the joint-account people so strange.

I think the confusion here might be in a distinction between the macro level and the micro level.

Do I trust Mrs W not to blow 10K plus on something silly? Absolutely.

Am I confident that when she pays for our next holiday out of her money that she will make sure that it does not push her account into the red by the end of the month? Probably not.

If Mrs W finds it tedious and stressful to keep track of her exact current account balance, I am fine with us having to pay an occasional overdraft fee if she is happier that way. But as I am "OCD" I need to know exactly what is in my current account. So, separate accounts. Simple.

[Frog Eater]

Cueller: as a couple who maintains separate bank accounts and as a CPA, I pay most of the household bills (mortgage, utilities, car note, insurance) and my wife pays for after school care and groceries and clothes for the kids. She also pays for health insurance for the kids since it is much cheaper through her work than mine. I contribute much more to my 401(k) than she does, but I also make more. She usually ends up with more discretionary spending money than I do.

I would think a joint account would be much more difficult to maintain, and lead to a lot more disagreements about money. My wife and I have no disagreements about money. ever.

[Tears of Lys]

As MC said, "thankful neither of us has married a thieving deceitful shithead"...well, as you know, divorce changes things. I always thought Ex2 was very on the up and up, and he always said if he ever left me, he'd never want anything. Well, he decides he wants out, all of a sudden he's threatening me for going after half of everything I have and demanding $17k to go away.

Man, he's bought off cheap, I'd say.

I know, right? That's what a mistress is for.

:slaps Shryke upside the head:

Joint account here. It works for us.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

My wife and I have completely shared finances and I honestly couldn't imagine doing it any other way (in fact, I did exactly what I would counsel all of my clients NOT to do - which was merge almost all of our finances even before we were married.)

However, I would estimate that well over 50% of my clients do NOT have completely shared finances. A significant majority maintain some form of partially-separated finances. A surprisingly large minority (mostly cases where one spouse doesn't work) just have zero idea about the other person's finances.

[Weeping Sore]

I'm not sure people are aware that since 2010 in the U.S. it is impossible to get an overdraft fee from debit card activity alone. (You can still get overdraft fees on checks and recurring automatic debits (like Netflix or gym memberships) or online bill pays).

So it makes sense to have one joint account for bills that both partners' direct deposits go into, and then separate spending accounts with attached debit cards. Since bills are more or less predictable, you have to leave a set amount in the bill account to cover everything, and then transfer the excess into one (joint) or two (individual) spending accounts, depending on how you want to do it. Again, If the (spending) account only has debit card activity, the worst that can happen is the card declines, you can't get an overdraft fee by law.

[Eponine]

For those married couples without joint accounts, how do you make decisions around who pays what? What if one person isn't saving for retirement? Who's paying for health insurance? What are you going to do if you lose your job? What if one person makes a shit load more money? What if one of you needs to pay for an MBA or something that will help make more money in the future but costs money now? What if one person's 401k contribution is better than the other?

We split rent 50/50 and take turns paying for anything else that comes up (we don't keep close track, I have a general idea in the back of my mind about who's taken on more expenses lately).

My retirement savings are a lot more than his, largely due to a 7 year age difference. The only way I wouldn't retire first would be if he quickly made a whole shitton of money, in which case, these concerns would be moot. There's no reason that he won't be able to save a comparable amount in his own accounts over time. If I died, he'd get a decent chunk of money. If we divorced, he wouldn't be financially set back any more than if he'd never been married.

My work covers spousal health insurance at no additional charge.

If I lost my job for more than a few months at this point (not likely on either count), I'd take out a personal loan. (I had to use most of my previous savings to deal with a rental disaster that I've mentioned on the board before). We'll both cover each other as much as possible without keeping track, but his income wouldn't cover both of us indefinitely at this point.

I make more money and have more outflows.

There will be no more college degrees. None. I have two masters and he's working on his PhD with full funding.

See retirement savings part.

[deleted01]

I'm not sure people are aware that since 2010 in the U.S. it is impossible to get an overdraft fee from debit card activity alone. (You can still get overdraft fees on checks and recurring automatic debits (like Netflix or gym memberships) or online bill pays).

So it makes sense to have one joint account for bills that both partners' direct deposits go into, and then separate spending accounts with attached debit cards. Since bills are more or less predictable, you have to leave a set amount in the bill account to cover everything, and then transfer the excess into one (joint) or two (individual) spending accounts, depending on how you want to do it. Again, If the (spending) account only has debit card activity, the worst that can happen is the card declines, you can't get an overdraft fee by law.

I'm in the UK, but my SO and I have discussed this at length, and agreed that this is pretty much the way we'd do it. Joint account for shared expenses, with standing orders set up from our individual accounts to transfer the necessary funds. Salaries would go into our individual accounts. I personally would have a savings account as well, probably just in my name, as I'm the more responsible one. I'd probably have a savings account for joint expenses (holidays, cars etc) which we would both pay into and a personal one (tattoos, trips to see friends, etc). We'd also have student loan repayments to take into account once we start earning over a certain amount.

Though while I remain unemployed and living at home with the Mother Unit, all of the above is moot :laugh:

[Arkhangel]

This. This is going to blow your mind! Hold on.

We. Communicate. With. Each. Other. That's it, that's all there is to it.

If I were to lose my job tomorrow, we'd tuck in our belts use our savings and be fine. I don't understand how that is materially different from having a joint account. By the end of the year, me, himself and Squidgey will have been on eight trips from short to long - we planned and budgeted for them and not once was having a joint account an issue.

Here's what I don't understand; why some people who do have joint accounts think it's the holy grail of being in a couple.

Also, I'm not wild about the implication that if you don't have a joint account you're not financially responsible - you probably didn't mean it but you may want to watch your phrasing.

By Odin's Holy Beard you'd think we were aliens from another planet or something...

N

Cuellar's question was perfectly reasonable, there's no need to carry on like it was some grievous attack on the validity of your relationship. I would also like to know how couples who keep their money separate handle it if, for example, one partner is able to afford a significantly higher standard of living than the other, or if one partner stops working or works less in order to look after their children. Does the wealthier person suck it up and live in a crappy apartment because it's all their partner can afford? Does the working spouse pay the non-working spouse a 'wage' for their domestic work? Basically, how do you handle major financial inequalities?

[mormont]

Cuellar's question was perfectly reasonable, there's no need to carry on like it was some grievous attack on the validity of your relationship. I would also like to know how couples who keep their money separate handle it if, for example, one partner is able to afford a significantly higher standard of living than the other, or if one partner stops working or works less in order to look after their children. Does the wealthier person suck it up and live in a crappy apartment because it's all their partner can afford? Does the working spouse pay the non-working spouse a 'wage' for their domestic work? Basically, how do you handle major financial inequalities?

Same way as people who share a bank account, by and large. That is: the higher earner shoulders more of the burdens. (Particularly when the other is earning less because of childcare.) People who have separate bank accounts don't necessarily have any lower a level of sharing in the relationship.

Really, I'm kind of puzzled that this is even a debate. There are as many different answers to this question as there are different kinds of loving relationships. Couples come to an arrangement that suits themselves.

[Chaldanya]

Except, Iskaral said that he didn't understand the point of being married if you weren't sharing an account (calling into question the validity of the marriage without a joint bank account).

Cuellar straight up said that he wouldn't marry someone who wasn't fiscally responsible and linking that to not having a joint bank account.

So, yeah, I'm not just imagining it.

Also what Mormie said.

[The Notorious]

Cuellar's question was perfectly reasonable, there's no need to carry on like it was some grievous attack on the validity of your relationship. I would also like to know how couples who keep their money separate handle it if, for example, one partner is able to afford a significantly higher standard of living than the other, or if one partner stops working or works less in order to look after their children. Does the wealthier person suck it up and live in a crappy apartment because it's all their partner can afford? Does the working spouse pay the non-working spouse a 'wage' for their domestic work? Basically, how do you handle major financial inequalities?

I think that's entirely dependent on each subjective couple. But for what it's worth, it's probably best to keep separate accounts or one might be accuse of financial domestic abuse as the marriage falters and the parties struggle to control the narrative post-divorce.

[Shryke]

Except, Iskaral said that he didn't understand the point of being married if you weren't sharing an account (calling into question the validity of the marriage without a joint bank account).

Cuellar straight up said that he wouldn't marry someone who wasn't fiscally responsible and linking that to not having a joint bank account.

So, yeah, I'm not just imagining it.

Also what Mormie said.

No he didn't. He said he didn't understand the people without one based on being wary of their partners spending habits. Specifically:

if you can't trust them with a joint account then don't marry them.

Which seems rather relevant, especially given the reasoning being thrown around in the thread. If you can't trust your partner with money, that seems like a big problem.