[Book Spoilers] Rant and Rave Without Repercussion

[Alex Storm]

They're not making a fuss because they have a smaller army in the show... although D&D have probably already forgotten about that :dunno:

I think it was in S2 where they said that the Tyrells command the third most men after the Lannisters and Starks.

so yea they don't have as big an army as in the books but still should be big enough to make a difference

[Everett Snow]

They're not making a fuss because they have a smaller army in the show... although D&D have probably already forgotten about that :dunno:

I'm not complaining, because throwing in anymore storylines into this season would have only thrown it even more off-balance. I just find it humorous to think of Tyrell soldiers waiting on the banks of the Mander thinking "Uhmmm, so where are the Greyjoy reavers?"

[Justin Danford]

Anyone know how many KG were in that small room where Loras' hearing took place? I know Jamie is in Dorne and Meryn is off with Mace Tyrell, but shouldn't the rest of them all be there? You have the King, the Queen, the Queen Mother, and 2 other members of the royal family. I think I saw 3 KG tops. Who else could they possibly be guarding? Maybe I miscounted.

Also I get that the idea is Tommen is weak and won't give the order, but even 3-5 Kings Guard in full plate armor and swords should be able to take down a dozen angry worshipers in robes wielding clubs. Could no one else of power in that room tell the KG "protect the fucking queen"? Maybe like... the ACTUAL Queen being violently carried off?

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

Couldn't they just send Loras to Dragonstone like they do in the books?

[SeanF]

Someone brought up that 3/4 of the main female characters have been raped now. Will they add a notch and have Marge raped too? I mean, who cares that she's the Queen, we all saw how much that helped her today. Who cares if Faith Talibans are hypocrites too and approve of their members raping prisoners? Stranger solipsisms have occurred on this show.

Perhaps a scene where Margaery is tortured while naked, for extra titillation?

[SerDesmondHume]

You know I don't even know what to say to this episode. Last week I felt was an improvement from the abysmal first 4 episodes, But this was probably the worst episode I've seen of anything in a long time and I watched the two and a half men finale. I had a feeling this wasn't going to be a good episode when it was named after the Martell words and all the good martells are dead or written out. This episode made me miss Emilia's over the top acting. I'd trade any scene in this episode for one in Meereen because even the worst scene there is better than what this episode delivered.

Arya and Jaqen was a bit boring but I'd take boring over what the other scenes brought to me.

Jorah and Tyrion seemed a little bit odd and the slavers aren't too bright if they think someone they can easily capture is the greatest knight in westeros.

Littlefinger's plan is to give up to woman he loves to a psychopath in the middle of an impending warzone against a man who would surely cut off his head especially since he sent Sansa to the Boltons and to tell Cersei about it so he can bring the army of the Vale that's devoted to him somehow north to fight Stannis and/or Roose? Err okay. My head cannon is Batfinger went mad with grief over Cats death and is taking over Cerseis affc plot.

It's really convenient how everyone in Dorne tried to capture/kill Myrcella at the exact same time. Why couldn't the Sand Snakes lie and say that they caught Jaime in Dorne and were trying to protect Trystane? Also Bronn gets poisoned to death by someone who can't act? What? Also how did two random people get into grabbing distance of the prince of dorne and the princess of westeros. Outside of Mujica in Uruguay I don't see any ruler of a nation being that chill to allow that.

The birthmark of Dorne is the biggest plot point in the kings landing story. Okay.

Darth Sansa sure is Ladyfinger now. She put on a black dress and now she's been raped by a psychopath. Top notch writing. Maybe she'll get beheaded so her character arc as a master manipulator is completed.

[Anarchosaurus Rex]

http://grrm.livejournal.com/427713.html

I'm really disappointed in GRRM's post. Yes, the fact that he's saying anything at all must mean something, and I'm sure he feels morally obligated - if not contractually so - not to be critical, but the tone of this is way too conciliatory. For crying out loud, GRRM makes it sound like Ding & Dong are making a good-faith effort at adaptation!

This isn't a "butterfly effect" change stemming from necessary changes in adapting from the page to the screen. This is a malicious, disgusting betrayal and butchery of the story. Ding & Dong did not have to do this; they worked to make it happen. There was no need for Ramsay to rape someone in Winterfell. If there were, there was still no reason for it to be Sansa. Seriously, Ding & Dong went out of their way for this.

Comparing this to "how many children did Scarlett O'Hara have?" is, frankly, silly. Making up a rape where there is none is nothing like cutting Scarlett's extraneous children.

I honestly would have rather he said nothing.

This. I'm done, too. I'm just sorry I didn't stop watching a long time ago, they were the smart ones.

After the initial shock of seeing/hearing Sansa bent over and taken screaming faded, the full horror of the thinking behind it began to dawn on me.

[The Scabbard Of the Morning]

Couldn't they just send Loras to Dragonstone like they do in the books?

No, because they need to remind everyone how much religious people hate the gays. Socially relevant baby!

[TheCasualObserver]

I can't talk about THAT scene right now.

Instead, have you considered just how stupid the birthmark evidence was? As a squire in a pre-Freudian society, Olyvar would absolutely be expected to know the intimacies of his master's body. In AGOT Lancel helps Robert dress. In AFFC Peck helps Jaime in and out of a bath.

In the event of a knight being killed and disfigured in battle it was reasonable to ask his squire about potentially distinguishing marks on his naked body. For a squire to know that the man he served had a distinct birthmark on his buttock would not so much as raise an eyebrow in the real medieval world.

[SliverOfDiamond]

Ok, well I'm glad I made the decision to stop watching, this sounds like the sick fantasies of a couple of perverts being acted out. I'm only sorry I got sucked in and invested so much time and money in the first four seasons, it all started so well :(.

I can't decide now whether to take the dvds I have from the first three seasons (I didn't buy season 4) to the tip (where they belong) or donate them to a charity shop. I'm done with this series. Thank god I have this forum so I can find out what happens in the end without actually having to watch it.

[The Onion Sleight]

My thoughts about this shit:

http://sworn-to-house-baratheon.tumblr.com/post/119260348258/okay-ive-watched-it-now-hell-now-again-even

[1234567]

http://grrm.livejournal.com/427713.html

I'm really disappointed in GRRM's post. Yes, the fact that he's saying anything at all must mean something, and I'm sure he feels morally obligated - if not contractually so - not to be critical, but the tone of this is way too conciliatory. For crying out loud, GRRM makes it sound like Ding & Dong are making a good-faith effort at adaptation!

This isn't a "butterfly effect" change stemming from necessary changes in adapting from the page to the screen. This is a malicious, disgusting betrayal and butchery of the story. Ding & Dong did not have to do this; they worked to make it happen. There was no need for Ramsay to rape someone in Winterfell. If there were, there was still no reason for it to be Sansa. Seriously, Ding & Dong went out of their way for this.

Comparing this to "how many children did Scarlett O'Hara have?" is, frankly, silly. Making up a rape where there is none is nothing like cutting Scarlett's extraneous children.

I honestly would have rather he said nothing.

To be honest the talk of different roads and butterflies becoming dragons and his release of the sample chapter suggests he is annoyed but has made his peace with it (he has known for months this is coming). He maybe obliged not to dis the show, but if it blows up in the media like the Cersei/Jaime scene then he may make further comments.

[The Boastful Knight]

Dorne was awful. But at least it was funny. It's a shame that Doran's actor is put in these scenes, he is really great for the role. He deserves much better material to work with. I mean the whole "rescue"(or whatever it was supposed to be) scene was so awkwardly done. Jaime and Bronn just enter the watergardens as it was nothing. They instantly bump into Myrcella and Trystane (they seriously aged up those two just to have an underdeveloped, poorly written "romance" ? And they cut Arianne for that? OMG) and then of course the sand snakes arrive. Mother of all plot convenience! At least Bronn didn't die, I seriously was expecting that, so at least they kind of surprised me. Though I still think he will die later on this season. I mean what can they do with him other than that? What else? Plotting Not!Ellaria is just ridiculous. I can't take her seriously, nor the sand snakes for that matter. It's a pity, really, because Indira Varma is a fine actress. She was good last year in this show, and recently I enjoyed her voicework in DA Inquisition . But she can't do anything I guess when her character is written this dreadfully. Oh, and the fight scene. Again, the sand snakes were so over the top, it was mostly laughable, and also the choreography sucked.

Arya's storyline is fine, I guess, and I like the actor who plays Jaqen (Is he actually Jaqen or just wears his face? It really isn't clear) . Putting him there was one of the better book to show changes.

At this point,show Littlefinger is a disgrace to book Littlefinger (I don't like him in the books, but I like how the character is written.). In the show, he is just stupid, plain and simple. His "masterplan" is stupid. Everything about him is stupid.

Tyrion and Jorah WTF?!! I thought they're skipping the slave storyline, seeing how they cut a good chunk of Tyrion's ADWD material. Whatever, I mean I don't really care about those two, I'm sure St. Tyrion will be fine, even if they kill Jorah Connington. Oh, and cock-merchant? Yeah, I think not.

And now the big one. First of, the wedding was stupid. Where were the norhtern lords? I mean the whole point of the marriage was to give legitimacy to the Bolton rule in the north. Wasn't it? As far as I understood, the kept that aspect from the books. So WTF was that? 20 people at most attending to the wedding of the heir to the Warden of the North? And I'm failry sure that those people were just servants from the castle, seeing Myranda was present, who is like, nobody. So she really had no business being there. OMG. At least there was no wedding feast scene with more Ramsay, Walda and Roose awkwardness.

Now I think some people won't like what I have to say about the wedding night scene. It was just...tame. I expected if they're gonna ruin Sansa's storyline at least they will have the balls to include the Jeyne/Fake Arya bedding scene from the book in all its disturbing glory. That I wouldn't have liked but at least it would have been fun to see the bakclash that would have caused, and them trying to justify it. As it is, it's just a slightly more disturbing version of the Dany/Drogo scene from the pilot. Although, again, the actors were great, who deserved better stuff to work with. Alfie Allen especially, I think he is one of the most underrated actors on the show (Emilia Clarke getting an Emmy nomitaion before him or for example before the magnificent Charles Dance is a good indicator of that fact, I think).

And on a sidenote, I think I will never understand why a scene like this involving a main character is just unnacceptable for some people, while the many other horrible scenes, like multiple depictions of murder, maiming, incest, torture, rape of non main characters and other goodies isn't. I mean, rape is bad. I get it. It happening to a main character who you might like is worse. No sane, decent person would argue against that. But it is fairly common in the show and also in the books for that matter (thogh not as common, I admit). It is just nature of the world depicted. Terrible things happen. I mean it's one of the appealing aspects of the story for me, and I expect many others.

The show has many problems, and though I liked the first 4 seasons, those had many problems as well. And so far this season is abysmal. But I think it's a pretty brave thing that it doesn't shy away from showing those kind of scenes. Which is why I was surprised at the Sansa/Ramsey scene. It wasn't good, but it wasn't really bad either. It was pretty much what any other show or movie would have done with a situation like this. Now I want to make myself clear here. Again, I wouldn't have liked the book version of the scene on screen, but the show would have been true to itself if they went that route. But now that I think about it, they were true to themselves in a sense that they did a pretty half assed job, just like with everything else lately.

Anyway, all this doesn't really matter, since the whole Sansa back in WF storyline is doomed from the beginning, creating plot holes and screwing up character motivations all around itself. So at this point, I'm just patiently waiting for it to end.

[1234567]

http://grrm.livejournal.com/427713.html

I'm really disappointed in GRRM's post. Yes, the fact that he's saying anything at all must mean something, and I'm sure he feels morally obligated - if not contractually so - not to be critical, but the tone of this is way too conciliatory. For crying out loud, GRRM makes it sound like Ding & Dong are making a good-faith effort at adaptation!

This isn't a "butterfly effect" change stemming from necessary changes in adapting from the page to the screen. This is a malicious, disgusting betrayal and butchery of the story. Ding & Dong did not have to do this; they worked to make it happen. There was no need for Ramsay to rape someone in Winterfell. If there were, there was still no reason for it to be Sansa. Seriously, Ding & Dong went out of their way for this.

Comparing this to "how many children did Scarlett O'Hara have?" is, frankly, silly. Making up a rape where there is none is nothing like cutting Scarlett's extraneous children.

I honestly would have rather he said nothing.

To be honest the talk of different roads and butterflies becoming dragons and his release of the sample chapter suggests he is annoyed but has made his peace with it (he has known for months this is coming). He maybe obliged not to dis the show, but if it blows up in the media like the Cersei/Jaime scene then he may make further comments.

[R4W13Y]

Anyone know how many KG were in that small room where Loras' hearing took place? I know Jamie is in Dorne and Meryn is off with Mace Tyrell, but shouldn't the rest of them all be there? You have the King, the Queen, the Queen Mother, and 2 other members of the royal family. I think I saw 3 KG tops. Who else could they possibly be guarding? Maybe I miscounted.

Also I get that the idea is Tommen is weak and won't give the order, but even 3-5 Kings Guard in full plate armor and swords should be able to take down a dozen angry worshipers in robes wielding clubs. Could no one else of power in that room tell the KG "protect the fucking queen"? Maybe like... the ACTUAL Queen being violently carried off?

You're forgetting the KG with Myrcella. OH WAIT. Where the fuck is he? Or any other body guard as she and the Prince of Dorne just traipse around the water gardens unaccompanied. Look how well that worked out for them.

Couldn't they just send Loras to Dragonstone like they do in the books?

Or just have him go to Highgarden. Seriously, why the fuck is he in KL? He's not part of the KG. He's not marrying Cersei. What is he even doing there? Besides "plot" reasons, of course.

http://grrm.livejournal.com/427713.html

I'm really disappointed in GRRM's post. Yes, the fact that he's saying anything at all must mean something, and I'm sure he feels morally obligated - if not contractually so - not to be critical, but the tone of this is way too conciliatory. For crying out loud, GRRM makes it sound like Ding & Dong are making a good-faith effort at adaptation!

This isn't a "butterfly effect" change stemming from necessary changes in adapting from the page to the screen. This is a malicious, disgusting betrayal and butchery of the story. Ding & Dong did not have to do this; they worked to make it happen. There was no need for Ramsay to rape someone in Winterfell. If there were, there was still no reason for it to be Sansa. Seriously, Ding & Dong went out of their way for this.

Comparing this to "how many children did Scarlett O'Hara have?" is, frankly, silly. Making up a rape where there is none is nothing like cutting Scarlett's extraneous children.

I honestly would have rather he said nothing.

After the initial shock of seeing/hearing Sansa bent over and taken screaming faded, the full horror of it all began to dawn on me.

I would have rather he said nothing too :frown5: Wonder what Elio and Linda will say. Looking forward to their review.

[Shinjinobrave]

I'm hoping that Bran will wake up, covered in weirwood roots, at the end of the season....

Bran: The fudge was that?

Bloodraven: The roots show us things that may have come to pass.... I tweaked your jojenpaste so that your visions would be stupid.

Bran: Why would you do that?

Bloodraven: I have weird issues with women and sex in general....

Bran: You looked like santaclaus in my dream, what was that about?

Bloodraven: I had a messed up childhood dude...

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

I would give George a break. I think he was just tired of all the emails he was getting from angry fans and wanted to put an end to it. I'm sure he doesn't agree with many of the changes made.

[Anarchosaurus Rex]

I'm hoping that Bran will wake up, covered in weirwood roots, at the end of the season....

Bran: The fudge was that?

Bloodraven: The roots show us things that may have come to pass.... I tweaked your jojenpaste so that your visions would be stupid.

Bran: Why would you do that?

Bloodraven: I have weird issues with women and sex in general....

Bran: You looked like santaclaus in my dream, what was that about?

Bloodraven: I had a messed up childhood dude...

*craughing*

[R4W13Y]

And just what the fuck is going on with this dialogue? For all the shit GRRM gets for his faux medieval expressions, at least he tries. Watching this show you'd think it takes place in contemporary London. I mean, just compare it to the dialogue in Penny Dreadful, florid as it may be, at least it gives you the illusion that people are living in another setting and time.

You commented this in the other thread. I would love some examples of what you mean since I've noticed this too. Dany said "I'm not a politician" recently, Stannis talked about telling people to "go to hell" etc.

[SeanF]

I suppose one has to be grateful for small mercies. I bet the writers must have been very tempted to include "Reek, make her ready for me."