Rachel Dolezal case

[polishgenius]

Then we're all African-American, right?

The African bit I can understand, even if the argument is obviously a little bit silly, but where did the American in me come from?

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

The African bit I can understand, even if the argument is obviously a little bit silly, but where did the American in me come from?

I guess because you was born in America. I assume. I wasn't really arguing that we are all really African-Americans. Just, when you break it down to the level of DNA, well, it don't matter much, does it?

[Wise Fool]

Well, this just goes to show that black people are trying to recruit from the rest of the population and convert them into black people, which is why of course I refuse to bake cakes for black weddings. I'm not going to celebrate your liberal agenda!

[Littlefingers In The Air]

You're not invited to the wedding anyways. :P

[TrueMetis]

Aren't all of us descended from people who immigrated from Africa a 150,000 years ago? So I guess you could argue that she is telling the truth if your willing to look at the big picture in regards to the timeframe.

On a serious note I agree with you on her maybe being a little off but that she really doesn't mean any harm. From what I've heard the people who actually worked with her don't seem to have a problem.

Emigrated and yes, but culture has changed a rather lot in 150,000 years. So has our understanding of race for that matter.

[Summah]

Some of the #AskRachel posts on Twitter are hilarious.

[all swedes are racist]

Some of the #AskRachel posts on Twitter are hilarious.

:lol: on man, pretty amazing (even if I only like, 2 outta 5)... the country crock and 3LW ones made literally laugh out loud

[Arkhangel]

Just wanna say this very quickly: America is OBSESSED with issues like race and ethnicity. It is obsessed to such a degree that you can call it pathological.

What the US lacks is a certain "la dolce vita", "c'est la vie", "que cera cera" attitude in life. This is valid for many issues.

Remember, at the end...valar morghulis

Yeah, why do black people have to make such a fuss when their unarmed kids are shot or maced or arrested at pool parties? C'est la vie! Socioeconomic inequality, intergenerational poverty, entrenched systemic discrimination - que sera sera! I mean, everyone dies eventually anyway, right? So why even bother.

[Hayyoth]

I guess because you was born in America. I assume. I wasn't really arguing that we are all really African-Americans. Just, when you break it down to the level of DNA, well, it don't matter much, does it?

Yes all black people are African Americans, I've actually heard that said more than once. Sometimes my fellow countrymen are downright embarrassing.

Some of the #AskRachel posts on Twitter are hilarious.

I kinda feel sorry for her, but then again this is a woman who likely used the term white privilege in every second sentence. Beyond the normal toucans I reckon she needs to sit down and explain herself.

Why didn't she just claim she was 1/8th black? Given the one drop rule she'd be classed as African American and no reason to go to the salon every week to top up the spray tan and perm.

[Jo498]

Maybe because if you construct an elaborate lie you might as well go for it big time? If that photo from her early twenties is correct she actually was as white ( = pink, blond, freckled) as they come and "one drop" would have been as wrong as any other story. She grew up with black foster brothers so she qualifies as black by association, I guess...

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

Yes all black people are African Americans, I've actually heard that said more than once. Sometimes my fellow countrymen are downright embarrassing.

When did I say that all black people wasn't AA? I said we all could be considered AA at the DNA level. (I'm white) And, did you not read my previous post? Or you just picking and choosing and taking my words outta context?

[butterbumps!]

I have to admit that I'm really unsure of how I feel about this debacle. The fact that this is essentially a woman in blackface seems incredibly offensive, and certainly rubs me the wrong way. But then she doesn't use it exploitatively exactly. I mean, from the bits in the media so far, it doesn't sound like she actually believes that she is black, nor did she need to be black in order to hold her professional/ advocacy positions or anything like that. I suppose that she may have believed a constructed black identity may have rendered her more of an authority as a professor and advocate to speak on those subjects, so perhaps there is a bit of an exploitative element to that end (I'm not sure if that's the issue, I'm just speculating).

From what I gather, the outrage seems directed to the fact that she's essentially a racial tourist. That is, she'll never truly appreciate what it means to be black because she can wash out the perm and return to "being white" if she ever wanted to regain her privilege. I think that issue is incredibly significant, but I don't know how to feel about the rationale if I'm being thoroughly honest. If the physical transformation were more permanent, such that one couldn't choose to regain their privilege on a whim, would it be less offensive?

I'm also not sure if I understand how cases of blackface like this differ from cross-dressing, especially in terms of the impermanence of the transformation and apparent ability to slide between worlds. I get that a lot of cross dressing is for performance rather than "passing," but conceptually, isn't there a similar phenomenon going on between them? I'm not sure if that is off-topic, and if so, I apologize.

[polishgenius]

When did I say that all black people wasn't AA? I said we all could be considered AA at the DNA level. (I'm white) And, did you not read my previous post? Or you just picking and choosing and taking my words outta context?

His point (and mine) is that you did say, or at least suggest, that all black people are African American. And that you shouldn't.

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

His point (and mine) is that you did say, or at least suggest, that all black people are African American. And that you shouldn't.

OK, I understand that. Sorry, I understand that isn't the case. But, that wasn't my point. It was just in relation to this subject. See, this is why race is such a touchy subject in America.

That if you broke it down to a DNA level, everyone born in America (black, white, mixed, etc, etc) could be considered a AA. I'm not trying to take your race away from you, its just as others have said, we're human, and that's all that should matter.

As for why race is made such a big deal in the U.S., I would say thats because there different incentives for each race. Scholarships, benefits and so on and this is why they preform the census.

[Kat]

A mod has already noted:

This would be the best approach. Stick to the topic.

The next person who tries to derail this thread into being about transgender issues will be hit with a warning. Stay on topic, people. If you really can't see that race != gender, go read about this on one of the multitude of media sources covering this story and go figure it out elsewhere.

[Summah]

Why is race so important in the US? Because the wealth of this country came from slavery and settler colonialism (which requires both racism and genocide). Whiteness has always been the highest caste here, and it directly benefits from subjugating other groups, and it continues to do so to this day. Next time some white person wants to question why race is so important, do some reading first. I suggest Ta-Nehesi Coates A Case for Reparations, because honestly I have no desire to keep having this conversation with people who choose to be ignorant.

[Hayyoth]

Why is race so important in the US? Because the wealth of this country came from slavery and settler colonialism (which requires both racism and genocide). Whiteness has always been the highest caste here, and it directly benefits from subjugating other groups, and it continues to do so to this day. Next time some white person wants to question why race is so important, do some reading first. I suggest Ta-Nehesi Coates A Case for Reparations, because honestly I have no desire to keep having this conversation with people who choose to be ignorant.

We have the one drop rule. Simply if you have any African ancestry you will be classed as African American. However as with all such things it's way more complicated than that. As for the rest of your diatribe a simple 'I'm not here to teach you' would be fine. White people need to shut up and listen etc' would suffice.

[IheartIheartTesla]

This particular person either has some family issues or personal problems to work through that I suspect are at the root of her switching personas. Its a bit more elaborate than a lot of the cultural/race-based appropriations that take place everyday in the US. There are numerous examples both public and private that I'm sure people are aware of.

On a more humorous note, she appears to have proved Chris Rock wrong (if you recall his stand up bit where he states that not a single white person in the audience would want to trade places with him, and he's rich. "If you are white, the sky's the limit. If you're black, the limit's the sky". And of course, an extended riff of the creation and propogation of wealth in the US when it came to race. You know the bit).

Personally, I've always felt that I was an American who by an accident of birth was born in a different country. However, it turns out national identity is much more funglible. Not that its comparable, but I have a slight (very slight) inkling of what RD may be experiencing.

[Swordfish]

The question is how she thought she was going to get away with it.

And it's more than just a bit of harmless lying, from what I've read. I got this from another site, so of course, grain of salt.

She denied a Hispanic student of hers participation in a racial exercise because, despite being from a spanish speaking country and being fluent in spanish and identifying as Hispanic, she didn't look Hispanic enough

She seems to hate any black man who marries or dates a white woman

She claims her adoptive brother as her son

She has shamed some of her black students for not being black enough

She claims her mother beat her and her siblings with a baboon whip, a whip that was used to beat slaves in the past.

She claims her parents beat her and her brothers and sisters based on their skin color

She claims to have a black father and says her birth father (as in on her fucking birth certificate) is her "step-father", she doesn't have a step-father

She claims that she was born in a tepee in Montana in 1977.

She claims she grew up hunting with a bow and arrow (in South Africa I believe of course)

She claims to have been to South Africa (her Parents went when she was an adult but everyone from her family says she's never been)

Criticized light skinned black people for trying to pass as white

She said this:

Where do we go from here? People who have not felt the lash of centuries of oppression beating down on their backs tell us to keep calm and carry on. What insanity makes those in power imagine they have any idea what the logical response should be? What psychosis perpetuates the myth that if we listen to “both sides,” we will somehow find the truth, as if the hunter and the hunted, the dead and the living, could be consulted with a fair and even outcome.

There are like, epic levels of crazy here.

[zelticgar]

Looks like she resigned her post with the NAACP chapter. It would be nice to see some redemption for this woman over time but I think the reality is that her case is touching on some nerves that are a bit too sensitive right now. My guess is that she will write a book, have her 15 minutes on the nightly TV news shows and then ride off into obscurity.