U.S. Politics: mid summer edition

[TrueMetis]

 

 

Woah up there horsey. So the democrats are all things socialism except marxism? Wasnt there someone in europe a while back that fit that? A national socialist, i think, and was against marxist socialism.

 

Thats the kind of maths that lands you in poland.

 

Hitler was a Socialist in the way North Korea is a Republic and Democratic.

[Squab]

 

Socialist = someone who supports socialism. A left-wing ideology.

 

Democrat = a supporter or member of the Democratic Party, which generally represents positions ranging from the centre-right to mainstream left.

 

Calling Democrats socialists generally implies you're dealing with some right-wing Republican who thinks their opponents are commies. 

 

Left and right wing are not static, they move.  We are no longer for a revolution or a king in France, i think it was originally that, no?  i dont remember exactly.  I figure these days the line has to be where the parties are, unless you have trouble removing yourself from it in which case you think you are centre and the party you support is left and right of where you are.

 

You still didnt explain any actual differences.  From above a Socialist would be a democrat but there might be democrats that arent socialists?  is that right? 

[Squab]

 

Hitler was a Socialist in the way North Korea is a Republic and Democratic.

 

Arent they socialists too?

 

I think the Nazis believed they were socialists at least. isnt that where the word Nazi comes from?  They were (and are if they're still around) a bunch of crazies.  i put a quote in from google below that looks pretty socialist to me.  the socialist alliance near where i live say this kinda stuff at rallies, before calling someone racist.

 

"We are Socialists, we are enemies of the captalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with it's unfair salaries, with it's unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of resposibility and performance and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions" - AH May 1927

[The Anti-Targ]

 

Left and right wing are not static, they move.  We are no longer for a revolution or a king in France, i think it was originally that, no?  i dont remember exactly.  I figure these days the line has to be where the parties are, unless you have trouble removing yourself from it in which case you think you are centre and the party you support is left and right of where you are.

 

You still didnt explain any actual differences.  From above a Socialist would be a democrat but there might be democrats that arent socialists?  is that right? 

Most socialists would not be Democrats because the Democratic party is too right wing for proper socialists. Socialists who choose to vote for the lesser of two evils, as opposed to casting a protest vote for an actual socialist party, will most likely vote Democratic (ref, Russell Brand [an actual socialist] deciding to endorse the Labour Party [not a socialist party] in the last UK election, which may have done more harm than good for Labour). But they would not join the Democratic Party, because thankfully it is still the case that one does not need to join a political party in order to vote in the USA, though maybe some people think you do.

 

In our neck of the woods we generally say that Obama would fit ideologically more into our National party (centre-right / right) than he would fit into our Labour party (centre-left / left). Not sure that's strictly true, but there is a grain of truth to the claim that the US Democratic party leans more to the political right than the counterpart parties in other western democracies.

[kuenjato]

http://www.salon.com/2015/08/03/the_gop_crack_up_continues_the_raging_civil_war_over_the_disgusting_cuckservative_slur/

quite revealing, actually.

and then there's this:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/627841345789558788

[Ser Friendzoned]

lol Trump's good. It is rather funny that many politicians flock to big corps to beg for some spending money.

[Andriy Czarchenko]

Greens and other third parties should, imo, have a much easier time winning local elections, and then, they can build that into a network and establish a party infrastructure to support national level elections. Smaller states that are already fairly divergent from the mainstream parties, like Maine or Vermont, seem like good targets. I'd think it's a lot less expensive to get a state Attorney General or some such from a third party there, once they have a few mayors and a few city officials of the same party. It's an issue of trust - voters need to know that the party can be trusted to get the support. At least in my city, the city council members won their seats by having a total of a few hundred votes, out of a population of about 20k. 

 

Vermont has a progressive party with seats in both state houses. 3 of 30 in senate and 6 of 150 in house.

[The Marquis de Leech]

In our neck of the woods we generally say that Obama would fit ideologically more into our National party (centre-right / right) than he would fit into our Labour party (centre-left / left). Not sure that's strictly true, but there is a grain of truth to the claim that the US Democratic party leans more to the political right than the counterpart parties in other western democracies.

 

The Democrats would correspond to National and Labour. What happens here as an inter-party fight happens there as an internal squabble. 

 

There isn't an equivalent of the Republicans (ACT meets Destiny meets the National Front meets gun-nuts?).

[The Marquis de Leech]

You still didnt explain any actual differences.  From above a Socialist would be a democrat but there might be democrats that arent socialists?  is that right? 

 

The more left-wing Democrats might consider themselves socialists, and the more right-wing socialists might consider themselves Democrats.

 

I think most Democrats wouldn't consider themselves socialist (the US uses the term liberal for the centre-left), and many socialists would consider the Democrats too right-wing. 

[Fragile Bird]

What's this? Mary Fallin, the governor (Republican) of Oklahoma signs a law prohibiting cities from establishing minimum wages and benefits, like vacation days and sick leave? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/15/oklahoma-minimum-wage_n_5152496.html?utm_hp_ref=tw

Is this a trend? More anti-Obama backlash?

[awesome possum]

Just another lap in the race to the bottom.  

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

Article on Trump's supporters. It's a bit condescending, but who wouldn't be? He show remarkable restraint under the circumstances.

[TerraPrime]

What's this? Mary Fallin, the governor (Republican) of Oklahoma signs a law prohibiting cities from establishing minimum wages and benefits, like vacation days and sick leave? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/15/oklahoma-minimum-wage_n_5152496.html?utm_hp_ref=tw

Is this a trend? More anti-Obama backlash?

 

Apparently, the ethos of small government and non-interference on market mechanics stops at the state level eh?

[Fragile Bird]

Apparently, the ethos of small government and non-interference on market mechanics stops at the state level eh?

Kinda reminds me of Animal Farm.

Some markets are more free than others.

[TerraPrime]

Kinda reminds me of Animal Farm.

Some markets are more free than others.

 

We saw plenty of examples already, without the need of this additional one. Like, for instance, the GOP in Alabama trying to stop Volkswagon plant there from allowing their employees to unionize. I'm sure they will argue that they are regulating to maximize market freedom, so it's ok. 

[DanteGabriel]

 

We saw plenty of examples already, without the need of this additional one. Like, for instance, the GOP in Alabama trying to stop Volkswagon plant there from allowing their employees to unionize. I'm sure they will argue that they are regulating to maximize market freedom, so it's ok. 

 

Because priority one is about destroying the rights and protections of labor. The slavelord ethos of cheap and unprotected labor to enrich a ruling elite lives on in the Republican economic platform.

[IheartIheartTesla]

 

"We are Socialists, we are enemies of the captalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with it's unfair salaries, with it's unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of resposibility and performance and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions" - AH May 1927

 This other guy said in 1933 "The government will not protect the economic interests of the German people by the circuitous method of an economic bureaucracy to be organized by the state, but by the utmost furtherance of private initiative and by the recognition of the rights of property".

 

Oh wait, it was the same person, and closer to the invasion date of Poland.

[lokisnow]

Obama and Clinton attorneys diligently working to reverse conviction of wall street crook via good old boys club.

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-08-04/supreme-court-bar-engages-in-some-back-scratching

[Fez]

What's this? Mary Fallin, the governor (Republican) of Oklahoma signs a law prohibiting cities from establishing minimum wages and benefits, like vacation days and sick leave? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/15/oklahoma-minimum-wage_n_5152496.html?utm_hp_ref=tw

Is this a trend? More anti-Obama backlash?

 

Its an ongoing trend in conservative states, trying to stop more liberal cities from actually governing. Arguably the most infuriating are the states banning cities from investing in their infrastructure and doing stuff like buying hi-speed fiber optic cables, or even accepting free cables from Google.

[Humble AK]

I kind of want Trump to become president for the schadenfreude of it. But I think even that won't live up to expectations because there's no way Trump believes in his own bullshit. No way can anyone expect to be able to walk around with their cock out and stare nations down. You can't just slap China and Iran into submission. That's ridiculous. So all Trump would end up doing is becoming a bloviating but mostly inert president, who eventually would, more likely than not, get impeached for corruption or some such. And of course, his hard working blue-collar constituents would have to rationize around the very obvious fact that Trump gives less than a shit about them.