The implications of the Paris attacks

[Jaxom 1974]

Ah Roose

I'll humor you. This is not about stopping all migration. It's about allowing migration in the way that Australia does. And to an extent your own country, which is thankfully sheltered from the harsh realities of the world by thousands of miles of open ocean.

Let people in according to a Skilled migrant system. Those that the country needs, can get in.

Of course, for any of this to work the entire Shengen system must be dismantled, and the EU project must first fail. Which is not entirely unrealistic at this point in time, so there is still hope.

Then the issue of where the borders get drawn is irrelevant, as each country can decide that for themselves.

 

EDIT

 

Why does this feel like something Nazi Germany would have advocated?  A new riff on an old theme, if you will. 

[Hayyoth]

HMM,

Alright why is barring immigration while Euopeans are not replacing their own populationa smart?  How do you propose to force Muslim immagrants to behave like the culture in European nation X?

Oh so now we get the economic arguments. Spending countless billions to support a destitute immigrant population is apparently good for the economy. Maybe we could spend that money to make it easier for young people to start families instead?

[The Marquis de Leech]

The awesome thing about Tony Abbott (who will go down as one of history's great conservatives) is how he made something the left claims as impossible, controlling the border, look incredibly easy. Tow back a few boats and um that's it. The European nations could do this tomorrow if they wanted to, but first the people of Europe will have to rid themselves of the craven/borderline insane politicians currently in power. After the Paris attacks, where at least one of the mass murderers was a Syrian refugee, that would seem likely.

Which explains why he got rolled by his own party.

Seeing as the Abbott/Turnbull Government (and to be fair, it's Gillard/Rudd predecessor) had a policy of first processing the refugees on remote island gulags (from which journalists were forbidden), then dumping those processed on poor Asian countries like Cambodia in return for a cash payment... I'm not sure there's anything incredibly easy about it.

It's rather as if the US processed all refugees at Guantamano Bay, then bribed the Castro Government in Havana hundreds of millions of dollars to take the refugees instead.

[SeanF]

HMM,

Alright why is barring immigration while Euopeans are not replacing their own populationa smart?  How do you propose to force Muslim immagrants to behave like the culture in European nation X?

Some European countries have naturally increasing populations.  In the UK, Ireland, and France, the number of births is well above the number of deaths.  Demographic trends vary markedly across Europe.

[SeanF]

Why does this feel like something Nazi Germany would have advocated?  A new riff on an old theme, if you will. 

I don't see any comparison between the views that FNR is putting forward and the policies of Nazi Germany.

[Malik Ambar]

And time and again my comments about this being bigger than the West are ignored because your bullshit is no real solution to this problem but instead just using this pretext to jerk off to your bullshit fantasies. Indonesia can't do this, Malaysia can't do this, India can't do this. What about them ? Fuck them, they ain't West !

[Hayyoth]

You called what? That you'd play the pissy, pathetic fucking victim card when it's pointed out that you're spouting quasi-fascist views?

Quasi-fascist? Why I never!

[OnionAhaiReborn]

Onionahai

Oh boohoo. Well, in that case I'm calling you out right back for some far left sentiments. Ooh, the shame.

Hey, I'm fine with you owning it. Thankfully we have some history on the subject of fascism to guide our assessment of your views.

I obviously do hold some "far left" views, sitting in the tradition of Western liberalism and democratic socialism. I'm happy to compare the victims of these views to those of fascism.

Quasi-fascist? Why I never!

At least with this response you're attempting humor instead of more sniveling fake victimhood.

Still completely worthless, of course.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

SeanF,

Okay, my, evidentially mistaken, impression was that population decline was pretty universal for native European populations.

[baxus]

Quasi-fascist? Why I never!

This must be the first time I agree with you. There's nothing quasi about fascism you've been advocating in this thread.

[Free Northman Reborn]

Onionahai

 

As long as you are including the most recent 132 and counting Parisians in your list of victims.

[Hayyoth]

Which explains why he got rolled by his own party.

Seeing as the Abbott/Turnbull Government (and to be fair, it's Gillard/Rudd predecessor) had a policy of first processing the refugees on remote island gulags (from which journalists were forbidden), then dumping those processed on poor Asian countries like Cambodia in return for a cash payment... I'm not sure there's anything incredibly easy about it.

It's rather as if the US processed all refugees at Guantamano Bay, then bribed the Castro Government in Havana hundreds of millions of dollars to take the refugees instead.

But none of that is true. Not that they didn't keep them offshore but that they 'dumped them in Asian countries'. Almost no asylum seekers went to Asian nations, agreements or no. And you're correct, the previous socialist government in Australia did keep them in detention but that didn't stop the migration, it was the policy of towing the boats back and a cast iron promise that no matter what NONE of the migrants would be allowed to settle in Australia that did the trick and that's 100% Abbott. It also saved the Australian taxpayers literally billions as a side bonus.

 

And time and again my comments about this being bigger than the West are ignored because your bullshit is no real solution to this problem but instead just using this pretext to jerk off to your bullshit fantasies. Indonesia can't do this, Malaysia can't do this, India can't do this. What about them ? Fuck them, they ain't West !

What the?

 

[Theda Baratheon]

Best part of the thread is the sudden love for LGBTQI folks and respect for women and their powers to choose. 

Hah. I know right? Fucking ridiculous. Am tired of reading Americans getting hysterical and proposing how Europe SHOULD act. I doubt they've ever lived in Britain or Europe for any significant length of time; or truly understand any of these euro countries. Act like an Englishmen? What the heck is that? Britain isn't England. It has never been just England. Chuck out all the Welsh and the Scots!  What happened in Paris was a terrible, terrible thing but the hysteria in this thread is mind boggling. I still can't get over someone suggesting freaking genocide in the first few pages. Disgusting. 

[Jaxom 1974]

I don't see any comparison between the views that FNR is putting forward and the policies of Nazi Germany.

You don't think "England for English!", "conform or get the hell out!", and rounding up those who won't conform and getting them out if the country isn't a new riff on an old theme?  Because it sounds like a step or two away from camps and who knows what else. 

Perhaps it is a flawed argument,  but it is an absolute abhorrent thought process in any sense of the word.

Solving thus issue is nigh impossible, but let's not try, but put our heads in the sand and at the same time our enemies heads too, though by blowing large holes into the ground for them to fall into.

The leaders of this world need to get together, identify the list of things that need to be accomplished to marginalize and halt the spread of those who want to recreate the world in their own image.  Then, as a whole, attack the problems in a manner that helps the world as a whole.  

But I guess I also bbelieve in pie in the sky.

[The Marquis de Leech]

But none of that is true. Not that they didn't keep them offshore but that they 'dumped them in Asian countries'. Almost no asylum seekers went to Asian nations, agreements or no. And you're correct, the previous socialist government in Australia did keep them in detention but that didn't stop the migration, it was the policy of towing the boats back and a cast iron promise that no matter what NONE of the migrants would be allowed to settle in Australia that did the trick and that's 100% Abbott. It also saved the Australian taxpayers literally billions as a side bonus.

Four refugees dumped on Cambodia at $13 million each... a bargain:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/31/cambodia-has-no-plans-to-take-more-nauru-refugees-in-55m-australia-deal

Then they tried The Philippines, for $150 million:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/coalition-government-in-talks-to-resettle-refugees-in-the-philippines-20151008-gk4u5m.html

Do you want me to dig up articles about the conditions in those processing gulags you love so much?

[Malik Ambar]

 

What the?

 

What about this was so difficult to understand ?

 

Hah. I know right? Fucking ridiculous. Am tired of reading Americans getting hysterical and proposing how Europe SHOULD act. I doubt they've ever lived in Britain or Europe for any significant length of time; or truly understand any of these euro countries. Act like an Englishmen? What the heck is that? Britain isn't England. It has never been just England. Chuck out all the Welsh and the Scots!  What happened in Paris was a terrible, terrible thing but the hysteria in this thread is mind boggling. I still can't get over someone suggesting freaking genocide in the first few pages. Disgusting. 

I know. As if these folks ever truly cared for LGBTQI folks. Commenting on others and their lifestyles bothers me less ; being American always entailed that privilege. 

[OnionAhaiReborn]

Onionahai

 

As long as you are including the most recent 132 and counting Parisians in your list of victims.

ISIS, the actual perpetrator, is itself definable as a fascist organization. It has formed and flourished in a region recently destabilized by an invasion and failed occupation of Iraq, prompted by American neoconservatives, leaving behind a weak state.

[Hayyoth]

Four refugees dumped on Cambodia at $13 million each... a bargain:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/31/cambodia-has-no-plans-to-take-more-nauru-refugees-in-55m-australia-deal

Then they tried The Philippines, for $150 million:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/coalition-government-in-talks-to-resettle-refugees-in-the-philippines-20151008-gk4u5m.html

Do you want me to dig up articles about the conditions in those processing gulags you love so much?

Yes as I said, virtually none of the asylum seekers were re-settled in Asia, thanks for the supporting links.

[Mexal]

Four refugees dumped on Cambodia at $13 million each... a bargain:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/31/cambodia-has-no-plans-to-take-more-nauru-refugees-in-55m-australia-deal

Then they tried The Philippines, for $150 million:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/coalition-government-in-talks-to-resettle-refugees-in-the-philippines-20151008-gk4u5m.html

Do you want me to dig up articles about the conditions in those processing gulags you love so much?

He doesn't care. All he cares about is that those refugees didn't make it onto Australian shores.

[Free Northman Reborn]

You don't think "England for English!", "conform or get the hell out!", and rounding up those who won't conform and getting them out if the country isn't a new riff on an old theme?  Because it sounds like a step or two away from camps and who knows what else. 

Perhaps it is a flawed argument,  but it is an absolute abhorrent thought process in any sense of the word.

Solving thus issue is nigh impossible, but let's not try, but put our heads in the sand and at the same time our enemies heads too, though by blowing large holes into the ground for them to fall into.

The leaders of this world need to get together, identify the list of things that need to be accomplished to marginalize and halt the spread of those who want to recreate the world in their own image.  Then, as a whole, attack the problems in a manner that helps the world as a whole.  

But I guess I also bbelieve in pie in the sky.

Yeah. Sounds great in theory.