Season 8: News, Spoilers And Leaks

[Lollygag]

I love it when this forum blames characters for not being omniscient and not knowing what other characters and the readers/viewers know. 2:20.

Yep, Sansa is the only problem here. 

[Mladen]

OK, here we go again...

1. I am yet to see a TV character so fundamentally misunderstood as Sansa Stark is to the writers, which obviously translates to the audience. The biggest issue here is a very simple thing "Sansa and Daenerys have no reason to trust and like each other" but it seems that we can't do that without doing the entire "Sansa is a bitch" dance.

2. Sansa asking Jon if he bent the knee out of love is not power trip. It's actually a valid question. One that we actually know to be at least partially true.

3. Jon didn't trust Daenerys when he met her and now we expect Sansa to do so just because Jon chose to bend his knee WITHOUT GIVINING ANY EXPLANATION. May I remind people that this is what got him killed in Season 5. And had he not had his own sister at the head of Winterfell, he might have gotten killed again. 

Simply, Sansa and Dany being reserved towards each other is natural. And instead of having the two of them talking and working this out, because kingdom will need both of them, we have Jon pondering about that and asking Arya to intervene.?!?!?! Jesus, Mary and Joseph.

[alienarea]

Starks are stupid.

[NonoNono]

I think the following happens:

1- Dany is rejected by the northmen, this was already starting with Glover and also Royce in s7. Dany is told by Bran that her home, where she belongs, is Winterfell, confirming that she won't rule Westeros. On top of that, Bran is the one who reveals Jon is Rhaegar's son. Sansa will be put in a position where she has to force Jon to step down from his King in the North position, probably in part to shenanigans from some of the Northmen and the Vale. She will know Jon is a Targ, and will either use it against him or he'll tell everyone himself and it won't work out. Wildling refugees arrive, doesn't help the situation. Did Daenerys destroy the wall to let them south? Rumors and propaganda takes over. The place is pretty much a powder keg. All it takes is a rock thrown at Dany in front of her dragons for the place to go down in flames, and I believe something like that happens: Dany is murdered by Sansa or those supporting Sansa.

2- All hell breaks loose. Drogon and possibly Rhaegal attacks Winterfell. Some of Dany's followers do too. Winterfell is at war with itself. Eventually everyone has to flee as the NK arrives while the place is already on its knees. They probably lose Rhaegal along the way.

3- Jon and co. go south along with everyone north of King's Landing; it's the last refuge. They have lost control, Drogon is out there and Dany is dead and the NK hasn't been dealt with. They arrive in KL looking like a big bunch of losers, and Cersei is in a pretty good spot. The NK doesn't go south, even if winter does a bit, and people start to say it's all a lie, that Dany had destroyed the wall, there is no Others coming, it's just another damn winter, but there are a bunch of Dothrakis and Unsullied and Wildlings coming.

4- Meanwhile, Bran stayed north.

5- In King's Landing, Cersei asks Jon to do something about Drogon. Tyrion sides with his sister, they have to kill Drogon; siding with Dany was a mistake that blew up in their faces. Drogon attacks KL. But soon Cersei is told that by the GC leader that Jon has been claiming he is Rhaegar's son, Aegon, the true heir to the throne. Jon doesn't deny it, so he is thrown in jail. Tyrion has some fancy plot and leads the GC to kill Drogon, which they succeed at. Dany's leftover army is wiped out or just leaves.

6- Cersei wins, but Euron now wants Sansa instead and chokes Cersei to death, or something I dunno.

7- The Golden Company leader and his army start a coup, kill the Mountain, kill Euron, something like that. People start saying Aegon has returned, he defeated the Others, he killed Drogon, he killed the Mountain, he killed Cersei, he killed Euron, and it's confusing, surely they mean Jon? But he didn't do that.

8- The GC leader is believed to be Aegon and carries the name, propaganda fuels his support, "He's a good Targaryen!". He has what Varys had said one needed "A strong army, a good name.", Jon has no army and his name is Snow. Aegon melts the Iron Throne, the GC arrest Melisandre and burn her and her red-priests alive on the steps of the ruins of the Great Sept of Baelor, which Aegon announces he will rebuild. Coincidentally, a new wall rises a bit north, made of dragon glass, a result of Bran having reached an agreement with the CotF and taken over the NK's mind, which is what the CotF wanted: to take back the control of their protector's circuits. But people don't know that. What a miracle! Winter is no longer advancing! Long live Aegon who freed us from all evils!

9- Sansa marries Aegon. Aegon orders Jaime to be executed, but since Aegon is a good king these sorts of things are no longer done in public. Brienne confronts Sansa about it, but ultimately acquiesce, Sansa has no choice to play her role if she wants to reclaim all she has lost, so Brienne executes Jaime herself with Oathkeeper.

10- Jon is to be executed. He is trialed by Sansa, who is said to have lost so much to him, and is accused of all the terrible things they can throw at him: trialed and executed by the Night Watch for breaking his vows, a wight resurrected by a red priest who burned a child alive to do so, bastard, self-proclaimed King in the North who stole the rightful seat of the heir to Ned Stark (Sansa, since everyone thinks Bran and Rickon are long dead), consort to mad Daenerys and her army of Eunuchs, Dothrakis, Iron Borns, who invaded Westeros with her Dragons, attempted to take the north with the help of wildlings by destroying the wall with her dragons and whose dragon then burned King's Landing, and worst of all: usurper to the throne, having claimed to be Aegon Targaryen himself! Arya demands to execute Jon herself, and she does it by stabbing him in the heart with the pointy end of a dragon glass, to save his life: Jon becomes the new Night King. Bran takes over his mind, wrecks and rises a lot of dead people, but mainly brings Jon back north of the new wall on Theon's ships.

11- There, Jon is told of the new truce, he was the prince who was promised to the children of the forest, their new guardian. Unlike the previous one, he isn't pissed off at them. He has his lover, Daenerys, whom he brings back to life, and their home is the ruined Winterfell, where he is King Beyond the Wall.

12- Tyrion inherits Casterly Rock, his reputation cleaned up, but

And so he spoke, and so he spoke
That Lord of Castamere
And now the rains weep o'er his halls
With no one there to hear

Yes, now the rains weep o'er his halls
And not a soul to hear

 

13- Sansa marries Aegon, and Arya red-weddings them all.

 

Something like that

[Nowy Tends]

28 minutes ago, alienarea said:

Starks are stupid.

What a great contribution. If I were you I'd be careful with the word "stupid".

[Error-504]

2 hours ago, NonoNono said:

I think the following happens:

1- Dany is rejected by the northmen, this was already starting with Glover and also Royce in s7. Dany is told by Bran that her home, where she belongs, is Winterfell, confirming that she won't rule Westeros. On top of that, Bran is the one who reveals Jon is Rhaegar's son. Sansa will be put in a position where she has to force Jon to step down from his King in the North position, probably in part to shenanigans from some of the Northmen and the Vale. She will know Jon is a Targ, and will either use it against him or he'll tell everyone himself and it won't work out. Wildling refugees arrive, doesn't help the situation. Did Daenerys destroy the wall to let them south? Rumors and propaganda takes over. The place is pretty much a powder keg. All it takes is a rock thrown at Dany in front of her dragons for the place to go down in flames, and I believe something like that happens: Dany is murdered by Sansa or those supporting Sansa.

2- All hell breaks loose. Drogon and possibly Rhaegal attacks Winterfell. Some of Dany's followers do too. Winterfell is at war with itself. Eventually everyone has to flee as the NK arrives while the place is already on its knees. They probably lose Rhaegal along the way.

3- Jon and co. go south along with everyone north of King's Landing; it's the last refuge. They have lost control, Drogon is out there and Dany is dead and the NK hasn't been dealt with. They arrive in KL looking like a big bunch of losers, and Cersei is in a pretty good spot. The NK doesn't go south, even if winter does a bit, and people start to say it's all a lie, that Dany had destroyed the wall, there is no Others coming, it's just another damn winter, but there are a bunch of Dothrakis and Unsullied and Wildlings coming.

4- Meanwhile, Bran stayed north.

5- In King's Landing, Cersei asks Jon to do something about Drogon. Tyrion sides with his sister, they have to kill Drogon; siding with Dany was a mistake that blew up in their faces. Drogon attacks KL. But soon Cersei is told that by the GC leader that Jon has been claiming he is Rhaegar's son, Aegon, the true heir to the throne. Jon doesn't deny it, so he is thrown in jail. Tyrion has some fancy plot and leads the GC to kill Drogon, which they succeed at. Dany's leftover army is wiped out or just leaves.

6- Cersei wins, but Euron now wants Sansa instead and chokes Cersei to death, or something I dunno.

7- The Golden Company leader and his army start a coup, kill the Mountain, kill Euron, something like that. People start saying Aegon has returned, he defeated the Others, he killed Drogon, he killed the Mountain, he killed Cersei, he killed Euron, and it's confusing, surely they mean Jon? But he didn't do that.

8- The GC leader is believed to be Aegon and carries the name, propaganda fuels his support, "He's a good Targaryen!". He has what Varys had said one needed "A strong army, a good name.", Jon has no army and his name is Snow. Aegon melts the Iron Throne, the GC arrest Melisandre and burn her and her red-priests alive on the steps of the ruins of the Great Sept of Baelor, which Aegon announces he will rebuild. Coincidentally, a new wall rises a bit north, made of dragon glass, a result of Bran having reached an agreement with the CotF and taken over the NK's mind, which is what the CotF wanted: to take back the control of their protector's circuits. But people don't know that. What a miracle! Winter is no longer advancing! Long live Aegon who freed us from all evils!

9- Sansa marries Aegon. Aegon orders Jaime to be executed, but since Aegon is a good king these sorts of things are no longer done in public. Brienne confronts Sansa about it, but ultimately acquiesce, Sansa has no choice to play her role if she wants to reclaim all she has lost, so Brienne executes Jaime herself with Oathkeeper.

10- Jon is to be executed. He is trialed by Sansa, who is said to have lost so much to him, and is accused of all the terrible things they can throw at him: trialed and executed by the Night Watch for breaking his vows, a wight resurrected by a red priest who burned a child alive to do so, bastard, self-proclaimed King in the North who stole the rightful seat of the heir to Ned Stark (Sansa, since everyone thinks Bran and Rickon are long dead), consort to mad Daenerys and her army of Eunuchs, Dothrakis, Iron Borns, who invaded Westeros with her Dragons, attempted to take the north with the help of wildlings by destroying the wall with her dragons and whose dragon then burned King's Landing, and worst of all: usurper to the throne, having claimed to be Aegon Targaryen himself! Arya demands to execute Jon herself, and she does it by stabbing him in the heart with the pointy end of a dragon glass, to save his life: Jon becomes the new Night King. Bran takes over his mind, wrecks and rises a lot of dead people, but mainly brings Jon back north of the new wall on Theon's ships.

11- There, Jon is told of the new truce, he was the prince who was promised to the children of the forest, their new guardian. Unlike the previous one, he isn't pissed off at them. He has his lover, Daenerys, whom he brings back to life, and their home is the ruined Winterfell, where he is King Beyond the Wall.

12- Tyrion inherits Casterly Rock, his reputation cleaned up, but

And so he spoke, and so he spoke
That Lord of Castamere
And now the rains weep o'er his halls
With no one there to hear

Yes, now the rains weep o'er his halls
And not a soul to hear

 

13- Sansa marries Aegon, and Arya red-weddings them all.

 

Something like that

Seriously?  No, really, Seriously? 

Where to start...............

1- Dany is rejected by the northmen, this was already starting with Glover and also Royce in s7. Dany is told by Bran that her home, where she belongs, is Winterfell, confirming that she won't rule Westeros. On top of that, Bran is the one who reveals Jon is Rhaegar's son. Sansa will be put in a position where she has to force Jon to step down from his King in the North position, probably in part to shenanigans from some of the Northmen and the Vale. She will know Jon is a Targ, and will either use it against him or he'll tell everyone himself and it won't work out. Wildling refugees arrive, doesn't help the situation. Did Daenerys destroy the wall to let them south? Rumors and propaganda takes over. The place is pretty much a powder keg. All it takes is a rock thrown at Dany in front of her dragons for the place to go down in flames, and I believe something like that happens: Dany is murdered by Sansa or those supporting Sansa.

 

Are the Northerners really that incredibly stupid?

First and foremost, There isn't enough time for that to happen, at a maximum, maybe a week or two will transpire between Dany's arrival, and the WW's siege on WF. Word of the Others breaching the wall will arrive much sooner, maybe a day or two after Dany's arrival. There are more than enough people that the Northerners/Sansa trust to put any fears that the threat is real, and it is coming, to rest. For Starters Brienne, the Hound, Beric, and Jon himself all will tell Sansa Dany is the North's only hope. Jorah can also play a part with Lady Mormont, If she (Sansa) can't put aside her petty jealousy for the good of her own people, what good is she as a ruler? Spare me the argument on the Targaryens and the past (although people conveniently forget that they co-existed for 1,000 years in perfect piece). Without Dany, what does dumbass Sansa intend to do? I think if this comes to fruition, Dany should just say "Screw the morons in the North, I am going back South". I would love to see the look on Sansa's face then. So yeah, Sansa should do everything in her power to plot against Jon even though the Norths only chance of survival is in Jons hands. Makes perfect sense........Not. 

Do you even watch the show?

2- All hell breaks loose. Drogon and possibly Rhaegal attacks Winterfell. Some of Dany's followers do too. Winterfell is at war with itself. Eventually everyone has to flee as the NK arrives while the place is already on its knees. They probably lose Rhaegal along the way.

Err, ahh, Ok? did you even watch the trailers?

 

At any rate, the rest is just utter nonsense. 

[21st Century Moose]

5 hours ago, Nowy Tends said:

What a great contribution. If I were you I'd be careful with the word "stupid".

It's true, though. 

Starks do tend to be single-minded, bone-headed, honourable even if it gets them killed, doing the right thing no matter what the consequences, blind to others' conniving, but yet when they get an idea in their heads, they will pursue that idea to the bitter end, no matter what, and only realise what they've caused when it's too late. 

They've all done it; Ned, Robb, Lyanna, Jon, Arya, Sansa, Bran. The only one who hasn't done it is Rickon, and that's probably only because he hasn't done much of anything. 

[T and A]

4 hours ago, Error-504 said:

Seriously?  No, really, Seriously? 

Where to start........

Do you even watch the show?

 

Err, ahh, Ok? did you even watch the trailers?

 

At any rate, the rest is just utter nonsense. 

I was also about to ask the exact same questions. Don't know if trolling, or serious 

[Jô Maltese]

8 hours ago, Risto said:

OK, here we go again...

1. I am yet to see a TV character so fundamentally misunderstood as Sansa Stark is to the writers (...)

Not sure of that... Remember that the writers know what the main characters' arcs are. What many readers and viewers failed to grasp is that Sansa is a main character.

1:27 - Tyrion "<Lady Stark>, you may survive us yet"

[BalerionTheCat]

9 hours ago, NonoNono said:

I think the following happens:

...

Something like that

It's not what will happen. Not even something along the lines. If only because every major character should last until episode 5 or 6. I doubt many would like it. But it's refreshingly new and original fan fiction.

[alienarea]

I expect at least one main character from season 1 to die in the battle of Winterfell (Jaime?), plus some favourites from the last seasons (Thormund?, Beric?, Gendry?, …?).

 

[Rose of Red Lake]

Is no one going to talk about how Sam flat out said Jon can be king, not Dany? That's rumblings of rebellion already. And how Lyanna Mormont, plus the Lady of Winterfell, wants to ensure that Jon is serving the North? Because that's the implication with Sansa's question, are you loyal to the North or to your new girlfriend. Like the story isnt gonna let him have both. Did you bend the knee for DUTY or for LOVE, Jon? I imagine RLJ will encourage the perception that he's Dany's bitchboy even more, so the latter could look more likely. Jon apparently is surprised by this question. Why?

 

[kissdbyfire]

14 hours ago, Risto said:

The biggest issue here is a very simple thing "Sansa and Daenerys have no reason to trust and like each other" but it seems that we can't do that without doing the entire "Sansa is a bitch" dance.

Agree w/ everything you said. But wanted to say that it’s naive at this point to expect anything different. That’s how the show rolls... men bond and make bad cock jokes, and women are always always always catty and mean. Right?

[Error-504]

2 hours ago, alienarea said:

I expect at least one main character from season 1 to die in the battle of Winterfell (Jaime?), plus some favourites from the last seasons (Thormund?, Beric?, Gendry?, …?).

 

Doubtful, in an interview  (Nicolas Coster-Waldo) Jamie is on record as saying he was filming right up until the end. While he did not claim to be in the final scene, he implied it would be close. 

[kissdbyfire]

2 minutes ago, Error-504 said:

Doubtful, in an interview  (Nicolas Coster-Waldo) Jamie is on record as saying he was filming right up until the end. While he did not claim to be in the final scene, he implied it would be close. 

They also made it clear in that interview that they didn’t shoot in sequence. So, even though NCW was shooting scenes up until almost the show wrapped up, that doesn’t mean these scenes are for the final episode(s). 

[Error-504]

31 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

Is no one going to talk about how Sam flat out said Jon can be king, not Dany? That's rumblings of rebellion already. And how Lyanna Mormont, plus the Lady of Winterfell, wants to ensure that Jon is serving the North? Because that's the implication with Sansa's question, are you loyal to the North or to your new girlfriend. Like the story isnt gonna let him have both. Did you bend the knee for DUTY or for LOVE, Jon? I imagine RLJ will encourage the perception that he's Dany's bitchboy even more, so the latter could look more likely. Jon apparently is surprised by this question. Why?

 

Is no one going to talk about how Sam flat out said Jon can be king, not Dany?

Jon would actually want to be the king in order for that to happen. Nothing in his past suggests he would. So unless he is convinced Dany would be a terrible ruler, then I don't see this becoming an issue. 

That's rumblings of rebellion already.

pffft. 

And how Lyanna Mormont, plus the Lady of Winterfell, wants to ensure that Jon is serving the North? Because that's the implication with Sansa's question, are you loyal to the North or to your new girlfriend.

Simple mindedness, why do the two have to be mutually exclusive? Dany has already proven to be a valuable ally against the NK, and an enemy of Cersei's. All this chatter about what might happen if Dany were to be king (assuming they make it past the WW's) is pure speculation. What we do know is that if Cersei were to remain Queen, eventually she would declare war on the North. This is a fact. To BOTH problems Dany proves a valuable ally. Dany has already brought up the arrangement that Torrhen Stark made with Aegon that lasted over 1,000 years. Jon would be just the type to see the wisdom in this arrangement, and so should Sansa:

"My ancestor, King Torrhen Stark, marched the North down to the Trident and beheld Aegon's army, larger than Torrhen's own by half and with three dragons circling overhead. Many northern bannermen wanted to attack anyway, claiming northern valor would carry the day. Others wanted to fall back to Moat Cailin and make a stand there. But Torrhen had heard how the armies of the Rock and the Reach had burned on the Field of Fire and had seen the fires still glowing beneath the rubble of Harrenhal. He knelt and laid his ancient crown as Aegon's feet and rose as a king no more but Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North. Some Northerners still sneer at my ancestor as "The King who Knelt", forgetting that because of Torrhen they're alive today to sneer. Their ancestors didn't leave their burned bones at the Trident and their twisted swords didn't fill Aegon's new throne."

―Sansa Stark^[src]

Did you bend the knee for DUTY or for LOVE, Jon? I imagine RLJ will encourage the perception that he's Dany's bitchboy even more, so the latter could look more likely.

 

Where did Jon's loyalty fall with Ygritte? As for Duty, or Love, what about gratitude? People sure do have convenient memories. 

Jon didn't bend the knee after boat sex. He bent the knee after he seen the sacrifice Dany made to save his people. He bent the knee after Dany had pledged her support to save and fight for the north without her requiring Jon to bend the knee. In other words, Jon bent the knee after Dany showed she was worthy. People can argue Jon was already in love at this point, and I will say prior to this it was just an attraction/infatuation. 

I imagine RLJ will encourage the perception that he's Dany's bitchboy even more, so the latter could look more likely. Jon apparently is surprised by this question. Why?

Would'nt RLJ flip the tables and make Dany Jons well, you said it not me. I love how people keep making this out to be this huge thing, Dany/Jon, northern independence, etc. Are you not paying attention to the current situation? A force like no other is about to rain hell down on the North, and yet all the Northerners can do is fret about what to do after they win that battle, as if that is a foregone conclusion (to us yes, but to them, no way). It just wouldn't work this way, and while I am sure D&D will make a big deal about it on the show, that in itself is bad writing catering to fans. It would be like Jons forces bitching about the Vale that came to bail them out during the BOB's. Lunacy. 

Another thing about Dany, people with convenient memories forget. When Dany was pregnant with Kal Drogos child, she was perfectly happy with the fact Drogo was in charge, and she was carrying the "stallion that shall mount the world". Why do you not think she would do the same with Jon? Was kal Drogo Dany's "bitchboy" as well? 

[Error-504]

1 hour ago, kissdbyfire said:

They also made it clear in that interview that they didn’t shoot in sequence. So, even though NCW was shooting scenes up until almost the show wrapped up, that doesn’t mean these scenes are for the final episode(s). 

But he was paid for 6 episodes, and while your technically correct, he certainly did imply that his character would be around until very close to the end. 

https://www.harpersbazaar.com/culture/film-tv/a22865511/nikolaj-coster-waldau-game-of-thrones-season-8-salary/

 

Correction: A previous version of this article said Coster-Waldau would only appear in four episodes of Game of Thrones' final season. He will actually appear in all six, and this article has been updated with this information.

https://bgr.com/2019/03/20/game-of-thrones-season-8-spoilers-will-jaime-lannister-live-or-die/

 

“I am proud to have been on a show that has had this kind of impact and success,” Coster-Waldau told Star 2. “And relief that it has come to an end in the way that (showrunners) David Benioff and DB Weiss had wanted it to.”

 

 

“I find Jaime so interesting,” he went on to say about the character who he played for eight seasons on the HBO show. “The core of this guy is that he does what he does in the name of love. He’s a complex guy.”

“That’s the key to Game Of Thrones, the characters are never just black and white. Even though his story is set in this fantastical world and his circumstances are extreme, he is relatable.”

The actor mentioned his final scene without spoiling what actually happens: “I had a great last scene. It was absolutely beautiful. It was the perfect way to end.” However, he did say the scene was towards the end, which means we’ll see plenty of Jaime in the upcoming season.

“Obviously I can’t tell you what the scene was. It wasn't the final scene (of the series), but it was close to the end, and it was shot at a beautiful location,” the actor said, revealing that other cast members finished their filming for season 8 before him. “At this point, I had seen quite a lot of colleagues wrap, so I had seen a lot of tears, beautiful speeches, and I knew what to expect.”

 

I don't think Winterfell qualifies. 

 

[Error-504]

How does Tormund feel about bending the knee?

A little foreshadowing before Jon did just what Tormund suggested. 

 

And no that Jon is about to find out that Dany is really his aunt, well we have Jamie conveniently coming to Wf to offer Jon's his take on the matter:

 

[Error-504]

As for the bittersweat ending, perhaps we fast forward several months to see Dany dieing during childbirth, to give birth to the prince that was promised. I mean, isn't this what happens quite often? 

[NonoNono]

S7 had Glover and Royce essentially plotting and/or commenting against Jon and Dany and want Sansa to rule, Royce probably because he wants her to marry Robyn.

Dany has dragons, Dothrakis, Unsullied, Iron Borns, and soon Wildlings to her side. She has no reason to be welcomed by the north, and the place is literally a powder keg ready to explode. All it takes is a rock thrown at Dany in front of her dragons and the next thing you know everyone wants revenge due to the escalation that would ensue, leading to complete chaos before the NK even shows up. Drogon burns the rock thrower, people freak out, attack the dragons or flee, Sansa panics at what is happening on her turf, Dany is told to take her dragons away, etc. And all it takes is one person to stab Dany, any random angry northener.

"You can't trust a Targaryen or a Lannister" Royce, s7

You better hope Robyn doesn't show up asking for Sansa's hand, it would get awkward.

They did everything they could in the trailer to hide who they are fighting against, yet it should not be a surprise, who else could it be than the WW? But it's because they are fighting each other.

Sansa is Littlefinger's figurative heir, don't forget it.