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Rant & Rave Season 8 [Spoilers]: When you are cool like a cucumber, as evil as the mother of madness, but never as perfect as the pet!

The Fattest Leech

By The Fattest Leech,
in General (GoT)

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SeanF Council Member

SeanF

Posted
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On 12/20/2019 at 6:12 PM, The Dragon Demands said:

Hey, I need help: I’m working on a thorough analysis of which parts of the tv show. An be formally ruled out as not actually happening in the real story of the books.

Others have done their own before this, but mine are based largely on researching points when Benioff and Weiss stupidly admit “this was our idea”.

But as quick research, can you list off all formal books vs tv show analysis (“will this happen?”) that you can find?  YouTube videos, long form essays, etc.

A LOT of so-called analysis channels on YouTube simply shut down after season 8 - all they did was “entertaining theorization” and not measured analysis.

i.e. GoTAcademy was nearly the only YouTube channel to point out, specifically, that Benioff saying “we’ve known that Arya would kill the Night King for three years now” means it isn’t what Martin told them will happen in the books.

basic conclusion, but so many channels are in...literal shock, that they can’t even articulate stuff like that:  “will Daenerys go mad in the books?” “ will bran be king?”

 

 

 

You can rule out:-

1.  Dany burning Kings Landing via Drogon.  He's nowhere near big enough in the books.  There's a far more obvious candidate for someone being triggered by the sound of bells (Jon Con), who regrets not having burned a city to kill Robert Baratheon.

2.  Dany fighting Cersei.  Arianne will be her female antagonist

3.  Arya killing the Night King.  He does not exist in the books.

4.  Arya sailing  West.  That's Elissa Farman's story

5.  Bronn becoming Master of Coin and Lord of Highgarden.

6.  Sam becoming Grand Maester and Lord of Horn Hill.

7.  The "secret annulment" of Rhaegar's marriage to Elia.  There's no such thing as a secret annulment.

8.  Tyrion becoming a pacifist.

9.  Varys betraying Dany.  He's committed to fAegon.

10.  The Wight  hunt nonsense.

11.  Jon betraying Daenerys.  It's possible she has to die to defeat the Others, but otherwise, the kinslayer curse is an enormous taboo.

12.  Stannis turning evil and burning Shireen.

13.  Ellaria Sand murdering Doran, Trystane, and Myrcella.

14.  Barristan being killed in a street brawl.

15.  Arya massacring the Freys.  That's Lady Stoneheart and Lord Manderly.

16. Sansa marrying Ramsay Bolton.  That's Jeyne Poole.

17.  Dany pursuing idiotic military strategies in Westeros.

 

 

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The Dragon Demands Council Member

The Dragon Demands

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I meant just a few big channels.  Westeros.org did their own.  I just wanted to see if other channels had ideas I didn't already....

Really the only things I consider even remotely possible or worth discussion:

  • Jon kills Daenerys in some fashion (probable.  Azor Ahai)
  • Daenerys goes crazy and evil (improbable)
  • Bran becomes king on the Iron Throne (implausible)
  • Arya travels west of Westeros...for some reason (....implausible, but possible)

    Everything else i reject out of hand.
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Le Cygne Council Member

Le Cygne

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On 12/23/2019 at 4:15 PM, SeanF said:

You can rule out:-

1.  Dany burning Kings Landing via Drogon.  He's nowhere near big enough in the books.  There's a far more obvious candidate for someone being triggered by the sound of bells (Jon Con), who regrets not having burned a city to kill Robert Baratheon.

2.  Dany fighting Cersei.  Arianne will be her female antagonist

3.  Arya killing the Night King.  He does not exist in the books.

4.  Arya sailing  West.  That's Elissa Farman's story

5.  Bronn becoming Master of Coin and Lord of Highgarden.

6.  Sam becoming Grand Maester and Lord of Horn Hill.

7.  The "secret annulment" of Rhaegar's marriage to Elia.  There's no such thing as a secret annulment.

8.  Tyrion becoming a pacifist.

9.  Varys betraying Dany.  He's committed to fAegon.

10.  The Wight  hunt nonsense.

11.  Jon betraying Daenerys.  It's possible she has to die to defeat the Others, but otherwise, the kinslayer curse is an enormous taboo.

12.  Stannis turning evil and burning Shireen.

13.  Ellaria Sand murdering Doran, Trystane, and Myrcella.

14.  Barristan being killed in a street brawl.

15.  Arya massacring the Freys.  That's Lady Stoneheart and Lord Manderly.

16. Sansa marrying Ramsay Bolton.  That's Jeyne Poole.

17.  Dany pursuing idiotic military strategies in Westeros.

Good list!

To 11, I would add GRRM is not going to do a matchy matchy stabby stabby, that would be asinine (aka only something Benioff and Weiss would do). And to 16, they said what they did with Sansa is a bold departure and GRRM said he had no idea what they were doing and was sad that they did it.

Sansa will likely will dovetail with Lady Stoneheart, as will Jaime and Brienne and Sandor, all four characters lost their story and ended up as props in D&D fanfic. GRRM has always said Lady Stoneheart is essential to the story, and strongly objected to them cutting her from the show.

I think most of the show was with substitutes as you pointed out, and an abomination based on their own lack of understanding of the human condition and inability to tell a story with any meaning whatsoever. They are like the Bass-O-Matic of ASOIAF - an unholy mess came out.

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SeanF Council Member

SeanF

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41 minutes ago, Le Cygne said:

Good list!

To 11, I would add GRRM is not going to do a matchy matchy stabby stabby, that would be asinine (aka only something Benioff and Weiss would do). And to 16, they said what they did with Sansa is a bold departure and GRRM said he had no idea what they were doing and was sad that they did it.

Sansa will likely will dovetail with Lady Stoneheart, as will Jaime and Brienne and Sandor, all four characters lost their story and ended up as props in D&D fanfic. GRRM has always said Lady Stoneheart is essential to the story, and strongly objected to them cutting her from the show.

I think most of the show was with substitutes as you pointed out, and an abomination based on their own lack of understanding of the human condition and inability to tell a story with any meaning whatsoever. They are like the Bass-O-Matic of ASOIAF - an unholy mess came out.

I suppose if the endgame is fAegon/Arianne v Daenerys, (as opposed to the battle against the Others) there's always the chance the fAegon actually kills Daenerys, as Aegon II did Rhaenyra.  Perhaps then Jon kills fAegon, but has to take the Black again for killing a king (similar to the people who were sentenced by Creggan Stark for killing Aegon II).

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Angel Eyes Council Member

Angel Eyes

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A general problem I had with the North in the last two seasons: why were they so hell-bent on keeping their independence in the face of the White Walkers? Did they honestly think they could go it alone with nothing that works against White Walkers?

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Lady Fevre Dream Council Member

Lady Fevre Dream

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Hello Ranters,

Belated Holiday Greetings to All:  I was wondering, did anyone receive any GOT DVDs, from goodhearted friends or family thinking it would make a great gift?  I have to admit, I'm surprised a few relatives didn't try that on me, LOL 

Well, I'm off to catch up a bit on the last couple of pages, so........again, Happy Holidays!!  I am dying to know if someone received DVDs they don't know what to do with, LOL

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Lady Fevre Dream Council Member

Lady Fevre Dream

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On 12/6/2019 at 2:34 PM, SeanF said:

Ultimately, it's like trying to put lipstick on a pig.

One can't rationalise the irrational.  I guess I'm just scratching the surface, but taking Seasons 7 & 8 together, why did:-

1. Cersei face no consequences for blowing up the Great Sept?

2.  Tyrion give consistently useless advice to Dany?

3.  Tyrion trust Cersei to the end?

4. Cersei show no evidence of pregnancy?

5. Drogon fly past the Wall at the speed of Concorde?

6. Dany burn down a city for no military purpose?

7.  Jaime's redemption arc go nowhere?

8. The Branbot become king?

9. Sam become Grand Maester with no qualifications?

10.  Dany forget the Iron Fleet, despite talking about it a few days previously?

11.  Jon give up his crown to Dany, after she offered to aid the North and waive her claim?

12.  Jon subsequently blame Dany before his lords for making him bend the knee?

13. Bronn become Master of Coin with no qualifications?

14. Grey Worm not kill Jon?

15.  The Branbot fail to warn Dany and Jon of dangers?

16.  Arya become a xenophobe?

17.  The lords all agree to Northern independence?

18.  Jon become a treacherous coward?

19.  The lords allow Tyrion, a prisoner, to address them?

20. Varys broadcast treason at the top of his voice?

21. Ser Davos propose that a eunuch found a great House?

etc.

 

 

 

 

 

LOLOL  All in all, I am thinking that Davos' bid for Grey Worm and his Eunich army to found a HOUSE might be the biggest WTF of all.  Like really, WTF??  If they were trying to piss Grey Worm off, maybe it might have made sense, but WTF?? 

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SeanF Council Member

SeanF

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11 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

A general problem I had with the North in the last two seasons: why were they so hell-bent on keeping their independence in the face of the White Walkers? Did they honestly think they could go it alone with nothing that works against White Walkers?

It's very much a second or third order issue, whether the local ruler gets to be called Warden or Queen, in the face of a zombie invasion.

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Lady Fevre Dream Council Member

Lady Fevre Dream

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On 12/23/2019 at 12:31 PM, The Dragon Demands said:

Game of Thrones | Season 8 Episode 6 | Inside the Episode (Supercut of Benioff & Weiss clips)

@Ran

 

This compilation is very helpful, thank you.  With the holidays, taking care of my mother with a hip replacement, and my absolute refusal to buy this DVD stuff LOL, this Inside the Epi that you've put together is much appreciated.  Thank you. 

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Le Cygne Council Member

Le Cygne

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On the Golden Globes:

It’s clear by now that showrunners David Benioff and DB Weiss had no clue what they were doing, and once George R.R. Martin’s prose came to an end, instead of reaching out for help, or handing off the show to someone new so that it could be wrapped up in a reasonable number of episodes (several more seasons), they squandered everything they worked so hard to create and gave us pure, unadulterated garbage television... It ended as one of the greatest disappointments in television history. As far as I’m concerned, being snubbed by the Hollywood Foreign Press Association (the HFPA runs the Golden Globes) is just exactly what should happen when a show tries to wrap up too fast just so its creators can move on to other projects.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2019/12/12/game-of-thrones-deserved-to-be-snubbed-at-the-golden-globes/

On the "we didn't want it to end" lie:

Fans weren’t unhappy simply because the show came to an end, they were unhappy because it deserved a better ending, and it needed more time to get there in a way that felt natural instead of rushed or forced. They were unhappy because so many of the plot points the show built toward over the years, so many of the breadcrumb trails we followed, led to nothing, or to bizarre head-fakes. They—we—are angry still because we don’t understand why the showrunners gave up on something so special. It’s one of the most baffling decisions in modern television and I don’t think I’ll ever truly understand.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2019/12/18/peter-dinklage-is-wrong-about-why-fans-didnt-like-season-8-of-game-of-thrones/

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