Soylent Brown Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 33 minutes ago, Chaircat Meow said: I voted liberal in 2019 despite voting Tory in every previous election and believing strongly Corbyn would be a disaster to try and stop Brexit. I meant Leavers in general, rather than Tories specifically. I imagine the absolute worst of the leavers, the poo de la poo, probably stood by their man Nige in the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 3 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said: I'm not 100% certain the last one is all good news. He wants gone before new year, possibly because he knows shit is going to hit the fan, and he probably knows that by not being an actual govt official, and not being elected he has Teflon on him so no shit will stick on him as long as he goes before it starts flying. So much this. I think it is pretty clear that Cummings' plan has been, for some while, to ensure a no deal Brexit and then to promptly exit so that he can disclaim any responsibility for what happens afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 22 minutes ago, A wilding said: So much this. I think it is pretty clear that Cummings' plan has been, for some while, to ensure a no deal Brexit and then to promptly exit so that he can disclaim any responsibility for what happens afterwards. No. What is clear is that Cummings and team were brought on for the explicit reason to deliver Brexit and to make sure its happened (god knows why you think he wants a no deal Brexit, it baffles me some of the things people say on here). Obviously Cummings presence causes quite a lot of consternation and tension around No. 10 and what seems to be the case is that when Lee Cain was being promoted to Chief of Staff there was a big backlash by those in the Tory party who suddenly realised he could be there long term. I think many of them understood the need for the Vote Leave team during Brexit negotiations, but they also realised that Cummings is not a Tory, he doesn't even like the Tories, he hates pretty much everyone in politics and doesn't actually care whether the Tories are in power or not. He just goes in to do a project. It's just unfortunate that he is so abrasive that it probably was destined to failure. So after Brexit is done, they expected him to go. It's not surprising he is going now. Again I find the hatred of Cummings a little odd, as someone who tends to understand public anger against bankers and the establishment better than pretty much any politician, he should be right up a few peoples streets. His pathological dislike of politics and politicians is something we can all empathise with too. I also think many of his ambitions for this country were some of the most interesting I've read for a while, and he actually had some sort of vision, unlike someone like Boris who is just a blustering fool swaying one way and another in a desperate attempt to get people to like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted November 13, 2020 Author Share Posted November 13, 2020 1 hour ago, A wilding said: So much this. I think it is pretty clear that Cummings' plan has been, for some while, to ensure a no deal Brexit and then to promptly exit so that he can disclaim any responsibility for what happens afterwards. Cummings has a sort of technological neoliberal vision for Britain post-Brexit which is extraordinarily unrealistic (and about 20 years too late; we're never, ever going to create an equivalent to Google or Facebook from scratch now) and unachievable, and I think he's gradually been coming round to realising that, and that Britain outside the EU, with a somewhat indifferent US government in place, is going to be in a very difficult position for some years to come. Being grilled by the media he despises in the Number 10 garden I don't think helped his state of mind either. He's off, likely to resurface working in the States or maybe doing something with Farage later on, or the inevitable Tory "privatise the NHS" scheme that will now become a key goal of many on the hard right of the party. Looking at Cummings' position and some of the things Farage and Johnson have been saying about Britain being outside the EU and having to accept conditions from them without being in a position to shape or direct or veto that policy like we could when we were in, and they're almost making the same arguments as Remain did to stay in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, Werthead said: I think he's gradually been coming round to realising that, and that Britain outside the EU, with a somewhat indifferent US government in place, is going to be in a very difficult position for some years to come. Being grilled by the media he despises in the Number 10 garden I don't think helped his state of mind either. He's off, likely to resurface working in the States or maybe doing something with Farage later on, or the inevitable Tory "privatise the NHS" scheme that will now become a key goal of many on the hard right of the party. Any evidence for any of this.. or anything you have claimed in the last couple of pages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 19 minutes ago, Heartofice said: Any evidence for any of this.. or anything you have claimed in the last couple of pages? Seeing as you never show anyone your pots, why should anyone show you their kettles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, Spockydog said: Seeing as you never show anyone your pots, why should anyone show you their kettles? Nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 @Werthead I think we are in approximate agreement. @Heartofice Are you really saying that Cummings doesn't care what sort of Brexit we have? Or that he thinks that his personal opinion is immaterial and he should just obey the instructions of his political masters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, A wilding said: @Werthead I think we are in approximate agreement. @Heartofice Are you really saying that Cummings doesn't care what sort of Brexit we have? Or that he thinks that his personal opinion is immaterial and he should just obey the instructions of his political masters? Why would I be saying that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soylent Brown Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Heartofice said: No. What is clear is that Cummings and team were brought on for the explicit reason to deliver Brexit and to make sure its happened (god knows why you think he wants a no deal Brexit, it baffles me some of the things people say on here). Obviously Cummings presence causes quite a lot of consternation and tension around No. 10 and what seems to be the case is that when Lee Cain was being promoted to Chief of Staff there was a big backlash by those in the Tory party who suddenly realised he could be there long term. I think many of them understood the need for the Vote Leave team during Brexit negotiations, but they also realised that Cummings is not a Tory, he doesn't even like the Tories, he hates pretty much everyone in politics and doesn't actually care whether the Tories are in power or not. He just goes in to do a project. It's just unfortunate that he is so abrasive that it probably was destined to failure. So after Brexit is done, they expected him to go. It's not surprising he is going now. Again I find the hatred of Cummings a little odd, as someone who tends to understand public anger against bankers and the establishment better than pretty much any politician, he should be right up a few peoples streets. His pathological dislike of politics and politicians is something we can all empathise with too. I also think many of his ambitions for this country were some of the most interesting I've read for a while, and he actually had some sort of vision, unlike someone like Boris who is just a blustering fool swaying one way and another in a desperate attempt to get people to like him. Out of interest, how many posters of Cummings do you have on your bedroom wall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Heartofice said: Why would I be saying that? Because when I said Cummings wants a no deal Brexit, you said "No. What is clear is that Cummings and team were brought on for the explicit reason to deliver Brexit and to make sure its happened" So you seem to think that Cummings' personal Brexit beliefs are somehow irrelevant. (Or perhaps even that he actually would prefer a soft Brexit?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 Cummings to leave No 10 with immediate effect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 13 minutes ago, A wilding said: Cummings to leave No 10 with immediate effect That escalated quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denvek Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 Who's going to tell Boris how to make everyone like him now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 5 minutes ago, Denvek said: Who's going to tell Boris how to make everyone like him now? To be fair, I suspect Cummings still has a few strings tied to Boris. As he insists, he’s not resigning. He probably just considers himself working from home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 He and his fucking weirdos were toast the moment Trump lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 8 minutes ago, Spockydog said: He and his fucking weirdos were toast the moment Trump lost. Eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 27 minutes ago, A wilding said: Cummings to leave No 10 with immediate effect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Which Tyler Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 Just when you thought this government couldn't get more twisted and dysfunctional, a self-proclaimed racist and 'hostile environment' advocate, is appointed to the Equality & Human Rights Commission to oversee the investigation into The Windrush scandal. Yes you read that right. https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/ehrc-uk-racism-watchdog-david-goodhart-hostile-environment https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/nov/13/campaigners-criticise-senior-ehrc-appointment-david-goodhart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted November 13, 2020 Share Posted November 13, 2020 Of course the Guardian thinks David Goodhart is a racist! Of course it does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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